LOST JEEPS :: View topic - Hard to find noise -- clinking and clanking

With all the heat you've applied to the flexplate you will probably need to replace the rear main seal. Just be careful when doing so as there are a couple of thrust washers in there also that have to be put back in exactly the way they came out. Once you get the flexplate off you will find a adapter plate that will need to be removed. Then you can remove the rear main bearing support which holds the seal and thrust washers.

flash7210 wrote:

R425

Actually it's R428

Got the damaged sleeve out today. It was far easier than suspected. When a task has a $450 tool required, I expect the job to be only easy with the expensive tool. Ha ha, not so!

I removed it with an $8 brass punch. :goink:

Dean.

I cannot see or feel any block damage. I'll take it to the local machinist on Monday and get his opinion.
Today I'll attack the flex plate bolts with an oxyacetylene torch heating the heads red hot and quenching. Also cleaning up the removed parts and dissembling the one bad piston/rod.
Question:
Where can I buy a single connecting rod? IDParts only sells in sets; that's an extra $150 that I don't need to spend.

If you have an oxyacetylene set, try centering the flame (slightly carburizing) on the center of the bolt head, and when it begins to glow, quickly quench the head of the bolt. When heated the bolt expansion cannot push out against the metal it's threaded into, so it expands lengthwise.

GordnadoCRD wrote:

flash7210 wrote:

R425

Actually it's R428

Oops, typo :oops:

Yes R428

Go here: http://www.vmdieselspecialist.com/
VM DIESEL SPECIALIST LTD in England. Make sure you have the full engine number. VIN is of no use to them!

Be sure and review this LOST thread! There are different pistons/weights and they are NOT interchangeable! There are 2 different types of piston/rings used on this motor.
viewtopic.php?f=98&t=83326

WWDiesel wrote:

Go here: http://www.vmdieselspecialist.com/
VM DIESEL SPECIALIST LTD in England. Make sure you have the full engine number. VIN is of no use to them!
Be sure and review this LOST thread! There are different pistons/weights and they are NOT interchangeable! There are 2 different types of piston/rings used on this motor.
viewtopic.php?f=98&t=83326

Thanks WWDiesel,
Rats, ignorance was bliss for a while. Now I'm concerned. It sounded like nothingbutchrysler ended up buying another engine just to get his original early model 2.8L running again.
Did I understand correctly that the Sleeve/Piston/Ring set will fit both the old and new style engines? Although it is more expensive, it may be the only way to go.
How much difference in weight is there between the old style piston & new style piston? Can an engine have one new style with 3 old style pistons? Does the engine run unbalanced? Can they be changed in opposing pairs?
I did send a query into VM Diesel Specialists. Find out what sort of response I get.
Dean.

Loaded up the engine (block, head, cams assembly, removed sleeve and piston) to take to the machinist tomorrow.

Author:	flash7210 [ Tue Dec 12, 2017 9:04 am ]
Post subject:	Re: Hard to find noise -- clinking and clanking
With all the heat you've applied to the flexplate you will probably need to replace the rear main seal. Just be careful when doing so as there are a couple of thrust washers in there also that have to be put back in exactly the way they came out. Once you get the flexplate off you will find a adapter plate that will need to be removed. Then you can remove the rear main bearing support which holds the seal and thrust washers.

Author:	CaptainDean [ Wed Dec 13, 2017 1:52 am ]
Post subject:	Re: Hard to find noise -- clinking and clanking
flash7210 wrote: With all the heat you've applied to the flexplate you will probably need to replace the rear main seal. Just be careful when doing so as there are a couple of thrust washers in there also that have to be put back in exactly the way they came out. Once you get the flexplate off you will find a adapter plate that will need to be removed. Then you can remove the rear main bearing support which holds the seal and thrust washers. I am now planning to replace nearly all the bearings and seals in the engine. It spins very nicely on the main bearings. Balancing that against the extreme effort to change the main bearings, I will not change them. However, I will change the individual rod crank bearings, the piston wrist pin bearings, and the rings on 1, 2, x, 4. #3 I will replace the injector, sleeve, piston, rings, rod and bearings since it was the traumatized cylinder. The head will get rebuilt by the automotive machine shop. Certainly, the rear main and front main seals will also get changed. While I'm at it, I'll change the oil pump. It's practically new at 96000, but the oil has had a lot of black carbon blow by which has probably chewed away at it. Dean.

Author:	GordnadoCRD [ Thu Dec 14, 2017 4:15 am ]
Post subject:	Re: Hard to find noise -- clinking and clanking
OUCH Nothing like buying a brand new engine and getting the experience and knowledge of the complete internal intricacies as a bonus You realize this means whenever I have to address such issues with mine You will be explaining all those things to me...

Author:	CaptainDean [ Thu Dec 14, 2017 11:35 am ]
Post subject:	Re: Hard to find noise -- clinking and clanking
Is there a model number to the engines we have? I 'googled' VM Motori 2.8L and got a few responses. One is D704TE2 which looks similar. Dean.

