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 Post subject: UPPER Ball Joints
PostPosted: Sat Jul 05, 2008 5:52 pm 
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I read in one of the jeep magazines this weekend (JP? - I'm not home to look it up) that NHTSA was looking into the UPPER Ball Joints seperating. Anyone have any more info on this?

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PostPosted: Tue Aug 05, 2008 7:12 am 
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Has anyone heard anything new on this? I searched the web and could only find the original notice that the NHTSA was investigating for the 2002/2003 model years. My '02 goes in for the passenger side replacement today :cry: . It was fine 6 mos. ago when I rotated tires, now it's got at least 1/4" of play in it-scared the crap out of me when I found it! I was inspecting the install job Sears did on my Rancho's (install was fine, but they missed this?) Has 81,000 miles on it so I don't think it's necessarily a premature failure, but the drivers side is still nice and tight, leaves me wondering... and if there's a chance of getting it done free... :D

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Aug 05, 2008 7:16 pm 
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Feds Upgrade Investigation of Jeep Liberty for Upper Ball-Joint Failures
Date posted: 04-22-2008

WASHINGTON — After receiving at least 22 consumer complaints about the 2002-'03 Jeep Liberty, the National Highway Traffic Safety Administration has upgraded its probe of the SUV to an "engineering analysis."

The investigation involves more than 300,000 four-wheel-drive SUVs. "The separation of an upper ball joint on either of the front wheels can result in the affected front wheel collapsing, possibly resulting in vehicle disablement and causing a loss of vehicle control," according to the NHTSA's defects investigations summary on its Web site.

Such a probe is often the step that precedes a vehicle recall.

The summary ticks off a number of dramatic incidents with the aforementioned Liberty models. "There is one complaint of a failure at 75 mph, one failure at 60 mph, three failures at 40 mph, two failures at 25 mph," said the NHTSA. "Seven failures occurring while the driver was pulling into the flow of traffic and two failures that occurred when the driver was attempting to make a left turn across the flow of oncoming traffic.

"One complainant alleged almost being hit by an oncoming truck as a result of the vehicle suddenly being disabled in the flow of cross traffic."

Chrysler is said to be "continuing to investigate the cause of upper ball-joint separations in the subject vehicles."

The Jeep Liberty has been recalled two other times from the same model years to fix a front suspension lower ball joint that had a tendency to loosen.

What this means to you: If you own one of the aforementioned Jeep Liberty models, it probably wouldn't hurt to have your dealer take a look at it. — Anita Lienert, Correspondent

http://www.edmunds.com/insideline/do/News/articleId=125875

I love that quote "had a tendency to loosen" - How about "spontaneously destruct!"

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Last edited by Cacher123 on Tue Aug 05, 2008 11:18 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Aug 05, 2008 7:45 pm 
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Cacher123 wrote:
"Feds Upgrade Investigation of Jeep Liberty for Upper Ball-Joint Failures
Date posted: 04-22-2008

WASHINGTON — After receiving at least 22 consumer complaints about the 2002-'03 Jeep Liberty, the National Highway Traffic Safety Administration has upgraded its probe of the SUV to an "engineering analysis."

The investigation involves more than 300,000 four-wheel-drive SUVs. "The separation of an upper ball joint on either of the front wheels can result in the affected front wheel collapsing, possibly resulting in vehicle disablement and causing a loss of vehicle control," according to the NHTSA's defects investigations summary on its Web site.

Such a probe is often the step that precedes a vehicle recall.

The summary ticks off a number of dramatic incidents with the aforementioned Liberty models. "There is one complaint of a failure at 75 mph, one failure at 60 mph, three failures at 40 mph, two failures at 25 mph," said the NHTSA. "Seven failures occurring while the driver was pulling into the flow of traffic and two failures that occurred when the driver was attempting to make a left turn across the flow of oncoming traffic.

"One complainant alleged almost being hit by an oncoming truck as a result of the vehicle suddenly being disabled in the flow of cross traffic."

Chrysler is said to be "continuing to investigate the cause of upper ball-joint separations in the subject vehicles."

The Jeep Liberty has been recalled two other times from the same model years to fix a front suspension lower ball joint that had a tendency to loosen.

What this means to you: If you own one of the aforementioned Jeep Liberty models, it probably wouldn't hurt to have your dealer take a look at it. — Anita Lienert, Correspondent"

http://www.edmunds.com/insideline/do/News/articleId=125875

I love that quote "had a tendency to loosen" - How about "spontaneously destruct!"
But how many of those were lifted?

