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Real 4" Knuckle Lift
http://www.lostjeeps.com/forum/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=3&t=23062		 Page 1 of 1
Author:  scrambledKJ [ Fri Aug 03, 2007 8:19 am ]
Post subject:  Real 4" Knuckle Lift
What would you guys expect to pay for a true 4 inch Knuckle lift? Rear springs, front springs, new cast knucle, LCA drop brackets, and shocks? with the exception of the longer wheelbase arms, it would be like this one:
http://www.4wdandsportutility.com/featu ... y_concept/

Also, how many folks do you think would buy one?

Travis
Author:  tommudd [ Fri Aug 03, 2007 8:46 am ]
Post subject: 
Why are you building one or know of someone that is? If its a true bolt in 4 inch lift then that would be great at least for me 4 inch is about as high as I want to go until in a few years go whole hog and SFA. What price are you looking at. Price depends on what is included/ brand of shocks and springs how easy/difficult the installation is etc. What else you would need to buy and other factors for me at least

Tom
Author:  tjkj2002 [ Fri Aug 03, 2007 8:48 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Real 4" Knuckle Lift
scrambledKJ wrote:
What would you guys expect to pay for a true 4 inch Knuckle lift? Rear springs, front springs, new cast knucle, LCA drop brackets, and shocks? with the exception of the longer wheelbase arms, it would be like this one:
http://www.4wdandsportutility.com/featu ... y_concept/

Also, how many folks do you think would buy one?

Travis
That lift has been promised from SuperLift for about 4 years now,don't hold your breath for it.Best bet is to check out Al's 6" IFS lift or join the few "crazy" poeple and do a SFA swap.
Author:  Skyjump136 [ Fri Aug 03, 2007 8:49 am ]
Post subject: 
We're all fairly familiar with the Liberator. Without a new front diff to go with it then there isn't much point. We can get 3" out of the Frankenlift. We can even do a small cradle drop to get the additional 1". But without a new diff we are limited to 32" tires (most run 31") or face breakage issues. Bring us a solution for the front diff and people will pay handsomely.
Author:  scrambledKJ [ Fri Aug 03, 2007 9:40 am ]
Post subject:  front end issues
Everyone says that 33's will destroy the front end. Has anyone here actually broken theirs? What is the weakness of the front chunk? I have been building jeeps and trucks for many years and have seen many aluminum IFS front ends. Fords and Chevys use em and I have put 38's on both many times. Is it spinning bearings in the housing? I think with the correct geometry, the front diff should be fine. It is when the driveshaft and CVs are put into a bind that you can tear up the housing.

I've seen Dana 60 axle shafts break with 36's and a bad driver and I have seen 37's on a POS ranger that never had any problem offroad. I have never seen a broken KJ though. Actually, never saw one offroad. I hope to see mine soon.

Travis
Author:  Jeepjeepster [ Fri Aug 03, 2007 10:07 am ]
Post subject: 
From what we can gather, the pinion gear climbs the ring gear and spits the housing in half. Some people have put a collar around the input and Ive yet to hear of a care failing with that collar in place..
Author:  0311_DoC [ Fri Aug 03, 2007 10:09 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Real 4" Knuckle Lift
tjkj2002 wrote:
scrambledKJ wrote:
What would you guys expect to pay for a true 4 inch Knuckle lift? Rear springs, front springs, new cast knucle, LCA drop brackets, and shocks? with the exception of the longer wheelbase arms, it would be like this one:
http://www.4wdandsportutility.com/featu ... y_concept/

Also, how many folks do you think would buy one?

Travis
That lift has been promised from SuperLift for about 4 years now,don't hold your breath for it.Best bet is to check out Al's 6" IFS lift or join the few "crazy" poeple and do a SFA swap.


Speaking of Al's has anyone heard anything new on it?
Author:  ATXKJ [ Fri Aug 03, 2007 10:19 am ]
Post subject: 
A new knuckle whould change the position of the wheel with respect to the A arms - but that's not the fundamental problem.

