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 Post subject: Suspension lift
PostPosted: Fri Jul 08, 2005 5:45 pm 
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Hey all I just bought my liberty last week. It is an 02 sport 4x4 with the 3.7 v-6 and manual tranny. I have already taken it to my favorite mud hole and had a wonderful sloshing sliding good time. Thing is I noticed that it needed some things....such as better traction and more clearance... So back to my question. Where do I get information on the Best Lift for the money, and rims. I have been told that the liberty uses a front wheel drive offset. I really would like to put some black wagon wheels with bead locks but i am unable to find them. Also which is better? The Strut spacer lift or the spring spacer kit or are they one and the same? Please reply this is my first jeep and I am on a limited budget. Any help from the veterans out there?

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PostPosted: Fri Jul 08, 2005 6:25 pm 
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An '02 means you got a pre-lowered KJ. Good for you, you are about 1/2" taller than late '03+.

If you go with a strut spacer, i.e. RRO Combo Kit or Rusty Spacer then you will net 2.5" in height. This will give you enuf clearance for 265/75/16, with possible minor rub at full lock. But increase the CV Joint Angles.

Now, if you go with a suspension lift (Rusty Coil Lift) you will only net 1.5" in height, since it is measure post-lowered. This however, is very good on the cv angles so there are no reports of problems there. With this type of lift 265/75 is possible, however you will need to do alot more trimming. 245/75/16 works best in this setup.

For the money I would go with the suspension lift since it's a full replacement. Shocks, Struts, Springs. This gives you maximum articulation.

Another good suspension lift is the Franken Lift.

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PostPosted: Fri Jul 08, 2005 6:40 pm 
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Thanks for the info. I have seen the Frankenlift mentioned on several threads. What does it come with and where can I get it?

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L.O.S.T. #058282
92 Jeep Cherokee
3.5" lift (more mods to come)
2002 Sport 4x4 SOLD

new dent in drivers side passenger door from duranged tree
http://www.cardomain.com/ride/2062821


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Fri Jul 08, 2005 6:46 pm 
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the frakenlift is from All J -- 909 370 4800 -- and it's kind of a "greatest hits" lift where they've taken the best components of different brands and boxed them together as a lift kit.

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Fri Jul 08, 2005 7:45 pm 
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KJ was lowered starting April 2, 2002. You have to check the build date on the door to know if you're lowered or not.

There was a tech section with a review of the lifts. Its dated now, doesn't include the new spring lifts, but what is discussed is still valid. Best budget lift is the RRO combo, don;t think I've heard a complaint about it except maybe it isn't high enough. Can do a clevis lift for free - adds about an inch I guess.

If you're pre-lowered then the 2.5" can cause some problems. If you're lowered fewer problems but you loose a tire size. 265x70 is about the max unless you want to make significant mods and risk your flares.

Rims (or should I say wheels for the auto purists?) are 16x7 w/ 5 on 4.5 bolt pattern and 5.25" backspace. I think most have gone to 4" bs.


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PostPosted: Fri Jul 08, 2005 11:30 pm 
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I am going to use these wheels on my KJ, they might be what you are looking for.

http://www.quadratec.com/cgi-bin/sgin0101.exe?UID=2005070823193646&T1=92600%2B111%2B07&UREQA=1&UREQB=2&UREQC=3&UREQD=4&FNM=00&x=66&y=74

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 Post subject: Pre-lowered with Suspension Lift
PostPosted: Sat Jul 09, 2005 1:34 am 
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It is my understanding that a full replacement suspension lift (not a spacer lift) like a Frankenlift or a Rusty's 2.5" Suspension Lift will give the same height gain on a pre-lowered as the same lift on a lowered KJ. The difference in a pre-lowered vehicle is it's coil, strut, and shock height, (or maybe just the struts and shocks or just the coils, I don't remember exactly). If you replace all these components, you get the same height gain in both vehicles, despite build date.
I know using a spacer lift will give different height gains on a pre-lowered and lowered vehicle. If I understand correctly, putting a spacer atop a pre-lowered coil will result in the specified height gain, while putting the same spacer atop a lowered coil will give less because the lowered coil is indeed smaller in height. Replacing these "lowered" components with a full suspension kit will result in the specificed height gain no matter what KJ because the "lowered" components aren't being used.

