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Hard to find noise -- clinking and clanking
http://www.lostjeeps.com/forum/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=3&t=87478		 Page 12 of 55
Author:  CaptainDean [ Wed Jun 13, 2018 9:25 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Hard to find noise -- clinking and clanking
turblediesel wrote:
I vote for a fresh set for your fresh engine.

Received a $120 complete set of new rocker arms today from someplace in England via eBay. Also received one $32 rocker arm/lifter set from IDParts to replace the single broken set.

Started the Standard Timing alignment procedure but I didn't have the flex plate on. The flex plate has the hole that aligns with an empty bolt hole in the back of the engine block for an exact 90-deg ATDC. It's dark now, but tomorrow I'll take some pictures and edit this posting.

So, I put the flex plate on and got the alignment perfect. Tomorrow or this weekend I'll get the rocker arms/lifters in and get the timing belt on.

Dean.
Author:  CaptainDean [ Fri Jun 22, 2018 1:19 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Hard to find noise -- clinking and clanking
How do I identify a hardened bolt? What class are hardened bolts?

Specifically, the bolts that hold the flex plate on are hardened and I need a new set. I heated mine to get them off, so I don't want to put them back.

The tightening process is: Tighten all to 37 ft / lbs, then loosen all. Re-tighten one at a time in clockwise opposition pattern to 20 ft / lbs, then turn 60° more.

Can this process be used on any hardened bolt? ...it sounds like another relief bolt situation.

Dean.
Author:  GordnadoCRD [ Fri Jun 22, 2018 1:37 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Hard to find noise -- clinking and clanking
The bolts that hold the flexplate on, as well as the bolts that hold the flexplate to the Torque Converter are unique,and should be replaced by bolts of the appropriate part number. They are not only hardened, they have special threads. (slightly different angled thread facings) These are very particular about torque. "+just a little bump more" will often result in the bolts failing during service. Someone here had their TC bolts snap off, and sent in pictures that clearly showed the bolts snapped from over-torque, not sheared due to engine torque.

Regarding hardened bolts,
SAE bolts (fractional inch sizes) will have either smooth bolt heads (grade3) 3 radial raised bars (grade 5) Or 6 radial raised bars (grade 8. ).

All hardened metric bolts that I have seen will have 8.8 marked on the head. I'm not surprised if there are more
Author:  GordnadoCRD [ Fri Jun 22, 2018 1:47 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Hard to find noise -- clinking and clanking
https://www.hi-tensilebolt.com.au/bolt-strength-grades-and-head-markings/
Author:  CaptainDean [ Wed Jun 27, 2018 1:11 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Hard to find noise -- clinking and clanking
GordnadoCRD wrote:
https://www.hi-tensilebolt.com.au/bolt-strength-grades-and-head-markings/

Thanks GordnadoCRD for the education of hardened bolts. I got some 8.8 bolts from Fastenal that should work perfectly. I got hex head bolts so I won't ever have to worry about the 6-spline drivers breaking.

I had contacted VM Specialists about getting a set, but by the time they responded I had already gotten bolts from Fastenal.

Dean.
Author:  CaptainDean [ Wed Jun 27, 2018 1:43 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Hard to find noise -- clinking and clanking
JieselDeep wrote:
There's a free liberty CRD on Craigslist at the moment, as well as one listed for $500... I think they may be one and the same, given that the description I got when I enquired about the free one, matches the photos in the $500 listing.

JieselDeep,

It was really good to meet you and spend the day ravaging that 2006 Liberty CRD. You got a trailer full of stuff, most of which you'll take to metal recycling. I hope you got enough to make it worthwhile.

I got the engine / trans / transfer case, and a few more parts my CRD was asking for. Thanks for sharing the heater fan control panel, that will make the insides much nicer.

The following Monday I went back to Paauilo and met a tow truck driver. The day was successful but everything went wrong. We had a good time straightening out each issue:
1) Hooking up the the tow truck should have taken 15 to 20 minutes -- it took an hour.
2) Going up the concrete private drive to the main county road, he dropped one set off wheels of the edge of the concrete and high-centered his tow dolly under the rear end. That took another half hour to rectify.
3) My fault: I did not expect a 40-minute drive from Paauilo to Hilo Scrap Metal. Oh well.
4) I was worrying about a $2/pound bill. Yikes! The hulk weighed 1.4 tons and the bill was only $133. What a relief! Turns out it was $2/100 lbs. We could have left the doors on and would not have suffered very much.
5) Attempted to pay the tow driver but my CC would not go though. Hmmm.
6) Had to leave some collateral at the Scrap Metal yard while I went to get cash, so I left my personal phone. Went to a nearby Credit Union (not mine) and took a non-member cash advance. I needed by PIN which was in my phone left as collateral. Made a trip there and back and read the awaiting text's. One was from my CU asking about credit Fraud about the tow driver attempted payment.
7) Responded to the CU text and a few minutes later the CC went through without further problems.
8) <--Hmmm. Characters "[eight]-[close parentheses]" makes a smiley face with sunglasses. Got the cash from the local CU and paid the Scrap Metal yard.

