LBJs yet again!

Cacher123 · **Posted:** Mon Jun 26, 2006 10:06 pm

Quote:

According to my mechanic Moog Chassis Parts makes pretty much all of the OEM ball joints found in American autos. Chances are the OEM LBJs in the KJ are Moog too, they just don't stamp it on the part.

BUT I'm sure IF Moog makes the stock ones, they are making them to DCs specs. It would make sense for them to have an "upgraded" one as they don't have to build the upgraded ones to a price spec set by DC. They can charge what is appropriate for the heavier part. It's DCs responsibility to see that the part they are having outsourced is up to the task spec wise of what they are using it for. Obviously that isn't the case here. However, if Moog is indeed making the part and is cutting corners on the manufacture, that would be a different story and they would share some of the liability for failures.

Wahoo650 · **Posted:** Tue Jun 27, 2006 8:14 am

Well, my dealer came through for me again. Got the Libby in and out in one day, replaced both LBJ's, new wheel and fender liner on order, o other damage. They confirmed that since this was under the recall, the LBJ's would be covered for lifetime. So now I just have to remember to say "inspect the LBJ's" every single it's at the dealer.

I had planned on keeping it at least 3-4 more years, but I'm starting to think differently. Let's see how the next 6 mos. go.

Thanks again for everyone's help.

Matt

Cacher123 · **Posted:** Tue Jun 27, 2006 10:39 am

Quote:

They confirmed that since this was under the recall, the LBJ's would be covered for lifetime. So now I just have to remember to say "inspect the LBJ's" every single it's at the dealer.

I had planned on keeping it at least 3-4 more years, but I'm starting to think differently. Let's see how the next 6 mos. go.

Wow! Exactly my situation.

waddy whiteguts · **Posted:** Tue Jun 27, 2006 6:51 pm

Cacher123 wrote:

Quote:

According to my mechanic Moog Chassis Parts makes pretty much all of the OEM ball joints found in American autos. Chances are the OEM LBJs in the KJ are Moog too, they just don't stamp it on the part.

BUT I'm sure IF Moog makes the stock ones, they are making them to DCs specs. It would make sense for them to have an "upgraded" one as they don't have to build the upgraded ones to a price spec set by DC. They can charge what is appropriate for the heavier part. It's DCs responsibility to see that the part they are having outsourced is up to the task spec wise of what they are using it for. Obviously that isn't the case here. However, if Moog is indeed making the part and is cutting corners on the manufacture, that would be a different story and they would share some of the liability for failures.

That's what I meant but wasn't able to elaborate.

He said that Moog Chassis basically makes two grades of ball joint for most light trucks and SUVs, the heavy duty serviceable (greaseable) unit and the OEM non serviceable unit. He said the auto manufacturers buy the non serviceable parts and the serviceables are for the aftermarket and specialty market. When I asked him to replace my LBJs he looked up the part and asked me if I wanted the OEM style or the serviceable style, both were Moog parts. Of course I was after the heavy duty LBJ

KJFROG · **Posted:** Tue Jun 27, 2006 7:27 pm

Just a ?, my local dealer said there is no recall on my ball joints, is that because it's a canadian version? (sounds like a stupid question) but mine seem fine (so far 34000 km on it)

Wahoo650 · **Posted:** Wed Jun 28, 2006 5:55 am

My understanding is that the recall was technically only for the 2002 models. It was issued in November of '02. The current NHTSA Engineering analysis will no doubt lead to a much broader recall that should include all current model years due to all of them having reported failures. This is why it's important to go to the NHTSA site and file a complaint if yours fail.

Matt

snowsport · **Joined:** Tue Oct 18, 2005 11:52 pm **Posts:** 1211

KJFROG wrote:

Just a ?, my local dealer said there is no recall on my ball joints, is that because it's a canadian version? (sounds like a stupid question) but mine seem fine (so far 34000 km on it)

Nah, mine was recalled for LBJs. 2003 sport bought in Canada. I haven't heard of a Canadian version but there might be I guess, IDK. I doubt if our KJs have better LBJs than any others.

Se7enLC · **Posted:** Wed Jun 28, 2006 11:08 am

snowsport wrote:

KJFROG wrote:

Just a ?, my local dealer said there is no recall on my ball joints, is that because it's a canadian version? (sounds like a stupid question) but mine seem fine (so far 34000 km on it)

Nah, mine was recalled for LBJs. 2003 sport bought in Canada. I haven't heard of a Canadian version but there might be I guess, IDK. I doubt if our KJs have better LBJs than any others.

There isn't a ball joint recall. There is a recall to add a heat shield and (if needed) replace the ball joints that failed due to the melted boot. No recall to replace the ball joint, and when they do replace a damaged one, it is replaced with the same part.

Anybody who has had their ball joint replaced at D/C's expense had it done under warranty, not as a recall. ( or as a result of going in to have the heat shield added ). Newer KJs have the heat shield already added, so the BJ has no recalls at all.

