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ARB or DTT in the rear
http://www.lostjeeps.com/forum/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=3&t=87315		 Page 1 of 2
Author:  mass-hole [ Fri Oct 20, 2017 1:29 pm ]
Post subject:  ARB or DTT in the rear
I am finally getting around to doing some traction aids for my jeep. I really like the idea of a DTT front and rear but I am hoping someone can weigh in on actual real world use. I know it would never be as good as a locker in true off-road situations but how good is it? Does it function well with the TCS system that the 06+ jeeps have(4 wheel ABS)? I figured that might make up for some of the downsides of the DTT, like when you lift a tire the abs might help to redirect torque better than with an open diff.

I am 99% sure I will stick to a DTT in the front no matter what.
Author:  tjkj2002 [ Fri Oct 20, 2017 9:15 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: ARB or DTT in the rear
DTT = front

ARB = rear


A very good combo for the KJ.
Author:  sdg [ Sat Oct 21, 2017 4:15 am ]
Post subject:  Re: ARB or DTT in the rear
On a '07 KJ, I have DTTs both front and rear. They work along with the TCS very well. I decided against ARB for cost and simplicity of installation/operation reasons.

The DTT in the front (helped by the 1.5" spacers I have on all 4 wheels) does change a bit the way the jeep steers, if you push hard on the gas while turning, the front "overbites" and drags you more in the direction to which you steer; that's only in extreme cases, though, just don't race the BMWs on narrow city streets and you're good :)

tjkj2002, can you please give more details on why the DTT should be in the front and the ARB in the rear? I always thought it should be the other way round not to mess with steering (e.g. is only to be engaged when the DTT in the back and the traction control are not enough to get you out of an off-road obstacle). Thanks!
Author:  tjkj2002 [ Sat Oct 21, 2017 6:14 am ]
Post subject:  Re: ARB or DTT in the rear
sdg wrote:

tjkj2002, can you please give more details on why the DTT should be in the front and the ARB in the rear? I always thought it should be the other way round not to mess with steering (e.g. is only to be engaged when the DTT in the back and the traction control are not enough to get you out of an off-road obstacle). Thanks!

The DTT was designed for front applications.
Author:  sdg [ Sat Oct 21, 2017 7:19 am ]
Post subject:  Re: ARB or DTT in the rear
tjkj2002 wrote:
sdg wrote:

tjkj2002, can you please give more details on why the DTT should be in the front and the ARB in the rear? I always thought it should be the other way round not to mess with steering (e.g. is only to be engaged when the DTT in the back and the traction control are not enough to get you out of an off-road obstacle). Thanks!

The DTT was designed for front applications.


Thanks :) So maybe then it's more the spacers than the DTT in the front in my case. Anyway, I'm happy with DTTs in both axle diffs. Good luck to the OP.
Author:  mass-hole [ Sat Oct 21, 2017 1:38 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: ARB or DTT in the rear
sdg wrote:
tjkj2002 wrote:
sdg wrote:

tjkj2002, can you please give more details on why the DTT should be in the front and the ARB in the rear? I always thought it should be the other way round not to mess with steering (e.g. is only to be engaged when the DTT in the back and the traction control are not enough to get you out of an off-road obstacle). Thanks!

The DTT was designed for front applications.


Thanks :) So maybe then it's more the spacers than the DTT in the front in my case. Anyway, I'm happy with DTTs in both axle diffs. Good luck to the OP.


Yeah I put spacers on my quad and it did the same thing. Much harder to steer.

I would imagine a dtt in the front would pull you more since you can use both tires to pull you.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Author:  mass-hole [ Sat Oct 21, 2017 1:38 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: ARB or DTT in the rear
tjkj2002 wrote:
DTT = front

ARB = rear


A very good combo for the KJ.


Thanks


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Author:  tjkj2002 [ Sat Oct 21, 2017 7:49 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: ARB or DTT in the rear
sdg wrote:
Thanks :) So maybe then it's more the spacers than the DTT in the front in my case. Anyway, I'm happy with DTTs in both axle diffs. Good luck to the OP.

Yeah the wider you are without the correct modifications will result in harder steering since you drastically change the SAI angle.

