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 Post subject: On my third starter...
PostPosted: Wed Mar 25, 2020 2:26 pm 
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Joined: Wed Apr 24, 2019 3:50 pm
Posts: 8
Hi, has anyone else experienced weak solenoids on their replacement starters? I bought my Liberty CRD used and afternoon a few months it began mid-starting. The symptom would usually show up first thing in the morning where the starter would begin turning but the bendix seemly did not engage the flywheel. Then as time progressed, the starter solenoid would begin dropping out during starting until it finally failed to stay engaged with the flywheel long enough to start the jeep. I contacted Advance Auto and arranged to replace the Carquest starter. Oh, I discovered the last tech to replace the starter left out the third bolt, you know the one - behind the solenoid. Anyway, I replaced the starter and the symptom went away for - wait for it - one day. The new starter began the mid-start thing first and once a day progressing quickly again. Before replacing the starter again, I removed it, checked the bendix and the flywheel teeth- all good, checked the starter function with jumper cables and a remote start switch - all good, put it back on the Jeep with a new third bolt and used remote start switch - same symptom of solenoid failed to keep the bendix engaged, performed voltage drop tests (both, battery to starter cable - no loss and start trigger circuit - no loss), so I replaced the starter again... new again Carquest starter and for now, no problems. Yeah... oh yeah, this is day two.


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 Post subject: Re: On my third starter...
PostPosted: Wed Mar 25, 2020 6:48 pm 
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Joined: Fri Jun 22, 2007 11:43 am
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Location: Green Cove Springs FL
Is oil leaking onto or into the starter?

Had the exact same problem on my friends XJ.
And all the replacement starters were from Auto Zone.
And they all bench tested good.
I thought maybe it was because of the oil leak soaking the starter but we eventually got a new starter that worked properly.

Maybe auto zone is just crap.

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 Post subject: Re: On my third starter...
PostPosted: Wed Mar 25, 2020 10:40 pm 
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Joined: Mon Mar 24, 2008 10:26 pm
Posts: 865
Location: West Coast, Canada
If it happens again.....I would try and source an OEM starter. I think Denso made them. Probably find a reman.



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 Post subject: Re: On my third starter...
PostPosted: Thu Mar 26, 2020 3:36 am 
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Joined: Sat Apr 15, 2017 3:48 am
Posts: 335
Location: White River in the Bush South Africa
If the solenoid is not getting maximum current it could be failing to engage properly.

Not actually a "Bendix" as far as I know...a Bendix flies out as it rotates and engages the flywheel. Then when power is dropped it falls back under spring action.

I believe this solenoid has a forked arm that pulls the small gear out to engage the flywheel and then drops back under spring load. The solenoid also makes a large contact inside itself which spins the starter motor up....these contacts can get burnt and make bad contact so sometimes only the solenoid needs replacing. Over the years I have opened many a solenoid and carefully filed down the contacts so as to make a firm even contact..lubricated the moving parts and put it all together.
Nowadays we simply replace everything!

Does not matter which system is used...main thing is that the whole system receives good current.
I will read up on exactly what system our Jeeps use!

The connectors on the solenoid and starter motor must be clean and tight.
The battery connections must be clean and tight and the negative battery lead going to chassis must be clean and tight. The straps grounding the engine to chassis....one on the CRD and two on the Gasser...must be clean and tight.

Worth swapping out the Starter Relay in the box under the hood.

Strange that you are having these problems....the Starter Motors on these Jeeps are generally pretty reliable!....hopefully the teeth on the flywheel are in good condition :roll:

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 Post subject: Re: On my third starter...
PostPosted: Thu Mar 26, 2020 3:43 pm 
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Joined: Tue Dec 16, 2014 9:33 pm
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Location: Jackson,TN
agree they are very reliable I have had none give a problem on 6 crds buy I never drove the parts one but that doesn't help if yours isn't working.

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 Post subject: Re: On my third starter...
PostPosted: Thu Mar 26, 2020 4:49 pm 
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Location: Central GA
Question? Is the starter motor itself failing or is it the starter solenoid on top the the starter motor?
Need to determine if the problem is electrical or mechanical.

You definitely need to connect a voltmeter to the positive lug on the starter and see how low the voltage is dropping to when the starter motor is engaged.
Amps go up exponentially as battery voltage drops, so a low voltage situation could be killing the starters.

As the battery voltage drops, it’s internal resistance increases due to chemical actions of the battery plates. This battery resistance increase limits the available battery current and reduces the amount of power delivered to the starter motor. Now the starter motor is not getting the voltage that it is designed for, so it starts dragging (arcing across the armature windings) and repeated occurrences will shorten the life of the starter motor very quickly. Weak batteries will destroy starter motors over time because of the excessive current draw and armature arcing due to low cranking voltage. The wires going from the battery to the starter motor also have resistance that adds to the impedance of current flow in low voltage situations.

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 Post subject: Re: On my third starter...
PostPosted: Sun Apr 05, 2020 5:21 pm 
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Joined: Wed Apr 24, 2019 3:50 pm
Posts: 8
Brand new battery as of fall last year, yes solenoid is failing not the starter motor, yes all connections are clean and tight, verified vehicle electrical is functioning normally (performed voltage drop tests), teeth of flywheel inspected - no damage (yet), third starter working beautifully with no hint of faulty solenoid. I think it was a bad line of starters at Carquest. The (3rd) new starter sounds different than the last two.

Method of engagement aside, I’ve always known the small gear with the one-way clutch on the output shaft of the starter to be called a bendix. I have a Triumph Spitfire and it’s starter bendix is engaged with the flywheel by centrifugal force, so familiar with both.


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 Post subject: Re: On my third starter...
PostPosted: Sun Apr 05, 2020 10:17 pm 
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Joined: Sat Aug 24, 2013 11:36 pm
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Location: Central GA
FYI,
Bendix is a misnomer, it was the brand name of a starter drive used for many years in the US.
The Bendix Corporation built starter drives for many, many years.
So most old timers simply called starter drives a "Bendix" when in fact the correct name is a "starter drive". :ROTFL:

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Ironman Springs/Bilstein's
Yeti Stg4 MaxTune
Weeks ElbowKit/BatteryTray
No FCV/EGR
Samcos/ProVent
SunCoast/Transgo
Carter Intank-pmp
2mic.Sec.Fuel Filter
Flowmaster/NOcat
V6Airbox
GM11 bld fan/NAPA HDclutch
IronrockArm/Cust.Mount
DodgeCummins,5"exh. Viair, Huge K&N


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