The remainder of the day was uneventful.

Dean.
Author:  JieselDeep [ Wed Jun 27, 2018 2:37 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Hard to find noise -- clinking and clanking
Holy cow, what a process! Sorry for all the troubles. I'm actually contemplating putting all the white doors and hood onto my dark green Jeep and trying to make it look intentional. It could be incredibly ugly, or just kind of fun. I'd have to trade the window mechanisms from my Jeep, but that is doable. I don't know if that would be any better than just having the two doors on one side mismatched. I'll still have the creases before and after the doors, but we'll see how inspired I am on the day I end up doing it!

It was wonderful to finally meet you too! I'm glad we got what you wanted pulled without too much trouble!

I'm actually wishing I had thought to take just a few more things now that I'm getting back to my Jeep. But that's the nature of those kinds of things. Hindsight is 20:20.

Oh well, I'm thrilled with what I did get, so, until the next opportunity comes along, I've got plenty to do!

Also, random thing, but my father is building a couple of replaceable thermostats based on the Kapalzinsky(sp?) design that floated around here a couple years ago. I acquired two stock thermostats awhile back and Dad was inspired to work on machining them this week. I told him no real rush on my part, so I'll probably pick them up in a minute when we visit them, but I don't need two thermostats for one Jeep.


It made my wife happy to have decent speakers retrofitted into her Dakota, even if I didn't start that project until the kids had gone to bed. Only took an hour and I had to cut and crimp connectors on all 8 of the wires... So when she came out at 11pm to see what the heck I got distracted by, she just shook her head... But she did say 'thank you' before she went back inside.

By the way, I'm headed into town Sunday morning, could I bring the hoist by at that time? Do you need it sooner? I can drive in after work tomorrow if needed. Work ended up sending me South this week instead of North, so I haven't been anywhere near your neighborhood to drop it as I passed.

Thanks again,
Jon

Sent from my XT1710-02 using Tapatalk
Author:  Grotsoldaat [ Wed Jun 27, 2018 2:45 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Hard to find noise -- clinking and clanking
CaptainDean wrote:
The day was successful but everything went wrong. We had a good time straightening out each issue:

:shock:

The remainder of the day was uneventful.

Dean.


Was there anything left from the day..? Looks like I'm not the only friend of Mr Murphy... :mrgreen:
Author:  CaptainDean [ Mon Jul 02, 2018 1:05 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Hard to find noise -- clinking and clanking
It's been a while, but I'm finally back on track. Got to 3rd base today by installing the timing belt. Cranked it around probably 10 times and finally got it stable. One lesson here is don't paint the front of the block where the timing belt tensioner installs. The paint acts as a slippery surface that the tensioner cannot grip. Scraped of the paint in that area and the tensioner stayed put.

I did get surprised by the new injector -- it came with a copper washer at the bottom but no o-ring. Tomorrow I'll get an o-ring and install that bugger. For some reason I cannot find my old injector anyplace. Any of you seen it?

Image

Dean.
Author:  JieselDeep [ Mon Jul 02, 2018 1:17 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Hard to find noise -- clinking and clanking
Isn't there an O ring in that spare engine you have?

Sent from my XT1710-02 using Tapatalk
Author:  Grotsoldaat [ Mon Jul 02, 2018 2:44 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Hard to find noise -- clinking and clanking
CaptainDean wrote:
For some reason I cannot find my old injector anyplace. Any of you seen it?

Dean.


Might it have been the one running down the street shouting "Yeeellloooowwww ooh noo..."? I presume it went bananas after seeing the colour... :BANANA:
Author:  GordnadoCRD [ Mon Jul 02, 2018 3:05 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Hard to find noise -- clinking and clanking
the others are singing "we all live in a yellow CRD, a yellow CRD..."
Author:  WWDiesel [ Mon Jul 02, 2018 11:16 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Hard to find noise -- clinking and clanking
Dean, is that "Caterpillar Yellow"?
Certainly makes it stand out. :shock:
An old timer boss and owner of a Speed Shop/Machine Shop that I once worked in years ago always said, " if you can't make it run real fast, at least make it look like it can"! :lol:
He was a firm believer in cleaning and painting engine blocks and components.
Also makes spotting leaks of any kind super easy to find... :wink:

:SOMBRERO:
Author:  CaptainDean [ Mon Jul 02, 2018 11:32 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Hard to find noise -- clinking and clanking
JieselDeep wrote:
Isn't there an O ring in that spare engine you have?

