X2...I think that is the only way you can make an OTT work.

Terraflex thought about it, their kit comes with the extended bumpstops.

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Cherokee 2,5 CRD: sold - Wrangler TJ 2.5: gone - Touareg V10 TDI: new toy

Solo Liberty en Español: Jeepliberty.es

Benvenuto amico mio.

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“You cannot solve a problem from the same consciousness that created it."

“Learn from yesterday, live for today, hope for tomorrow. The important thing is not to stop questioning.”

Now that I have drank half of my six pack since I started reading this thread..............

You guys really do know your stuff and experience definitly makes a big difference, which is why I spent the time to read everylast sentence in this thread. I am seriously rethinking the lift idea I was working on. I also started off thinkin "I dont off road as much as these guys, the most my jeep will see is an occasional trip to silver lake dunes."
My jeep only has 20k on it so there is still some life left in the stock struts, or so I assume. It sounds like I will be much farther along to wait for the frankenlift after all, most guys on here are running it and were once in my same position. So, in conclusion I could save $160 on the frankenlift because I dont have to buy the daystar to realize I made a mistake. lol

Honestly would like to thank you all for the information available on this site! Sarcastic or friendly, experience talks and it's up to the newbie to make a decison. I've learned the hard way too many times and think it's time I take a lil advice from a "veteran."

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All Stock

ok. so this ott (over the top) lift is not the way to go because it, with out longer bumpstops, allows the strut to bottom out on variations in the road (speed bumps, driveways, etc).

looking at the picture it seems that an ott lift would set the spring down farther and make the strut extend farther out from the body at normal ride or rest. since i am new to lifting the kj i am not sure if the lift moves the strut also or if it just moves the spring and am assuming it just moves the spring (there by extending the strut from the housing as i stated earlier). if this is correct, maybe its not the bottoming out on the bumpstops that is messing the struts up, or maybe that is not the actual primary problem, as the struts hyper extending and blowing the o-rings on top? this seems more logical to me IF the strut stays in its original place and the spring is the only thing to move.

is this how this particular lift works? moves only the spring down? if so then i would be inclined to believe my idea on hyper extension blowing the struts more then bottoming out since the strut would have more room to compress if it mounted in its original spot vs moving down with the spring. then, when it does blow it would totally bottom out giving the appearance of bottoming out blowing the strut.

since i am very new to the kj (just came home from traveling for work and the wife had bought it while i was out) having only driven it for two days, maybe i am looking at this with a fresh perspective? i know lifting on ZJs (grand cherokees) and using stock shocks will allow them to hyper extend and "blow" at anything over 2"s of lift.

i usually do not participate in these types of conversation because i am more of a do-er (and add semi comical comments to off topic) then a person to add experience to threads because of the fact that answering the same thing over and over bothers me. ( i come from being a moderator on a euro car forum and being a technical advisor locally for the european car people here in corpus christ, texas and also come from being a fairly well known bmw modder and racer on a very large bmw model specific forum so i totally know you guys feelings on dealing with new people asking over and over)

excuse my ramblings but please feel free to correct my thoughts on this ott lift thing if i am incorrect in my thinking, being i am the new guy here.

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87 jeep cherokee, lifted
02 jeep liberty, lifted
91 bmw 318i mtechnic

The OTT moves the entire assembly - spring and strut down 2" - but the bumpstop stays at the in the original position.

it can't hyperextend the strut - because the upper A arm hits the spring 1st (fairly common on several lifts)

however in compression - the upper A arm is now 2" away from the bumpstop when the strut is in full compression.

so it's the strut bottoming out internally before the A arm hits the bumpstop - that kills the struts

and someone managed to kill a new set of struts in 1 weekend - so it doesn't take a lot.

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2005 CRD
stuff
Skeptic quod gratis asseritur, gratis negatur

Technically the KJ does not have "struts",the front uses a coilover shock but just got lumped into the strut category.Fully extending a shock is not really bad for it,shocks are the primary limiting device for suspensions for droop in many,many vehicles with no issues.

You got the wrong picture. That is a 3/8 clevis lift and causes no harm.

An OTT looks like this:

_________________
Cherokee 2,5 CRD: sold - Wrangler TJ 2.5: gone - Touareg V10 TDI: new toy

Solo Liberty en Español: Jeepliberty.es

I bought my Liberty brand new from the dealer with an OTT lift from RRO. After 20K miles the dealer had to replace the fron ball joints, struts, and springs. The OTT lift is terrible. I replaced the OTT lift with a Frankenlift and the difference was night and day.

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2005 CRD , Moab Rims, 245/75/16 Goodyear M/T
RL rear bumper, TMJ Front bumper, Frankenlinft,
*TOTALED*

1985 Mitsubishi Pickup SP 2.3 Turbo Diesel Watercooled turbo,4D56 ported head,
12" Suspension Lift with JK Rubicon axles, Elockers, 5.13's, Fox coilovers, Atlas 5.0, Rock Lizard supersliders

1996 Lexus LX450 -locked and lifted-

You got the wrong picture. That is a 3/8 clevis lift and causes no harm.

