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4 wheel and the rain
http://www.lostjeeps.com/forum/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=3&t=3167		 Page 1 of 2
Author:  Ron [ Tue Nov 01, 2005 10:52 pm ]
Post subject:  4 wheel and the rain
I've read in a couple of places about people putting the Lib in 4 hi in a rain storm. I'm not asking about all wheel drive just the 2 to 4 wheel. I've never heard of this before and anyone I ask with a 4x4 has never done it either. Is this an east coast thing? I can see using it to take off from a light on a steep hill (James Street in Seattle) but not just crusing in a rain storm...Am I missing something? Just asking... :)
Author:  bighause [ Tue Nov 01, 2005 11:08 pm ]
Post subject: 
2x should be fine in the rain, as you drive like it is raining and realize it won't stop as fast a normal. I have select-trac and I never use the full-time option. Maybe if it was snowing?

I don't think that wet roads would be a slick enough surface to keep the transfer case from binding around corners anyways.
Author:  Ron [ Tue Nov 01, 2005 11:19 pm ]
Post subject: 
That's pretty much what I was thinking. I've never thrown my truck into 4hi on the road unless it was snowing. Never heard or thought of doing it in the rain...
Author:  krazz1e [ Wed Nov 02, 2005 12:32 am ]
Post subject: 
rain, i keep it in 2 wheel. Ice and snow under 40mph going straight i will pop it into 4 wheel high part time. Remeber will help you go but not help you slow.
Author:  LimitedLurker [ Wed Nov 02, 2005 11:17 am ]
Post subject: 
I've used 4Hi in the rain many times. When the rain first starts or in a light rain when oil and dust are still on the road it helps with starting and stopping. Also a huge help in any rain with the stock tires. In heavy rain when the water accumulates on the surface of the road or there's a chance of hitting a puddle and hydroplaning is a concern.

4wd can help stop. I think it was people from around here that have done some pretty reasonable testing and had measurable improvements. I think it was around 8-10%. Reasons could be many but 2 come to mind right off. Any mechanical system is inefficient so engaging the 4wd system ads inefficiency and this is the equivalent of breaking. The extra traction of 4wd prevents skids so you can apply more breaking pressure without loosing control. The extra traction of 4wd could also allow you to maneuver in such a way as to avoid situations. In 2wd those maneuvers may result in a skid. Rear-wheel drive is the most prone to skidding.
Author:  Calvin56 [ Wed Nov 02, 2005 5:27 pm ]
Post subject: 
I use 4wd in any kind of precipitation, not that you need it to drive safetly, but it is an extra safety net. It really was useful when I still had SRA's on. In rain, they would slide on the roads horribly.
Author:  nails023 [ Wed Nov 02, 2005 6:03 pm ]
Post subject: 
Here in Iceland we get a lot of rain. I use 4HI a lot here just as a safety precaution. I have not had any issues with it binding up or anything like that.
Author:  bennybmn [ Wed Nov 02, 2005 8:01 pm ]
Post subject: 
I wouldn't be worried about binding, I would be worried that with reduced traction, in a turn, the binding would kick a tire loose and possibly induce a skid. Like someone before me said, 4wd helps you go (and maybe slow a litttttttle) in a straight line. Believe me, so many flatlanders go up to Vermont in theur SUVs and go off the first corner they come to. 4wd adds weight which adds momentum!!!

And remember, 4wd doesn't automatically equal more TRACTION! It just means more wheels spinning. Traction requirest the tires to be in contact with the pavement.
Author:  AdamIsAdam [ Wed Nov 02, 2005 10:08 pm ]
Post subject: 
I have full time 4WD and ALWAYS use it in the rain. Amazing difference, especially in traffic and pulling out into traffic. Just punch it and go. Incredible. It's why I wanted the Selec-Trac!
Author:  1stJeepKJ [ Wed Nov 02, 2005 10:53 pm ]
Post subject: 
AdamIsAdam wrote:
I have full time 4WD and ALWAYS use it in the rain. Amazing difference, especially in traffic and pulling out into traffic. Just punch it and go. Incredible. It's why I wanted the Selec-Trac!


Me too! Full time for the rain and snow works great. No worries about the front end slipping since it doesn't have to spin the same speed as the rear.
Author:  Cacher123 [ Thu Nov 03, 2005 12:43 am ]
Post subject: 
Quote:
when I still had SRA's on. In rain, they would slide on the roads horribly.

Tell me about it! :cry:
Author:  Bri [ Thu Nov 03, 2005 8:55 am ]
Post subject: 
LimitedLurker wrote:
4wd can help stop. I think it was people from around here that have done some pretty reasonable testing and had measurable improvements. I think it was around 8-10%.