Author:	flash7210 [ Thu Dec 14, 2017 2:40 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Hard to find noise -- clinking and clanking
R425

LOST JEEPS http://www.lostjeeps.com/forum/phpBB3/

Hard to find noise -- clinking and clanking http://www.lostjeeps.com/forum/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=3&t=87478	Page 4 of 55

Author:	CaptainDean [ Fri Dec 15, 2017 12:15 am ]
Post subject:	Re: Hard to find noise -- clinking and clanking
Is there a model number to the engines we have? flash7210 wrote: R425 Thanks flash7210, That is probably news to about half of us. Dean.

Author:	GordnadoCRD [ Fri Dec 15, 2017 3:05 am ]
Post subject:	Re: Hard to find noise -- clinking and clanking
flash7210 wrote: R425 Actually it's R428

Author:	flash7210 [ Fri Dec 15, 2017 6:44 am ]
Post subject:	Re: Hard to find noise -- clinking and clanking
GordnadoCRD wrote: flash7210 wrote: R425 Actually it's R428 Oops, typo Yes R428

Author:	GordnadoCRD [ Fri Dec 15, 2017 6:54 am ]
Post subject:	Re: Hard to find noise -- clinking and clanking
Yeah, no worries. That's usually why I have so many edits in my posts. I don't catch my errors until it gets submitted so I go back and edit the errors.

Author:	CaptainDean [ Sun Dec 17, 2017 2:47 am ]
Post subject:	Re: Hard to find noise -- clinking and clanking
Got the damaged sleeve out today. It was far easier than suspected. When a task has a $450 tool required, I expect the job to be only easy with the expensive tool. Ha ha, not so! I removed it with an $8 brass punch. Dean.

Author:	WWDiesel [ Sun Dec 17, 2017 10:28 am ]
Post subject:	Re: Hard to find noise -- clinking and clanking
CaptainDean wrote: Got the damaged sleeve out today. It was far easier than suspected. When a task has a $450 tool required, I expect the job to be only easy with the expensive tool. Ha ha, not so! I removed it with an $8 brass punch. Dean. Great! Hard to beat good old brass punches and hammers! Did it incur any block damage?

Author:	CaptainDean [ Sun Dec 17, 2017 1:49 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Hard to find noise -- clinking and clanking
I cannot see or feel any block damage. I'll take it to the local machinist on Monday and get his opinion. Today I'll attack the flex plate bolts with an oxyacetylene torch heating the heads red hot and quenching. Also cleaning up the removed parts and dissembling the one bad piston/rod. Question: Where can I buy a single connecting rod? IDParts only sells in sets; that's an extra $150 that I don't need to spend.

Author:	WWDiesel [ Sun Dec 17, 2017 2:18 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Hard to find noise -- clinking and clanking
CaptainDean wrote: I cannot see or feel any block damage. I'll take it to the local machinist on Monday and get his opinion. Today I'll attack the flex plate bolts with an oxyacetylene torch heating the heads red hot and quenching. Also cleaning up the removed parts and dissembling the one bad piston/rod. Question: Where can I buy a single connecting rod? IDParts only sells in sets; that's an extra $150 that I don't need to spend. Go here:> http://www.vmdieselspecialist.com/ VM DIESEL SPECIALIST LTD in England make sure you have the full engine number. VIN is of no use to them! Be sure and review this LOST thread! There are different pistons/weights and they are NOT interchangeable! There are 2 different types of piston/rings used on this motor. > viewtopic.php?f=98&t=83326

Author:	CaptainDean [ Sun Dec 17, 2017 7:39 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Hard to find noise -- clinking and clanking
GordnadoCRD wrote: If you have an oxyacetylene set, try centering the flame (slightly carburizing) on the center of the bolt head, and when it begins to glow, quickly quench the head of the bolt. When heated the bolt expansion cannot push out against the metal it's threaded into, so it expands lengthwise. Thanks GordnadoCRD, I love it when a suggested process works. I heated the bolt heads with an oxyacetylene torch until the head lightly glowed red, then quenched with about a couple cups of water. It worked perfectly. This is a new arrow in my quiver. I had a 3' section of 1" pipe and added a PVC elbow, close nipple, and cap. It held about 2 cups. I dribbled the water until empty to quench the bolt heads. It worked perfectly. THANK YOU VERY MUCH. Dean.

Page 4 of 55	All times are UTC - 5 hours [ DST ]
Powered by phpBB © 2000, 2002, 2005, 2007 phpBB Group http://www.phpbb.com/

Author:	CaptainDean [ Sun Dec 17, 2017 11:49 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Hard to find noise -- clinking and clanking
flash7210 wrote: GordnadoCRD wrote: flash7210 wrote: R425 Actually it's R428 Oops, typo Yes R428 Visited the VM Diesel Specialist website. The first thing I noticed was the list of engines in Jeeps. I thought the Liberty was in the Cherokee class? Dean.