The 2 1/2" lift limit was a function of the CV angles - not the ability to raise the springs, if you design a 4" knuckle lift - it's only one part of the package - you need to drop the front diff i.e. What Al did or make new CV's - which no one has done, or do the gear drive at the wheels as in Hummer H1.

if you want more than 2 1/2" - start looking at SFA.
Author:  spoonplugger1 [ Sat Aug 04, 2007 12:05 pm ]
Post subject: 
The 4 inch GC and Commander lift is around $2500 about the same to have it installed I'd guess. Quite a bit of cutting and welding involved.
The front diffs on our Libs go south when you get a litttle air under the wheels with some power added, like on a stairstep or something I understand.
Author:  Guest [ Sat Aug 04, 2007 2:06 pm ]
Post subject: 
Does anyone know what they did about the front diff & CVs on the Liberator? If they have 35s + a 4 inch lift on that, then there is an answer somewhere.
Author:  KW AV8R [ Sat Aug 04, 2007 2:14 pm ]
Post subject: 
Jeepjeepster wrote:
From what we can gather, the pinion gear climbs the ring gear and spits the housing in half. Some people have put a collar around the input and Ive yet to hear of a care failing with that collar in place..


That's exactly the problem... pinion gear climbing and splitting the housing from the input bearing all the way back. There have been about 2 dozen housing broken in the past 2 years on this board alone. The collar is just a stop-gap type fix but isn't really resolving the problem. I know alot of other vehicles are running an aluminum front differential on IFS suspensions but how many of them are cast aluminum spec'ed to the minumum standard? I think if someone came up with a steel front diff and some true high angle CVs then you would see more larger lifts come out.
Author:  spoonplugger1 [ Sat Aug 04, 2007 3:11 pm ]
Post subject: 
There a few posts here with the specs for the Liberator. If I remember right neither the front or rear ends are stock Liberty.
Author:  USAFCOP [ Sat Aug 04, 2007 4:59 pm ]
Post subject: 
yep they used the grand's steel front diff
Author:  TDI4BY [ Sat Aug 04, 2007 6:49 pm ]
Post subject: 
Why can't the liberator setup be duplicated? They must have plans and tooling?
Author:  scrambledKJ [ Sat Aug 04, 2007 7:37 pm ]
Post subject:  dupicated
They can duplicate the lift. The drop brackets are just plate steel. It is the knuckles that are the big money. The Liberator had plate steel knuckles. To do a cast knuckle requires molds, test fits and production at a foundry. Thats the stuff that gets expensive and cannot be done in house. You gotta sell a bunch of kits to make up for that cost. or just charge an arm and a leg for a few.

But back to my original question, what do you all think would be a reasonable price for such a kit?

Travis
Author:  Guest [ Sat Aug 04, 2007 9:48 pm ]
Post subject: 
USAFCOP wrote:
yep they used the grand's steel front diff


What about the half shafts & CV joints?
Author:  tjkj2002 [ Sun Aug 05, 2007 11:37 am ]
Post subject:  Re: dupicated
scrambledKJ wrote:
They can duplicate the lift. The drop brackets are just plate steel. It is the knuckles that are the big money. The Liberator had plate steel knuckles. To do a cast knuckle requires molds, test fits and production at a foundry. Thats the stuff that gets expensive and cannot be done in house. You gotta sell a bunch of kits to make up for that cost. or just charge an arm and a leg for a few.

But back to my original question, what do you all think would be a reasonable price for such a kit?

Travis
If your looking for a price for a kit that will never be made look at how much a SuperLift 4" kit for a Nwer Grand(with IFS) costs and you'll get a good idea.

Oh by the way you can buy the SuperLift prototype knuckes for the KJ(from SuperLift) for $2500 apiece.
Author:  Guest [ Mon Aug 06, 2007 6:24 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: dupicated
tjkj2002 wrote:
Oh by the way you can buy the SuperLift prototype knuckes for the KJ(from SuperLift) for $2500 apiece.


If they were brought into production, rather than being a limited run custom prototype, the price would drop significantly.

Of course, there needs to be significant demand before any company will bring it into production.
Author:  Tokyojoe [ Mon Aug 06, 2007 9:23 pm ]
Post subject: 
So Grand Cherokees and Commanders have a bigger demand?

I live in Jeep country here in Colorado (you can't drive a single mile w/o seeing a Jeep) and have yet to see a Commander with a lift (here, not in pictures) and can count on my hands the number of Grands with lifts I have seen in my six + yrs here. I have seen more KJ's with lifts (in Denver metro - excluding my LOST friends here) than Commanders and Grands.....and they DO have the big lifts available!
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