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Only What It Takes !
http://www.lostjeeps.com/forum/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=3&t=14445		 Page 1 of 1
Author:  CaTTrax [ Sun Nov 12, 2006 6:10 pm ]
Post subject:  Only What It Takes !
What changes need to be made to make the KJ an adequate vehicle for some of the harder trails? What I am looking for is a minimalist approach to a build up of the KJ.
Example: A custom built rock crawler would be the top end of what you may drive on "Poison Spider Mesa". What would you need to do to a Stock KJ. to 1: Get thru the trail
2: Keep it safe & drivable.
3: Not add anything that would put any undo stress on weaker parts as to cause them to brake on the trail (ie- putting 36" tires on the 35a front diff ).

The point I am tring to get to is we have all seen the long line of custom 4x4s on the various trails around MOAB looking cool as they crawl their way thru " Hells Revenge" only to have some poor Ba$$tard ( Tongue in cheek ) who doesn't know any better compleat the same trail in his 1971 Blaser or new Ranger P/U. So what do we REALLY need to do to our KJ's to have fun wheeling around MOAB and not just throw every Accessary ever made or dreamed of on our KJs

So keeping in mind we are only going to make NECESSARY upgrades and modifications no PIE IN THE SKY STUFF.

1. Lift? How much?
2. Tires? What Size?
3. Skids & Rail Rockers?
4. Winch? What size?
5. Bumpers?
6. Lockers? Fromt? Rear?
7. Gear Change?
8. Roof Rack?
9. CB?
10. Roll Cage?
11. Anything else?

Remenber alot of our Kjs are driven as daliy drivers by our wifes and most don't want to drive a monster truck to work! :lol:
Author:  Eddo [ Sun Nov 12, 2006 6:28 pm ]
Post subject: 
A good 2.5-3" lift. Frankenlift and Rusty's spring kit are two good kits.

A set of 245/75R16 AT or MTs

Skid plates, rocker protection.

A rear locker is nice, but not necessary all the time.


That is about it. I've done Hell's Revenge, Poison Spider, etc along with tons of other KJs doing pretty much any trail at Moab with the modifications listed above.
Author:  scorpio_vette [ Sun Nov 12, 2006 6:34 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Only What It Takes !
CaTTrax wrote:

So keeping in mind we are only going to make NECESSARY upgrades and modifications no PIE IN THE SKY STUFF.

1. Lift? How much?
2. Tires? What Size?
3. Skids & Rail Rockers?
4. Winch? What size?
5. Bumpers?
6. Lockers? Fromt? Rear?
7. Gear Change?
8. Roof Rack?
9. CB?
10. Roll Cage?
11. Anything else?

Remenber alot of our Kjs are driven as daliy drivers by our wifes and most don't want to drive a monster truck to work! :lol:


i'll just change your order on that list so it applies to basically any 4x4.

1. Skid & Rail Rockers
2. Bumpers (for winch)
3. Winch (minimum 1.5x of vehicle. usually #9,000 is good)
4. Locker (if possible, go with a cheap lunchbox locker until you lift/regear)
5. Lift
6. Tires
7. Gears (should go with tires)
8. Locker (either continue using the lunchbox locker, or use a "real" locker instead of the stock carrier when installing the new gears)
9. CB
10.Rollcage
11.anything else.

the bumper and winch can be pushed down the line a little if not wanted right away. but if you don't have a winch, you better have somebody that can get you out of whatever mess you get into. i've been wheeling privately and in off-road parks where i could have used my own winch and didn't have one.
Author:  Jeepjeepster [ Sun Nov 12, 2006 7:08 pm ]
Post subject: 
-Franken lift
-skids
-locker
-rocker rails.
-Cb
-tires

Thats all you need..

Things that are nice:

-steel bumper
-winch

:wink:
Author:  JJsTJ [ Sun Nov 12, 2006 9:22 pm ]
Post subject: 
PSM or Hells Revenge huh? The following can get you through those trails.
2" + lift
Recovery points (+ normal safety/recovery equipment)
A good spotter/ 2nd well equipped vehicle.