If you lift your KJ and do not change the UCA's and they fail and you try and sue Chrysler you just wasted your money,heck even filing a complaint after modifiying your suspension(IE lifting it) and then try and complain about OEM parts that fail is fruad and you can be liable since you modified your vehicle and now the OEM UCA's are now out of there original designed operating range,your fault not anyone elses.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Aug 05, 2008 11:17 pm 
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I didn't see any mention of lifts...............

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Wed Aug 06, 2008 5:36 am 
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Mine's not lifted, and has lived a very well cared for life since new. Never abused, very light trail use a few times, I use the 4wd for snow mostly. I think the history of this vehicle speaks for itself, the IFS they designed for the liberty is marginal at best. When looking at target buyer I understand DCX' approach- it's more rugged than the typical cute ute but didn't need to be a Wrangler, so it has some very key weak spots - the ball joints, which I don't think is the joint so much as the layout/design. And of course the aluminum Dana 30. And the swicth to the weaker transmission, and the.... I buy a vehicle and typically keep it for 7-8 years or more. The ONLY reason I kept this one past the 4th set of lower ball joints was that they are replaced for free for the life of the vehicle. Now I have to watch the uppers and hope one doesn't fail quickly and do some damage. Guess I start checking them at least monthly, not just at rotation time(6 mos.). Take this as a rant, I didn't see anyone even remotely indicating an attempt to defraud DCX, just a couple of people worried about their safety and the NHTSA has complaints logged warranting more action- Which is good for all of us. I do agree, if you have modified your suspension then you are on your own and should not expect DCX to do any repairs.

Matt

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Hidden Hitch w/Yakima Bighorn 4 bike rack
Vent shades and deflector.

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Wed Aug 06, 2008 10:29 pm 
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Did you hear about that group of Roush Mustang owners who are suing Ford for $12 Mill because they say that Ford made more than the 100 units of the "Limited Edition". They feel that the addditional units are decreasing the potential value of the ones they bought when they were told by Ford that there would be only 100 made.

I wonder if we can class action sue DC because all the publicity over the LBJs and now possibly UBJs is decreasing the resale value of our vehicles? :twisted:

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Dec 22, 2008 7:26 pm 
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If you have bad uppers or have already replaced them because they were bad please check here:
http://www-odi.nhtsa.dot.gov/cars/probl ... mmary=true

and take the time to file a complaint by clicking on the menu to the left. It may help push the recall through.
I have one close to separation and will have to change it for safety sake before this is finalized.
Yes mine is lifted but I have replaced the UCA's on two other Liberty's that were not lifted.

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Dec 22, 2008 7:49 pm 
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Matt400 wrote:
If you have bad uppers or have already replaced them because they were bad please check here:
http://www-odi.nhtsa.dot.gov/cars/probl ... mmary=true

and take the time to file a complaint by clicking on the menu to the left. It may help push the recall through.
I have one close to separation and will have to change it for safety sake before this is finalized.
Yes mine is lifted but I have replaced the UCA's on two other Liberty's that were not lifted.
If yours is lifted you have no right to post a complaint to help a recall happen.I will let NHTSA know to disregaurd your complaint and find out how many of the others are lifted as not to force a un-justified recall for aftermarket modifications.


Edit: Just got off the phone with ODI and they have it noted if the UCA's for KJ's goes under full investigation that all complaints will be investigated for lifted KJ's and then thrown out.


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PostPosted: Mon Dec 22, 2008 8:44 pm 
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We are a service shop and have replaced UCA's on non lifted Liberty's, they are junk. In addition to the Liberty there are many Ram ball joints going bad early on non lifted vehicles.
You have no place in policing low grade parts passed on to the public.
I have encouraged our customers to file a complaint, it is well within their right.

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Dec 22, 2008 9:01 pm 
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tjkj2002 wrote:
Matt400 wrote:
If you have bad uppers or have already replaced them because they were bad please check here:
http://www-odi.nhtsa.dot.gov/cars/probl ... mmary=true

and take the time to file a complaint by clicking on the menu to the left. It may help push the recall through.
I have one close to separation and will have to change it for safety sake before this is finalized.
Yes mine is lifted but I have replaced the UCA's on two other Liberty's that were not lifted.
If yours is lifted you have no right to post a complaint to help a recall happen.I will let NHTSA know to disregaurd your complaint and find out how many of the others are lifted as not to force a un-justified recall for aftermarket modifications.


Edit: Just got off the phone with ODI and they have it noted if the UCA's for KJ's goes under full investigation that all complaints will be investigated for lifted KJ's and then thrown out.