I don't know about in a Liberty (yet), but in my TJ, 4Hi cuts stopping distance on ice or packed snow tremendously (much more than 10%) and makes it much more controllable.

The actual reason is that normally brakes are biased heavily to the front wheels for stopping power (70-80% is pretty common). Being in 4Hi, due to the front and rear drive shafts being locked together, all of the brakes are effectively working on all the wheels through the drivetrain. This makes the brake bias 50-50 front-rear and it also makes it nearly impossibly to lock up one wheel (although you can lock up one front and one rear wheel easily enough).

With the short wheelbase and high center of gravity on the TJ, it is really easy to get sideways on a slick surface with hard braking in 2WD, but in 4WD stopping is far, far easier.

It won't be 'til January until I can find out if the same is true in my KJ. I'm guessing the effect won't be as noticeably with the longer wheelbase, but it should still be significant enough to be easily noticeable.

Note that this "brake sharing" benefit is only present when using a "part-time" 4WD. AWD vehicles and full-time 4WD doesn't help at all with stopping.
Author:  kjfishman [ Thu Nov 03, 2005 10:36 am ]
Post subject:  I use it
Sometimes I used 4 Hi (part time) on my 02 when it was raining. My new one has Select Trac so sometimes I use the full time when its raining. I used it more when the crappy OEM Goodyears were still on them.
Author:  Ron [ Thu Nov 03, 2005 12:16 pm ]
Post subject: 
This is interesting. Again I understand the all wheel driver factor but tossing it in 4hi in the rain? I would think if you drive for the conditions standard 4hi wouldn't be needed but then I'm still trying to figure out this Jeep select trac, partime, full time 4x4 stuff. But this is interesting how people handle driving in the rain. Thanks for trying to help me understand...
Author:  Calvin56 [ Thu Nov 03, 2005 9:57 pm ]
Post subject: 
Driving for the conditions is understood. The 4Hi is a safety net for me. A little extra protection. BTW, the 4hi doesn't bind up in normal turns for me, just U-turns, sharp turns.

On of the biggest advantages is accelerating out of a turn at a stop. If you get into the gas too much (while driving for the conditions and accidently pushing to hard on the gas), you might accidently get the rear tires to cut loose with the force of acceleration + the force of the turn. If you are in 4hi, the front tires can "pull" the vehicle through the turn with less of a slide than a 2wd sliding around a corner.
Author:  labman1 [ Thu Nov 03, 2005 10:29 pm ]
Post subject: 
I don't even consider using 4 wheel in the rain. You literally have to floor it around a sharp corner to get the the tires to break loose... and so what if they do spin a little, just ease up on the gas. I notice a big difference in mpg when we use 4 wheel in the winter when we get feet of snow at a time and the roads are snow covered for weeks at a time. I only use it when I need it.
Author:  kjfishman [ Thu Nov 03, 2005 11:21 pm ]
Post subject:  the reason you don't is...
labman1 wrote:
I don't even consider using 4 wheel in the rain. You literally have to floor it around a sharp corner to get the the tires to break loose... and so what if they do spin a little, just ease up on the gas. I notice a big difference in mpg when we use 4 wheel in the winter when we get feet of snow at a time and the roads are snow covered for weeks at a time. I only use it when I need it.


You got rid of the Goodyear tires, the rest of us need 4wd to compensate for the really bad OEM tires. How many rant's does Jeep need to see before they figure out what a poor choice they made for OEM.
Author:  Guest [ Fri Nov 04, 2005 4:52 am ]
Post subject: 
4wd with no center diff is just a flat out bad idea on anything that doesn't produce instant wheelspin with ANY level of throttle input in 2wd. absolutely no point in trying to break your rig during the rain simply because you don't know how to drive.
Author:  MattyMac1 [ Fri Nov 04, 2005 11:23 am ]
Post subject: 
hi, thats what i think too . I have used it here a few times in the rain just because the stock tires are so so so bad. I almost spun the whole jeep around 3 times during normal driving going through intersections and turns.With 4wh hi on you don't worry about that. I don't really think you need to use it though.. I just needed better tires,which I'll be getting soon..REVO's!!!! I really can't believe how bad those SR-A's are...PATHETIC!! :roll:
Author:  Calvin56 [ Fri Nov 04, 2005 2:16 pm ]
Post subject: 
ThunderbirdJunkie wrote:
no point in trying to break your rig during the rain simply because you don't know how to drive.


Why does everyone have to go assuming we do it because we don't know how to drive? Simmer down down, you don't have to start insulting us.
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