KJFROG · **Posted:** Wed Jun 28, 2006 11:59 am

Thanx, for the info, better to be safe than sorry

Wahoo650 · **Posted:** Thu Jun 29, 2006 6:55 am

I beg to differ... straight from the horses mouth (NHTSA):

Make / Models : Model/Build Years:
JEEP / LIBERTY 2002-2003

Type: ANY
Recall Number: 03V460000
Summary:
ON CERTAIN SPORT UTILITY VEHICLES, THE LOWER CONTROL ARM BALL JOINTS CAN EXPERIENCE A LOSS OF LUBRICATION THAT CAN LEAD TO CORROSION, ACCELERATED WEAR, AND POSSIBLE SEPARATION FROM THE STEERING KNUCKLE.
Consequence:
A BALL JOINT THATHAS SEPARATED FROM THE KNUCKLE COULD RESULT IN LOSS OF VEHICLE DIRECTIONAL CONTROL AND COULD RESULT IN A CRASH.
Remedy:
DEALERS WILL REPLACE THE FRONT LOWER CONTROL ARM BALL JOINTS WITH MODIFIED ASSEMBLIES AND HEAT SHIELDS ON VEHICLES BUILT BETWEEN JANUARY 2, 2001 AND OCTOBER 4, 2002. ON VEHICLES BUILT BETWEEN OCTOBER 5, 2002 AND MARCH 26, 2003, DEALERS WILL INSPECT THE BALL JOINT ASSEMBLIES (AND REPLACE THEM AS NECESSARY) AND INSTALL HEAT SHIELDS. OWNER NOTIFICATION BEGAN ON DECEMBER 15, 2003. OWNERS SHOULD CONTACT DAIMLERCHRYSLER AT 1-800-992-1997.
Notes:
DAIMLERCHRYSLER RECALL NO. C36. CUSTOMERS CAN ALSO CONTACT THE NATIONAL HIGHWAY TRAFFIC SAFETY ADMINISTRATION’S AUTO SAFETY HOTLINE AT 1-888-DASH-2-DOT (1-888-327-4236).

I hope this clarifies the current recall status for everyone. Remember if you have a model year not listed here and your dealer isn't a good one you could be out of luck. That's why it is very important that everyone with a premature failure files a complaint with the NHTSA. They are currently performing and Engineering analysis, which very likely will lead to an expanded version of this recall.

Matt

Cacher123 · **Posted:** Thu Jun 29, 2006 7:26 pm

Both of you guys are right! Technically, there was not a recall on the ball joint - let me explain.... The "service bulletin" was to add the heat shield TO PREVENT ball joint failure. HOWEVER, if the ball joint had failed or "suffered premature wear" it was replaced at the time the heat shields were added. That is why many people believe there was a recall on the ball joints. They were actually fixed under the "heat shield" bulletin. Now, my dlr told me that since there was a "recall" on the ball joints, they would be replaced for life. He is also under the assumption of a recall. Obviously, the dlrs know that the ball joints are bad. As long as mine says that they are covered, I'm not gonna argue the semantics of it with him! The "modified assemblies" that the NHTSA complaint talks about is in fact the ball joints with the shields.

saxdogg · **Joined:** Fri Jun 02, 2006 7:26 pm **Posts:** 199

That's interesting because my dealer told me just today that once a recall was performed, that was it...no more re-do's...

Anyone talk to DC about this?

RFCRD · **Posted:** Thu Jun 29, 2006 9:54 pm

saxdogg wrote:

That's interesting because my dealer told me just today that once a recall was performed, that was it...no more re-do's...

Anyone talk to DC about this?

Probably depends more on what, if any warranty is remaining on your Jeep. BTW, had both my LBJ's done this week @ 14,500 miles. Very unsettling as it's only been in service for 9 months and I drive almost entirely expressway.

saxdogg · **Joined:** Fri Jun 02, 2006 7:26 pm **Posts:** 199

Well, true...I guess if ppl have it done 3 times while in 3/36 bumper 2 bumper, they would say it's "lifetime"...lifetime if you're under 36k miles!!!

Cacher123 · **Posted:** Thu Jun 29, 2006 11:44 pm

Quote:

lifetime if you're under 36k miles!!!

Not true! I have 54k and over 3 yrs on mine and the dlr replaced them. He stated "Lifetime" since there was a recall.

saxdogg · **Joined:** Fri Jun 02, 2006 7:26 pm **Posts:** 199

just repeating what my dealer said...recalls aren't lifetime re-do's...do once and done. That's why I'm wondering if anyone has confirmed this w/ DC???

jp

Wahoo650 · **Posted:** Fri Jun 30, 2006 7:36 am

My dealer stands behind the "Lifetime for this vehicle" due to the recall. And it was a recall - that is a copy of the NHTSA recall bulletin that I posted earlier. But as it states on the recall, it is very specific as to build dates affected. All others are under the DC "Tech bulletin" which has nothing to do with the NHTSA. Not to sound like a broken record... any one with a Liberty outside of the build dates listed on the actual recall that has had premature ball joint failure needs to file a complaint with the NHTSA if we ever hope to have DCX take care of this. Otherwise the dealers can do as they like.

The complaint doesn't mean you aren't happy with DCX or your dealers service, or that they covered it, you are simply stating that the vehicle has a defect.

Matt

LBJs yet again!

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