P.S. I could be horribly wrong, so please feel free to correct me if and where I am.


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PostPosted: Sun Jul 10, 2005 1:12 am 
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Ok just to clarrifiy If my lib was built before 04/02/02 then it is a "lowered" but if is built after 04/02/02 then it is "pre-lowered" or do i have it all wrong? mine was built 06/02. also does all j have a web site?

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I'm not lost.....I'm exploring...
L.O.S.T. #058282
92 Jeep Cherokee
3.5" lift (more mods to come)
2002 Sport 4x4 SOLD

new dent in drivers side passenger door from duranged tree
http://www.cardomain.com/ride/2062821


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun Jul 10, 2005 1:26 am 
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Quote:
also does all j have a web site?

www.boulderbars.com

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun Jul 10, 2005 1:59 am 
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Thanks for the link I don't see the frankenlift as a kit or do i assemble it myself?

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I'm not lost.....I'm exploring...
L.O.S.T. #058282
92 Jeep Cherokee
3.5" lift (more mods to come)
2002 Sport 4x4 SOLD

new dent in drivers side passenger door from duranged tree
http://www.cardomain.com/ride/2062821


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun Jul 10, 2005 9:51 am 
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Your best bet is to call All J during the week and talk to Quinn about the components to make up the Frankenlift. He knows everything you need and all the ins and outs of the kit. Their number is on the contact page of their site.

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 Post subject: Lifts and a whole bunch of general info......
PostPosted: Sun Jul 10, 2005 2:21 pm 
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You can find us at:

www.boulderbars.com or www.alljproducts.com or 909-370-4800

A few things to keep in mind about lifting KJ's. When you swap out the front struts with a complete new replacement unit, it no longer becomes lowered or prelowered KJ. The stock springs are what decides that. Once the stock strut assembley is in the trash, you are all at the same starting point. KJ's ALL VARY in the ride hight depertment. Some have saggy springs, some have stiffer springs. This is why you get KJ's sitting at all different ride heights from the factory. If you add a Daystar or other spacer lift, you are dependent on the factory spring. We have had KJ's come in with such soft springs, that they got over 4" of lift when lifted with a new front strut set. They didn't really get 4", they are just 2.5" over stock. And that 2.5" over stock is about the most mysterious actual measurment I have ever seen.

Example: Frankenlift. It is called a 2.5" lift. That's pretty close to what it measures. If you get a little less or a little more, that would depend on where your stock KJ sat stock. From the factory, there are about 15 different factory front KJ springs to choose from. They are all ordered by vin number. Confusing to say the least. All J has a pretty good handle on which springs will stiffen up the KJ and which ones are too soft. But in the long run, if you are going to lift the KJ compare yours to another stock KJ to see where you sit. If your KJ is up where it should be, than a spacer lift will work for you. A cheaper way to go. If your KJ is a low rider from saggy springs, and sits way low, or bottoms out a lot stock, then don't do a spacer lift, go for the full spring lift. Then decide on your tire size. Some of the spring lift don't give the full 2.5" so you may not be able to run as large of a tire.

I hope this helps you with some basic info. The biggest headache I get is all the pre lowered and lowered calls. The only difference is the springs, and when you do the lift right, those are gone anyways. I have my opinion on the best lifts to use depending on your needs. Another thing, if you are opening the front struts up to add any lift, change out the factory struts and throw in some upgraded struts. Your KJ will love you for it. I won't make any recomendations on brands. If you want a recommendation, give me a call, or ask on the board. Most of the KJ owners on this board can't be wrong :) And for reference, we have lifted over 200 KJ's with Clint's help in the last 2 years and we have a pretty good handle on what works for a KJ. Also we have KJ's with over 70,000 miles lifted, in and out on a regular basis for testing and research. I would venture to say that with Clint's help, we have lifted more actual KJ's than anyone else in the country!