An OTT looks like this:

[/quote]

Actually, a clevis is just as bad as the same amount of OTT lift.

The problem with the OTT lift is the shock (and/or spring...) getting to full compression before the UCA hits the bumpstop.

The clevis lift spaces the LCA further away from the bottom of the shock, and therefore positions the UCA further away from the bumpstop upon full compression.

OK, is it so hard to take a picture of a strut WITHOUT the spring on it installed on the KJ, then cycle it up and down with the OTT lift and longer bumpstops installed to see if it bottoms BEFORE it compresses the bumstop?

Is this so hard?

It will positively answer this question once and for all.

When I change my OE front strus (45k miles on them, about 30k with an OTT installed) in a month or so I will do this test.

(It probably won't matter since reality is not accepted by some anti-OTT folks)

Is is so hard to understand that if you modify your suspension so that it can over-extend or over-compress a shock or strut that it WILL DAMAGE the shock or strut? REGARDLESS of how it's modified?

That's why they make bumpstops and limiting straps.

Hey Michael, see we agree on something, its all in the bumpstops , and .......some other little things but the bumpstops do help for sure on any lift regardless of what some seem to think.

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MUDD'S MOTORSPORT'S We do IFS lift installs ,
03 OVERLAND EDITION /Kilby-Skidrow-Mopar-4XGuard skids/ 2.5 inch TOTAL CONTROL JBA coilovers -JBA Arms/MOABS-31 FALKEN WILDPEAK AT3W / 4.10's etc, 04 Kilimanjaro Edition loaded, plus 05 KJ limited

Actually, this has been done!!! And I think it should be part of the lift Q's sticky!!!!! And the pics taken when the test was done are below. In fact, the LOST member here who did (Universeman), was given direct credit for his research by Teraflex as they were the 1st to develop longer bumpstops and made them standard in their lift kits. You can read his whole thread here:

http://www.virtualjeepclub.com/attachme ... 1236742345

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2005 Black CRD KJ____Full GDE turbo kit, EHM, 6.5L GMCTD lift pump, euro tq conv, 31" Duratracs on 15x7 Procomps w/3.75"bs
2.5" lift, full skids, Super Skink Sliders, front JBA Steel Diff w/True-Trac___Powertax "No-Slip" locker rear
Tow Rig: 2003 Silver 2wd Dodge 2500 reg. cab 5.9 Cummins (highly modded with 550hp/1200tq+)

Good job finding that post! The only prob is that it might not be graphic enough for some nay-sayers....the shock "boot" or cover sleeve hides the piston. Can't really see how much is showing at full compression. I'm sure it was obvious to the guy doing the test.

This isn't rocket science, and certainly not worth 100's of posts! It's simple geometry that you can see for yourself.

An OTT lift will with extended bumpstops work. The question is how hard do you want to wheel with it? I've taken mine on rocky BLM trails around Nevada, but would not take it on the Rubicon without expecting some problems with not enough dampening, both by spring and by strut.

I have taken it on the Rubicon's trailhead at Tahoe, and it's just too rough for the stock springs and shocks to dampen. BUT, it works fine for most other lesser trail. For < $240 complete it works for me.

That's all I'm trying to make clear.

tommud, we also agree on aircraft landing lights for offroad lights.

I don't mind butting heads with anyone who can present a valid counterpoint, it gets old sitting around agreeing all day.

FYI for those who aren't in the virtual jeep club
here's the LOST thread
http://www.lostjeeps.com/forum/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?p=98154#98154

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2005 CRD
stuff
Skeptic quod gratis asseritur, gratis negatur

I added that URL to the LIFT FAQ. Just to explain and/or make more graphic what an OTT lift is and what it does.

For the record: in the FAQ it says What is the BEST lift for my kj

And I do not find that an OTT (of any brand) lift should be mentioned in that same catagory.

There is a link to ALL the available Liberty lifts. So if you do not agree with the FAQ, feel free to buy something else.

Michael, I guess you didn't bother to read through this whole thread, we did agree OTT's work IF fitted with longer bumpstops long agooooooooo

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Cherokee 2,5 CRD: sold - Wrangler TJ 2.5: gone - Touareg V10 TDI: new toy

Solo Liberty en Español: Jeepliberty.es

ok, so for my wife to drive around on road, the ott with extendo bump stops is fine but when i she gets another jeep and this moves permanently into my hands then the springs lift with hd springs will go on. (that front brush guard adds some noticable weight on speed bumps and bottoms the suspension onto the factory bump stop)

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87 jeep cherokee, lifted
02 jeep liberty, lifted
91 bmw 318i mtechnic

You got it! Go with the OME springs/struts if you plan on wheeling it...not just trail driving.

really looking at that frankenlift 2.5. since my springs are so shot anyways, might as well replace them and since i'm taking it all apart, might as well lift it like i want.

already discussed it with the espousa so i just have to come up with some extra cashola and i should be good

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87 jeep cherokee, lifted
02 jeep liberty, lifted
91 bmw 318i mtechnic