So far I've pulled out one injector from the Paauilo engine and the o-ring was trashed. I'll just pick one up on the way home from work today.

Dean.
Author:  CaptainDean [ Tue Jul 03, 2018 4:28 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Hard to find noise -- clinking and clanking
WWDiesel wrote:
Dean, is that "Caterpillar Yellow"? Certainly makes it stand out. :shock: An old timer boss and owner of a Speed Shop/Machine Shop that I once worked in years ago always said, " if you can't make it run real fast, at least make it look like it can"! :lol: He was a firm believer in cleaning and painting engine blocks and components. Also makes spotting leaks of any kind super easy to find... :wink: :SOMBRERO:

I painted my 5.9 Cummins Caterpillar yellow and really liked it. This time I went to another parts store and only found "Yellow". It's a little brighter than Caterpillar yellow.

Being able to see the engine with my head stuck under the hood is my goal. I never liked looking at a black engine in the shade.

Dean.
Author:  CaptainDean [ Tue Jul 03, 2018 4:31 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Hard to find noise -- clinking and clanking
GordnadoCRD wrote:
the others are singing "we all live in a yellow CRD, a yellow CRD..."

You might have some subliminal reasoning. I used to work for Atlantis Submarines. I was always disappointed that their subs were white.

Dean.
Author:  CaptainDean [ Fri Jul 06, 2018 12:58 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Hard to find noise -- clinking and clanking
Have a problem that I will address Saturday. One intake valve is leaking while cranking the engine over with a ratchet on the crankshaft bolt. I can hear it leaking back through the intake. The other 3 cylinders sound and feel perfect.

I'm hoping one intake lifter is stuck on some piece of grit.

I plan to add a full load of oil into the engine and crank it over with the starter. Might jiggle it loose.

If not, I'll take the head cover off and check all the valves for a tight seal with some light oil, maybe diesel fuel. They should all hold their level. Might have to take the head back off. That means a new gasket and new bolts. Ouch!

Dean.
Author:  GordnadoCRD [ Fri Jul 06, 2018 1:18 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Hard to find noise -- clinking and clanking
CaptainDean wrote:
Have a problem that I will address Saturday. One intake valve is leaking while cranking the engine over with a ratchet on the crankshaft bolt. I can hear it leaking back through the intake. The other 3 cylinders sound and feel perfect.

I'm hoping one intake lifter is stuck on some piece of grit.

I plan to add a full load of oil into the engine and crank it over with the starter. Might jiggle it loose.

If not, I'll take the head cover off and check all the valves for a tight seal with some light oil, maybe diesel fuel. They should all hold their level. Might have to take the head back off. That means a new gasket and new bolts. Ouch!

Dean.

The hydraulic adjusters would compensate for that, but most likely it would be a piece of cloth or "something" between a valve and seat.

I really hope the head doesn't need to come back off.
Author:  CaptainDean [ Sat Jul 07, 2018 12:11 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Hard to find noise -- clinking and clanking
GordnadoCRD wrote:
The hydraulic adjusters would compensate for that, but most likely it would be a piece of cloth or "something" between a valve and seat.

That is a good thought. I can remove the injector or glow plug and blow some compressed air into each cylinder. As a valve opens a puff of air might dislodge something. I am not proud of the cleaning job I ignored with the intake chamber. This problem might be my own sloppy work biting me in the intake valve.

Dean.
Author:  CaptainDean [ Mon Jul 09, 2018 1:40 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Hard to find noise -- clinking and clanking
Filled the crankcase and connected the battery and fuel to the engine - did not want to crank it much without lubrication. Cranked it for 2 - 3 seconds several times.

Cranked it with a ratchet afterward and did not hear leaking through the intake anymore. However, I do feel the resistance of one cylinder with really good compression, and the rest with moderate compression. I'll have to get a diesel compression tester and check it for certain.

Image
Hooked up the battery and mounted the fuel filter to the reverse-thread idler pulley location.

Image
Connected the fuel line into a gallon container of diesel, and lead the bypass line back into the same container.

I am out of time now. Monday evening I start teaching the Maritime Captain's course 6 nights a week, after a full day at work 5 days a week. This will last 1 month, then back to just my day job. Afterward I'll be able to get back to the engine.

Any comments about compression getting better and all that jazz?

Dean.
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