Also on tires: 245x75r16 tires fit the best out of all the sizes on a lifted KJ. And it's about 50% than NEEDS to pound out the pinch weld behind the front tires. It depends on your type of wheeling.

YES you can run 265's on a KJ, but make sure whatever lift you pick is at the max height. Also plan on trimming about 50% of your inner front fenderwells, the air dam, and the pinchweld behind the tires. This will leave the washer bottle exposed, so some undercoating or a sheetmetal shield over it works okay. When we trim out the front, we undercoat the areas trimmed to preserve the life of the KJ.

And then on most lifted KJ's the tires will rub the front sway bar at full steering lock. Fact of life! No fix for this yet by anyone. The only exception would be different offset rims, but taht can lead to other issues. Rubicon Wheels work well.

I hope this helps you with the basics you need to lift your KJ correctly. BTW, on the the LOST KJ Moab 2004 Run, everyone there had first had experience with all the different lifts represented. It was night and day between the brands. I won't tell you which to buy, but you can guess which one I know works the best. Check out what most of the LOST KJ WEST KJ's are using and go from there. :) :) :)

CRD Liberty lifting info: At this time, we are only recommending the Daystar 2.5" lift for the front of a CRD. They use a VERY stiff front spring to handle the weight. NONE of the aftermarket springs yet are heavy enough. We probably lifted one of the first CRD's in the country and found out the hard way that even the Frankenlift doesn't work on a CRD. I know Old Man Emu will probably be the one's to have springs soon, but for now it's a Daystar 2.5" lift with a Rancho strut. Diesel Dave from AZ is running this set up and as far as I know is very happy with it. Dave's CRD was out for the KJ Moab 2005 run. I hope they can comment more on how it's doing. Also we did use the Skyjacker rear springs and Ranchos on the back, and those were great on the CRD.

And BTW, I know the info on the Frankenlift isn't on the site yet. I'm working on getting that info taken care of. My webdesigner has been busy with other projects lately 8)

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Last edited by macgyver on Sun Jul 10, 2005 2:49 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Great write up Quinn
PostPosted: Sun Jul 10, 2005 2:30 pm 
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Quinn, that should really help a lot of guys out. I think we should make a copy of this in the TECH section. I will get a copy mioved over there as well. Later...Clint

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 Post subject: Re: Great write up Quinn
PostPosted: Sun Jul 10, 2005 2:32 pm 
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skrracing wrote:
Quinn, that should really help a lot of guys out. I think we should make a copy of this in the TECH section. I will get a copy mioved over there as well. Later...Clint


I forgot to add the CRD info in the above post, I'll go edit it right now.

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1968 Jeep M715
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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Jul 11, 2005 10:45 am 
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Quinn......Thanks for the info. That really clarifies things. I was getting pretty confused with all the lowered, pre lowered stuff. I will be refering back to this when I go to lift my lil KJ and give is some attitude/altitude. Some girl called it "cute" this weekend. so it won't be long before an adjustment is made.

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I'm not lost.....I'm exploring...
L.O.S.T. #058282
92 Jeep Cherokee
3.5" lift (more mods to come)
2002 Sport 4x4 SOLD

new dent in drivers side passenger door from duranged tree
http://www.cardomain.com/ride/2062821


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Jul 11, 2005 1:39 pm 
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Thanks Quinn. Just got off the phone with ya and I'm going to work on gathering the $$. I can't thank you enough for your patience in helping me put together something for my KJ CRD. The Daystar and Rancho will work then. Hopefully be placing an order soon.

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Jul 12, 2005 5:49 pm 
Ah Ha! Found the info I was looking for! Thanks Quinn. I'll be calling soon.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Wed Jul 13, 2005 1:20 am 
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Hammer, I like your Avitar. RTLW brother!!!!

Hey, I am getting a Daystar 2.5 inch lift with Rancho Shocks on my 05 CRD 4x4 next week, anyony know if this will sit a bit higher, ir; noticable difference in clearance?

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"Democracy is two wolves and a lamb voting on what to have for lunch.
Liberty is a well-armed lamb contesting the vote." - Benjamin Franklin, 1759


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