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front suspenion trashed, help questions need answering
http://www.lostjeeps.com/forum/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=3&t=14961		 Page 1 of 1
Author:  Robert Bradbury [ Tue Nov 28, 2006 12:21 pm ]
Post subject:  front suspenion trashed, help questions need answering
OK, so the Skyjacker Kit I installed this year was toast in no time I guess because of the ARB and winch. Too Bad they didn't know this was the case .

Any way the mechanic is saying all ball joint and tie rods on the front are toast. The mechanic is saying this will happen again because everything is pushed to the max.

Is there anything I can do to rectify this? I think ALs heavy duty A arms for the top?
What about the lower ball joint and tie rod, are there better heavier replacement of a
different length to aleviate thsi problem?

Oh, and I also noticed that my Trxux tires that have about 10,000K on them are just about worn out. That seems extreem to me, has anyone else had this problem?

Robert
Author:  jason thompson [ Tue Nov 28, 2006 12:49 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: front suspenion trashed, help questions need answering
Robert Bradbury wrote:
OK, so the Skyjacker Kit I installed this year was toast in no time I guess because of the ARB and winch. Too Bad they didn't know this was the case .

Any way the mechanic is saying all ball joint and tie rods on the front are toast. The mechanic is saying this will happen again because everything is pushed to the max.

Is there anything I can do to rectify this? I think ALs heavy duty A arms for the top?
What about the lower ball joint and tie rod, are there better heavier replacement of a
different length to aleviate thsi problem?

Oh, and I also noticed that my Trxux tires that have about 10,000K on them are just about worn out. That seems extreem to me, has anyone else had this problem?

Robert




Wow that is a bunch of stuff to go bad at once
What the mech. is saying about everything being pushed to the max is probably right
new upper arms would fix the problem with the upper ball joint mog LBJ's would fix the lower problem but the steering would just need to be replaced with OE quality parts as far as I know and they will still wear out fast
I have thought of a way to fix the steering problem but have yet to look into having it built
I have seen a steering set up for the TJ that uses hiem joints in the place of ball joints in theory you could do the same for the outter end of the KJ tie rod with a more heavy duty rod that has a kink in it to keep the rack end leven and the joint on the wheel end level as well
with the adjustment at the wheel this would work it would be like a droped pitman arm for each wheel

The tires how ever did where fast most folks I have talked to have gotten about 30K+ out of them and that was on a YJ with an engine and trans from a newer Z28 or a camaro SS I think I know it was heavy and bad stupid
Author:  Robert Bradbury [ Tue Nov 28, 2006 1:46 pm ]
Post subject:  front suspension trashed, help questions need anwsering
Firstly thanks for the reply.

Could you further explain what is ball join mog and lbjs ( lower ball joints I guess?) . This will be the third time that I have replaced the front upper ball
joints, so it is a area of big concern to me now.


Wow that is a bunch of stuff to go bad at once
What the mech. is saying about everything being pushed to the max is probably right
new upper arms would fix the problem with the upper ball joint mog LBJ's would fix the lower problem but the steering would just need to be replaced with OE quality parts as far as I know and they will still wear out fast
I have thought of a way to fix the steering problem but have yet to look into having it built
I have seen a steering set up for the TJ that uses hiem joints in the place of ball joints in theory you could do the same for the outter end of the KJ tie rod with a more heavy duty rod that has a kink in it to keep the rack end leven and the joint on the wheel end level as well
with the adjustment at the wheel this would work it would be like a droped pitman arm for each wheel

The tires how ever did where fast most folks I have talked to have gotten about 30K+ out of them and that was on a YJ with an engine and trans from a newer Z28 or a camaro SS I think I know it was heavy and bad stupid
Author:  jason thompson [ Tue Nov 28, 2006 2:10 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: front suspension trashed, help questions need anwsering
Robert Bradbury wrote:
Firstly thanks for the reply.

Could you further explain what is ball join mog and lbjs ( lower ball joints I guess?) . This will be the third time that I have replaced the front upper ball
joints, so it is a area of big concern to me now.




moog I think is what it is I am not sure how to spell it but after talks with on of the places that I let work on my rigs said that they were the best you could buy I was going to get them then I got the LBJ recall done and have put that on the back burner
I am planing on going with the rustys upper A arms I like the replaceable/rebuildable joint
I will also start looking into a better steering set up

dont look for me to do any thing with the steering for about a year though my wife is still using the KJ as her DD so until I get her something new I can not do much
but in early '08 I plan on adressing the steering and some other "things" on my KJ that I think could be improved
I will be working with a "fab" shop
Author:  Jeepjeepster [ Tue Nov 28, 2006 2:50 pm ]
Post subject: 
Moog makes tie-rod ends for the libby. I do not believe they are grease-able though...