Author:	CaptainDean [ Mon Dec 18, 2017 2:19 am ]
Post subject:	Re: Hard to find noise -- clinking and clanking
WWDiesel wrote: Go here: http://www.vmdieselspecialist.com/ VM DIESEL SPECIALIST LTD in England. Make sure you have the full engine number. VIN is of no use to them! Be sure and review this LOST thread! There are different pistons/weights and they are NOT interchangeable! There are 2 different types of piston/rings used on this motor. viewtopic.php?f=98&t=83326 Thanks WWDiesel, Rats, ignorance was bliss for a while. Now I'm concerned. It sounded like nothingbutchrysler ended up buying another engine just to get his original early model 2.8L running again. Did I understand correctly that the Sleeve/Piston/Ring set will fit both the old and new style engines? Although it is more expensive, it may be the only way to go. How much difference in weight is there between the old style piston & new style piston? Can an engine have one new style with 3 old style pistons? Does the engine run unbalanced? Can they be changed in opposing pairs? I did send a query into VM Diesel Specialists. Find out what sort of response I get. Dean.

Author:	flash7210 [ Mon Dec 18, 2017 7:08 am ]
Post subject:	Re: Hard to find noise -- clinking and clanking
Check eBay for a used piston.

Author:	WWDiesel [ Mon Dec 18, 2017 10:13 am ]
Post subject:	Re: Hard to find noise -- clinking and clanking
CaptainDean wrote: WWDiesel wrote: Go here: http://www.vmdieselspecialist.com/ VM DIESEL SPECIALIST LTD in England. Make sure you have the full engine number. VIN is of no use to them! Be sure and review this LOST thread! There are different pistons/weights and they are NOT interchangeable! There are 2 different types of piston/rings used on this motor. viewtopic.php?f=98&t=83326 Thanks WWDiesel, Rats, ignorance was bliss for a while. Now I'm concerned. It sounded like nothingbutchrysler ended up buying another engine just to get his original early model 2.8L running again. Did I understand correctly that the Sleeve/Piston/Ring set will fit both the old and new style engines? Although it is more expensive, it may be the only way to go. How much difference in weight is there between the old style piston & new style piston? Can an engine have one new style with 3 old style pistons? Does the engine run unbalanced? Can they be changed in opposing pairs? I did send a query into VM Diesel Specialists. Find out what sort of response I get. Dean. My understanding either size piston/sleeve will fit, but the pistons are different weights and cannot be mixed. According to the thread, the weight is stamped on the underside of the piston? And some pistons can have different piston rings and / or groove sizes so it gets complicated when trying to replace just one piston & sleeve assembly! Mountainman I believe has the most experience in this area and would be a good one to ask for advice. Did you read through the whole thread, it may answer some of your questions? viewtopic.php?f=98&t=83326

Author:	CaptainDean [ Tue Dec 19, 2017 12:26 am ]
Post subject:	Re: Hard to find noise -- clinking and clanking
Loaded up the engine (block, head, cams assembly, removed sleeve and piston) to take to the machinist tomorrow. I queried IDParts and they responded asking about the ring gap (0.095" or 0.125"). Queried VM Diesel Specialist and they responded with a series of prices, plus a graph of the exchange rate between American $ and British £. (I inserted the $ amounts) Shipping by weight is extra. 1 Injector- for this we will need the 10 digit number from the black plastic cap. 1 connecting rod- good used connecting rod- £30.00 ($40.21) 1 piston with rings- £173.00 ($231.89) / cylinder sleeve- £44.20 ($59.25) / seal and shims kit for cylinder sleeve- £13.33 ($17.87). 1 complete engine gasket set- £156.00 ($219.10). This does not include the crankshaft oil seals. Front oil seal is £7.70 ($10.32) and the rear oil seal is £31.99 ($42.88). 1 complete crankshaft bearing set (main and rod journal, piston rod bearings)- Front main bearing- £12.22 x1 ($16.36), centre main bearings- £9.80 ($13.14) each x3, Rear main bearing- £29.55 ($39.61), con rod bearing are £9.72 ($13.03) each, little end bushes are £7.33 ($9.83) each. The crankshaft main bearing are available separately. We can also supply the gaskets individually as sometimes a complete engine gasket kit is never always required. 1 complete set of piston pins- we have as good as new ones for £10 ($13.40) each. Dean.

Author:	CaptainDean [ Wed Dec 20, 2017 12:07 am ]
Post subject:	Re: Hard to find noise -- clinking and clanking
CaptainDean wrote: Loaded up the engine (block, head, cams assembly, removed sleeve and piston) to take to the machinist tomorrow. Dropped of the head and cam assembly at the machinist. He did not seem apprehensive about the head damage. I may not be out of the woods yet, but certainly nearing the edge of the woods. He will let me know how many valves and guides I need to order. This is a big relief knowing I should not have to buy a new head. He did not find any damage to the block casting. Clearly the sleeve took the brunt of the bi-hydrogen mono-oxide explosion. Dean.