Nice stuff to have to make it easier:
posi or locker would be nice
decent tires would be nice 235/85-16, 245/75-15, 235/75-16 AT's or MT's
rocker protection Boulderbars, Skink sliders

I can't think of many spots where you even really need a lot of armor on Hells Revenge or PSM. There are bypasses for a lot of the tricky spots and ones you Have to do can be spotted through w/out too much trouble. I don't recall even scraping a bar there last year in our KJ on 245's and 2.5" Daystar lift.
Now when you try stuff like Flat Iron Mesa or Cliff Hanger or Metal Masher, Kane creek, etc. you Gotta have full skids, bars, posi or locker, and be ready for scraping and banging! :shock: Dang its fun though!!!
Author:  jason thompson [ Sun Nov 12, 2006 9:23 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Only What It Takes !
scorpio_vette wrote:
CaTTrax wrote:

So keeping in mind we are only going to make NECESSARY upgrades and modifications no PIE IN THE SKY STUFF.

1. Lift? How much?
2. Tires? What Size?
3. Skids & Rail Rockers?
4. Winch? What size?
5. Bumpers?
6. Lockers? Fromt? Rear?
7. Gear Change?
8. Roof Rack?
9. CB?
10. Roll Cage?
11. Anything else?

Remenber alot of our Kjs are driven as daliy drivers by our wifes and most don't want to drive a monster truck to work! :lol:


i'll just change your order on that list so it applies to basically any 4x4.

1. Skid & Rail Rockers
2. Bumpers (for winch)
3. Winch (minimum 1.5x of vehicle. usually #9,000 is good)
4. Locker (if possible, go with a cheap lunchbox locker until you lift/regear)
5. Lift
6. Tires
7. Gears (should go with tires)
8. Locker (either continue using the lunchbox locker, or use a "real" locker instead of the stock carrier when installing the new gears)
9. CB
10.Rollcage
11.anything else.

the bumper and winch can be pushed down the line a little if not wanted right away. but if you don't have a winch, you better have somebody that can get you out of whatever mess you get into. i've been wheeling privately and in off-road parks where i could have used my own winch and didn't have one.



I agree with the order and every thing else other than the position of the rollcage in my eyes the cage is for protection so it should come with the other protection gear I do not think that it is as needed on a KJ as it is on a TJ but still very important
Author:  scorpio_vette [ Sun Nov 12, 2006 9:42 pm ]
Post subject: 
the reason i didn't list the rollcage earlier was because i don't know what kind of wheeling he's doing. in most cases you don't need it. even if you flop. now if he's rolling on lions back, hells gate, and some of those other ones, then yeah i could see that being at the top of the list.
Author:  Jeepjeepster [ Sun Nov 12, 2006 9:42 pm ]
Post subject: 
Everyone is talking about a rollcage? I think Ive only seen 2 of these on a kj? Everyone is talking like you can buy them or something? A roll cage is NOT something you need.. Only if you cannot drive.. :wink:
Author:  jason thompson [ Sun Nov 12, 2006 9:54 pm ]
Post subject: 
Jeepjeepster wrote:
Everyone is talking about a rollcage? I think Ive only seen 2 of these on a kj? Everyone is talking like you can buy them or something? A roll cage is NOT something you need.. Only if you cannot drive.. :wink:



I would bet that you have never seen a good jeep roll in person
I have seen several and on trails that you would not think were all that hard in a moded KJ or a stock TJ infact we run them all the time with stock non rubi TJ's with no problems yet I have seen guys roll and if they did not have some kind of after market cage they would never wheel again if they had even lived

is a cage neede in a KJ not as much as a TJ if you are going to wheel some of the harder trails then you should think about getting one
I can think of at least 1 guy here in south LA that would be more than happy to work on making you a cage that would not only work but look good too

as far as the "cannot drive" statement I would put my driving up against the best of them any day of the week but only in my jeep with a cage
it was one of the first mods I did and IMO one of the best my butt is worth way more than the $500-$600 I paid for the "sport" cage I got but still better than NOTHING I would not care if I floped it over and bent the cage I would rather bend the cage than my head
Author:  moose [ Sun Nov 12, 2006 10:04 pm ]
Post subject: 
1. CB
2. Tow points & 30' tow strap
3. Skids
4. Rock Rails
5. 2+" Lift
6. hi-lift jack
7. 31" Tires
8. Locker (unless you have ESP)

I think the first 6 are needed, 7 & 8 just make it easier (so you can avoid using #2). I can also see JT's point about a cage on some of those trails around Moab.
Author:  Tokyojoe [ Sun Nov 12, 2006 10:37 pm ]
Post subject: 
As far as minimalist approach - Are you wanting to be capable to do any and all trails in Moab? I know of a couple that a KJ and even Wranglers and stock Rubi's couldn't do.