The DTT will be very noticeable in the front,even in 2wd, for a bit but once you get used to it you never notice it.It does "return to center" faster then stock.
Author:  ATXKJ [ Mon Oct 23, 2017 7:35 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: ARB or DTT in the rear
I have DTT front and rear
I thought that was a great combination

and then

front CV axles had to be replaced and replacements were delayed
ran around with only rear traction and DTT
as soon as one wheel broke loose - all power transferred to the other - so it spun too
I would powerslide around corners

I would have been much, much better off with an open rear diff
which is the option the ARB gives you.

If I did it again - I'd go DTT front (always works great) and ARB rear
Author:  mass-hole [ Mon Oct 23, 2017 7:48 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: ARB or DTT in the rear
ATXKJ wrote:
I have DTT front and rear
I thought that was a great combination

and then

front CV axles had to be replaced and replacements were delayed
ran around with only rear traction and DTT
as soon as one wheel broke loose - all power transferred to the other - so it spun too
I would powerslide around corners

I would have been much, much better off with an open rear diff
which is the option the ARB gives you.

If I did it again - I'd go DTT front (always works great) and ARB rear


Thats strange because my Subaru Legacy was a torsen rear diff and never had that issue. It was AWD but it favored the rear. Same with the STI, thats torsens front and rear.
Author:  tjkj2002 [ Tue Oct 24, 2017 12:16 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: ARB or DTT in the rear
mass-hole wrote:

Thats strange because my Subaru Legacy was a torsen rear diff and never had that issue. It was AWD but it favored the rear. Same with the STI, thats torsens front and rear.

Subaru's favor the front wheels,in only extreme cases and not for very long will they transfer more torque to the rear wheels then the fronts.

And yes I'm very familiar with there AWD systems,even there newest systems.They are not what they are made out to be and just add very expensive parts to a system that can be done for so much cheaper and more reliable.

Even the older Subaru's with a actual selectable t-case was FWD in the "2WD" mode.
Author:  u2slow [ Thu Oct 26, 2017 2:24 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: ARB or DTT in the rear
My Dodge has a Lockright (rear) and I drive it daily. The KJ has a stock posi, and its driven daily.

Personally, I would have a really hard time going to an open diff again (i.e. ARB off). I've gotten used to having traction by default... not something I have to turn on for special circumstances. I don't like DD'ing with a spool either.

tjkj2002 wrote:
The DTT will be very noticeable in the front,even in 2wd, for a bit but once you get used to it you never notice it.It does "return to center" faster then stock.


I'm surprised. The No-Slip I installed in the front does nothing weird in 2wd.
Author:  mass-hole [ Thu Oct 26, 2017 2:29 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: ARB or DTT in the rear
tjkj2002 wrote:
mass-hole wrote:

Thats strange because my Subaru Legacy was a torsen rear diff and never had that issue. It was AWD but it favored the rear. Same with the STI, thats torsens front and rear.

Subaru's favor the front wheels,in only extreme cases and not for very long will they transfer more torque to the rear wheels then the fronts.

And yes I'm very familiar with there AWD systems,even there newest systems.They are not what they are made out to be and just add very expensive parts to a system that can be done for so much cheaper and more reliable.

Even the older Subaru's with a actual selectable t-case was FWD in the "2WD" mode.


Only in the Autos was that true and I think even then it was only the non-turbo'd ones that were front biased. The manual trans subarus(newer ones, like 04-up)were rear biased or 50:50. STI's you could set the bias via a switch(DCCD)
Author:  mass-hole [ Thu Oct 26, 2017 2:33 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: ARB or DTT in the rear
u2slow wrote:
My Dodge has a Lockright (rear) and I drive it daily. The KJ has a stock posi, and its driven daily.

Personally, I would have a really hard time going to an open diff again (i.e. ARB off). I've gotten used to having traction by default... not something I have to turn on for special circumstances. I don't like DD'ing with a spool either.

tjkj2002 wrote:
The DTT will be very noticeable in the front,even in 2wd, for a bit but once you get used to it you never notice it.It does "return to center" faster then stock.