Thats fine my lift comes off as ez as it went on

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Dec 22, 2008 9:57 pm 
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john jr wrote:
tjkj2002 wrote:
Matt400 wrote:
If you have bad uppers or have already replaced them because they were bad please check here:
http://www-odi.nhtsa.dot.gov/cars/probl ... mmary=true

and take the time to file a complaint by clicking on the menu to the left. It may help push the recall through.
I have one close to separation and will have to change it for safety sake before this is finalized.
Yes mine is lifted but I have replaced the UCA's on two other Liberty's that were not lifted.
If yours is lifted you have no right to post a complaint to help a recall happen.I will let NHTSA know to disregaurd your complaint and find out how many of the others are lifted as not to force a un-justified recall for aftermarket modifications.


Edit: Just got off the phone with ODI and they have it noted if the UCA's for KJ's goes under full investigation that all complaints will be investigated for lifted KJ's and then thrown out.


Thats fine my lift comes off as ez as it went on
That's still fraud,and illegal.Since you posted that comment I'll be sure to pass it along if a recall happens.


You all don't get that your own dumb actions do not make the maker of your vehicle responsible for breaking parts,even more so if you modify corresponding parts and you wonder why the automakers are in trouble(your fraud doesn't help) Might want to check other vehicles,all have problems with UBJ's and LBJ's.Again 22 complaints for over 1.2 million KJ's built is just effects of mass production,every part and every industry has the same problems be it vehicles or dishwashers.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Dec 22, 2008 10:03 pm 
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tjkj2002 wrote:
john jr wrote:
tjkj2002 wrote:
Matt400 wrote:
If you have bad uppers or have already replaced them because they were bad please check here:
http://www-odi.nhtsa.dot.gov/cars/probl ... mmary=true

and take the time to file a complaint by clicking on the menu to the left. It may help push the recall through.
I have one close to separation and will have to change it for safety sake before this is finalized.
Yes mine is lifted but I have replaced the UCA's on two other Liberty's that were not lifted.
If yours is lifted you have no right to post a complaint to help a recall happen.I will let NHTSA know to disregaurd your complaint and find out how many of the others are lifted as not to force a un-justified recall for aftermarket modifications.


Edit: Just got off the phone with ODI and they have it noted if the UCA's for KJ's goes under full investigation that all complaints will be investigated for lifted KJ's and then thrown out.


Thats fine my lift comes off as ez as it went on
That's still fraud,and illegal.Since you posted that comment I'll be sure to pass it along if a recall happens.


You all don't get that your own dumb actions do not make the maker of your vehicle responsible for breaking parts,even more so if you modify corresponding parts and you wonder why the automakers are in trouble(your fraud doesn't help) Might want to check other vehicles,all have problems with UBJ's and LBJ's.Again 22 complaints for over 1.2 million KJ's built is just effects of mass production,every part and every industry has the same problems be it vehicles or dishwashers.

Boy someone has a big head .by the way how do you fit it in your kj?

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Dec 22, 2008 10:12 pm 
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john jr wrote:
tjkj2002 wrote:
john jr wrote:
tjkj2002 wrote:
Matt400 wrote:
If you have bad uppers or have already replaced them because they were bad please check here:
http://www-odi.nhtsa.dot.gov/cars/probl ... mmary=true

and take the time to file a complaint by clicking on the menu to the left. It may help push the recall through.
I have one close to separation and will have to change it for safety sake before this is finalized.
Yes mine is lifted but I have replaced the UCA's on two other Liberty's that were not lifted.
If yours is lifted you have no right to post a complaint to help a recall happen.I will let NHTSA know to disregaurd your complaint and find out how many of the others are lifted as not to force a un-justified recall for aftermarket modifications.


Edit: Just got off the phone with ODI and they have it noted if the UCA's for KJ's goes under full investigation that all complaints will be investigated for lifted KJ's and then thrown out.


Thats fine my lift comes off as ez as it went on
That's still fraud,and illegal.Since you posted that comment I'll be sure to pass it along if a recall happens.


You all don't get that your own dumb actions do not make the maker of your vehicle responsible for breaking parts,even more so if you modify corresponding parts and you wonder why the automakers are in trouble(your fraud doesn't help) Might want to check other vehicles,all have problems with UBJ's and LBJ's.Again 22 complaints for over 1.2 million KJ's built is just effects of mass production,every part and every industry has the same problems be it vehicles or dishwashers.

Boy someone has a big head .by the way how do you fit it in your kj?
No big head,I just work in the industry and I'm sick of freeloaders trying to defraud and get free work on there vehicles for there own stupidity.You all are quick to place the blame on the wrong end of that pointing finger when anything goes wrong with your vehicle.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Dec 23, 2008 1:29 am 
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Fraud is fraud. And posting people to do so, on this site is not allowed.

You have been warned. Do not continue bickering on it. Discussion closed.

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