To be able to do the trails we have done:

1. Rusty's 2.5" Coil Lift - much cheaper than the Frankenlift and very good. Getting the Frankenlift would not follow your minimalist approach. You could even survive with a 2" lift.

2. Tires? Stock 235/70/16 will work. I did Moab two years ago with those tires and did very well. BUT, I would recommend getting 31's to add another inch of clearance. You could go with cheaper tires if my Stock SR/A's can perform well there.

3. ALL SKIDS! You could survive with just the OEM's but we would prefer not helping you fix something underneath because you did hit something hard and smashed the OEM tranny skid. Get the All J Super Tranny skid and you can survive with the OEM skids for the gas tank, engine, and Transfer Case.
I survived with the OEM Rock Rails but I did put a small dent in it. If you did drop down hard on the OEM rails, guarantee they will buckle. Get one of these:

Rock Lizard's Skink Sliders
All J's Boulder Bars
Carolina Rock Shop's ???? sliders

4. Winch not necessary (with a group like LOST)....but, if you feel compelled to spend the money for one, get a Mile Marker or Warn and they can handle at least 8000 lbs.

5. Stock is adequate. If you don't want to ever scrape, then get replacement steel bumpers. Otherwise, stock is fine

6. Lockers - not 100% necessary (running with a group) but very helpful so we don't have to strap you up some spots. Limited slip can get you through almost any spot but a full locker is probably best. Detroit, Power Trax, ARB (expensive). Front - debatable Rear, yes.

7. Not necessary

8. Not necessary but if you plan to bring a lot of stuff with you and camp, you will want extra cargo space.

9. CB....YES! Not 100% required but makes life for EVERYONE a lot easier.

10. Roll cage! Yes, get a full exo skeleton! A must have for any KJ.


Uhhh.....just kidding. No need

11. Fire extinguisher, first aid kit, tow hooks/shackle points front and rear, tools, parts, fluids, a jack that can work with a lifted KJ (OEM won't work), proper usable spare tire, air compressor, digital camera ( a must in Moab), bottled water, blankets, flashlight, tuned up engine, clean air filter (bring a spare), it will be most likely be toast by the end of Moab. wet weather gear, mountain bikes, and a slew of other things.



My guess would be about $1000-$1300 for all mods and then additional for safety equipment (fire extinguisher - required for the LOST Moab event)

Lift, skids, rails/sliders/bars, locker, cb & antenna
Author:  JJsTJ [ Sun Nov 12, 2006 11:19 pm ]
Post subject: 
Lets not forget there are dozens of trails in Moab that a stocker could do and they are well worth the drive. Unbelievably beautiful scenery is everywhere you look there.
Author:  broncsrule [ Sun Nov 12, 2006 11:43 pm ]
Post subject: 
For PSM and Hell's Revenge: Lift and skids recomended, but if you have tow points, we can drag a stocker if needed. Ouch!
Author:  DarbyWalters [ Mon Nov 13, 2006 12:01 am ]
Post subject: 
HAVE TO HAVE:

Full Skids...Engine, Tranny, Transfercase and Fuel Tank
Rocker Protection...Sliders (real ones)
Recovery Points...A Hitch reciever in the rear with a shackle is best
...The stock ones in the front is fine
...A Hidden Hitch in the front would be better
( With Hitch recievers front and rear you can always transport a winch with you that can be switched front to rear and kept inside your cargo area )
Recovery Strap...carry a good quality 30ft Recovery strap
Better Tires...some kind of All Terrain at least...size depends on lift or not

WHAT YOU WILL WANT AFTER YOUR FIRST TRIP:

Lift...will make your trip much better and then add tires to fit
High Lift...good idea to get a High Lift Jack especially after the lift

WHAT YOU WILL WANT NEXT:

Rear Locker or LSD (Good One)...will make you more trail capable
Front LSD or ARB...even better

Things you should have: CB, Tools, Fire Extinguisher, First Aide Kit, Lights (auxillary and flashlight), GPS is always nice to have
Author:  Tokyojoe [ Mon Nov 13, 2006 1:52 am ]
Post subject: 
Darby,

You won't get a happy face sticker to put on your KJ if you don't have a fire extinguisher in your KJ at LOST Moab.
Author:  riptricket [ Mon Nov 13, 2006 12:24 pm ]
Post subject: 
what are lockers??? thanks
Author:  moose [ Mon Nov 13, 2006 12:29 pm ]
Post subject: 
riptricket wrote:
what are lockers??? thanks

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