I'm surprised. The No-Slip I installed in the front does nothing weird in 2wd.


I agree. I dont like having a locker in my F150 but its also not used for any serious offroad scenarios. If it were not for the full auto 4x4 mode I would probably have swapped it for a DTT at this point. Luckily I can put it in 4Auto and it can vary the torque on the fly(no its not like GMs auto 4x4 that just engages and disengages when it sense slip.)
Author:  Mountainman [ Thu Oct 26, 2017 2:54 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: ARB or DTT in the rear
[quote="u2slow"]My Dodge has a Lockright (rear) and I drive it daily. The KJ has a stock posi, and its driven daily.

Personally, I would have a really hard time going to an open diff again (i.e. ARB off). I've gotten used to having traction by default... not something I have to turn on for special circumstances. I don't like DD'ing with a spool either.

Since you put kilometers, I assume that you're in Canada? How is that lockright on an icy corner in winter? My vote is an OX in the rear, but auto lockers are amazing if the downsides don't make them a poor option. I've had an Aussie locker in the front (old 4 runner), and other than the fact that you could not be in 4wd on pavement, it was amazing in deep snow on steep mountains, and elsewhere too.
Author:  mass-hole [ Thu Oct 26, 2017 3:34 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: ARB or DTT in the rear
Mountainman wrote:
u2slow wrote:
My Dodge has a Lockright (rear) and I drive it daily. The KJ has a stock posi, and its driven daily.

Personally, I would have a really hard time going to an open diff again (i.e. ARB off). I've gotten used to having traction by default... not something I have to turn on for special circumstances. I don't like DD'ing with a spool either.

Since you put kilometers, I assume that you're in Canada? How is that lockright on an icy corner in winter? My vote is an OX in the rear, but auto lockers are amazing if the downsides don't make them a poor option. I've had an Aussie locker in the front (old 4 runner), and other than the fact that you could not be in 4wd on pavement, it was amazing in deep snow on steep mountains, and elsewhere too.


darn thats right, I forgot we had this discussion about the OX locker not that long ago. I think they have one for the 8.25 and D30, but because the D30A was a different cover so it wouldnt work.
Author:  u2slow [ Thu Oct 26, 2017 3:39 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: ARB or DTT in the rear
Mountainman wrote:
Since you put kilometers, I assume that you're in Canada? How is that lockright on an icy corner in winter? My vote is an OX in the rear, but auto lockers are amazing if the downsides don't make them a poor option. I've had an Aussie locker in the front (old 4 runner), and other than the fact that you could not be in 4wd on pavement, it was amazing in deep snow on steep mountains, and elsewhere too.


Yup - BC, Canada. I'm about 30-40 miles west of Bellingham WA.

IMO, the icy-corner front-locker winter thing is a joke. Learn to operate your equipment. You let off the throttle to get your steerage back... and highways aren't curved enough anyway. I've driven to Fort Nelson and back in January. Routinely take the Coquihalla to the interior in winter months. The few scary moments I've had are from pushing 2wd too far. (overly concerned about part-time tcase :roll: ) I don't do that anymore. 4wd gets used when there's any ice/snow, or its freezing. Could be 60mph on a sunny winter day with ice patches... or gently chugging along at 20mph during a white-out snowstorm.
Author:  GordnadoCRD [ Thu Oct 26, 2017 6:30 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: ARB or DTT in the rear
If memory serves, GM's first use of a Torsen unit was in the transfer case. They used Detroit locker in front, with manual locking hubs, clutch pack Posi in the rear, and Torsen in the transfer case.
Author:  tjkj2002 [ Thu Oct 26, 2017 6:52 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: ARB or DTT in the rear
GordnadoCRD wrote:
If memory serves, GM's first use of a Torsen unit was in the transfer case. They used Detroit locker in front, with manual locking hubs, clutch pack Posi in the rear, and Torsen in the transfer case.

GM never installed a factory auto locker(Like a Detroit) in the front diff of any vehicle they make and sell.
Author:  GordnadoCRD [ Thu Oct 26, 2017 10:40 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: ARB or DTT in the rear
I've had 2.
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