JeepinAL sales upper A arms with greasable ball joint and lower balljoints that are greaseable. Get those and you should never have another problem with balljoints. :wink:

Skyjacker is known NOT to hold up the weight of a steel bumper. You may want to look into getting some CRD springs and adding a spacer to them. :?
Author:  jason thompson [ Tue Nov 28, 2006 2:59 pm ]
Post subject: 
Jeepjeepster wrote:
Moog makes tie-rod ends for the libby. I do not believe they are grease-able though...


even still the angel is not adressed that is what is trashing the ball joints on them
remember that ball joints should be normaly at a 90* angle on all sides so that they have full range of motion when needed
not normaly at a 50* angle on one side and 130* angle on the opposite that causes uneven wear and a sooner than normal failure
a "Z bend" in the tie rod it's self should fix this


not to steal the topic but after several weeks of working with Nth degree mobility to "fix" the lift on my TJ I got to looking at the KJ and I see many "small" issues that when they are lifted trun into big issues ball joints are just 1 small thing in a world of problem this is why there are no "real lifts" out for the KJ
the immense amout of engineering that it would require to get it right along with the amount of parts that will need to be replaced would make it just too costly for any company to take on
at this point all that can be done is bandaid fix after bandaid fix until we get it right or get it how we want it to be or think it should be
if you think that I am wrong then first go look at your lifted KJ then go look at a stock new KJ and compare the angles of the front suspenion
The ball joints are all nice and strait nothing is even close to tuching nothing is in a bind it is perfect if you change that geomotry by only a few degrees or lift it only 1" all of the geomotry on the whole jeep will change
this is a fact of life and if you want a lift you will have to deal with it and fix it when it breaks but when you fix it realy fix it adress the problem do not just replace the part
Author:  Jeepjeepster [ Tue Nov 28, 2006 3:09 pm ]
Post subject: 
jason thompson wrote:
Jeepjeepster wrote:
Moog makes tie-rod ends for the libby. I do not believe they are grease-able though...


even still the angel is not adressed that is what is trashing the ball joints on them
remember that ball joints should be normaly at a 90* angle on all sides so that they have full range of motion when needed
not normaly at a 50* angle on one side and 130* angle on the opposite that causes uneven wear and a sooner than normal failure
a "Z bend" in the tie rod it's self should fix this


That is true... Im sure the moogs would last longer than the stock oem joints though.. Im not to sure how you would fix the angle without dropping the rack or finding someone to make some new spindles? :roll:
Author:  jason thompson [ Tue Nov 28, 2006 3:19 pm ]
Post subject: 
Jeepjeepster wrote:
jason thompson wrote:
Jeepjeepster wrote:
Moog makes tie-rod ends for the libby. I do not believe they are grease-able though...


even still the angel is not adressed that is what is trashing the ball joints on them
remember that ball joints should be normaly at a 90* angle on all sides so that they have full range of motion when needed
not normaly at a 50* angle on one side and 130* angle on the opposite that causes uneven wear and a sooner than normal failure
a "Z bend" in the tie rod it's self should fix this


That is true... Im sure the moogs would last longer than the stock oem joints though.. Im not to sure how you would fix the angle without dropping the rack or finding someone to make some new spindles? :roll:



note the "Z bend" in the tierod it's self this would fix it
I just dont know if that is possible or not
can the tire rod and joit be polled from the rack?
if so the I can not see why it can not be bent for a "lifted" KJ
I should shut up I am giving away the next $1,000,000 idea
Author:  Eddo [ Tue Nov 28, 2006 6:31 pm ]
Post subject: 
If I remember correctly, the skyjacker kit original had UBJ spring contact problems that would for sure would ruin some upper ball joints. Some new upper-control arms for Al would fix this problem or a lower bumpstop.

Also, your tie rod ends may not be bad. It is easily misdiagnosed on the KJ due to the way the steering locks. It does not completely lock therefore there will always appear to be play in the tie-rod if someone performs the common test of shaking the wheel from side to side. I've even had the dealer misdiagnosed the problem (or maybe they where just trying to sell me). Not saying this is the case, but it could be. Ask your mechanic to double check the tie-rod ends and tell him to watch the steering wheel and different parts for movement. Don't just assume if the wheel moves from side to side a little the play is in the tie-rod ends or steering box. If your tie-rod ends are worn you will feel significant play and wander in the steering. If the steering still feels tight then they may be just fine. I'd double check this. I've run my KJ lift for close to 30k and the tie-rod ends are still pretty darn tight.

Finally, the lower ball joints are known to be bad on a KJ, 2 recall and still problems. Moog supposedly has better joints.
Author:  Joe Jeeper [ Tue Nov 28, 2006 8:00 pm ]
Post subject:  My 2 cents
[b]I have Jeepin Als upper control arms with greasable ball joints and installed moogs in the lower control arms. So far no problems. Joe :lol:
Author:  OzLtd [ Wed Nov 29, 2006 7:04 am ]
Post subject: 
If you had to replace all those components that many times, i'm sorry my friend you either wheel the KJ the way it wasnt intended, or you bought the wrong car.................or your mechanic's ripping you off by replacing perfectly good components that you are none the wiser to know. :?
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