Disappointing Timing Belt Teardown - Need Help!

marcvky · **Joined:** Tue Feb 05, 2013 6:24 pm **Posts:** 7

Ok guys..... thought I was good to go and then Murphy showed up to the party.

As everyone knows out beloved CRD's have problems with leaking intercoolers. Mine was no exception and the leak-point was obvious, thanks to the CCV stains at the junction between the plastic and aluminum.

Could someone post a link to the radiator core removal procedure, please. I have remove all of the hoses and the two top 10mm bolts. It will lean into the engine compartment, but I am unable to pull it up-and-free. Feels I something is holding it from below. Must the intercooler and radiator core come out as a unit, and if so, how?

The next disappointment, well this may suck. I rolled under the chassis to drain the radiator core and found pink liquid wetted on the forward cross member.
the fluid is apparently leaking from a pressure line that enters the front-most cooling core, on the very bottom of the core, on the passenger-side (please see pic'shttp://www.flickr.com/photos/51808341@N04/8606796023/in/photostream). Is this a tranny line or a A/C coolant line?

Should I try tightening the fitting, before tearing it down etc.?

Thanks for anyone's help, in advance.

Best,

Marc

Hexus · **Posted:** Sun Mar 31, 2013 6:47 pm

Marc -

Many here will post suggestions and I would be willing to do the same.

Sir Sam (Noob Guide) posted this video in 5 parts, here's the link to the first part:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5o_FJpBEKjk

It goes step by step on how to get everything out of your way.

Hexus · **Posted:** Sun Mar 31, 2013 6:49 pm

marcvky wrote:

Ok guys..... thought I was good to go and then Murphy showed up to the party.

As everyone knows out beloved CRD's have problems with leaking intercoolers. Mine was no exception and the leak-point was obvious, thanks to the CCV stains at the junction between the plastic and aluminum.

Could someone post a link to the radiator core removal procedure, please. I have remove all of the hoses and the two top 10mm bolts. It will lean into the engine compartment, but I am unable to pull it up-and-free. Feels I something is holding it from below. Must the intercooler and radiator core come out as a unit, and if so, how?

The next disappointment, well this may suck. I rolled under the chassis to drain the radiator core and found pink liquid wetted on the forward cross member.
the fluid is apparently leaking from a pressure line that enters the front-most cooling core, on the very bottom of the core, on the passenger-side (please see pic'shttp://www.flickr.com/photos/51808341@N04/8606796023/in/photostream). Is this a tranny line or a A/C coolant line?

Should I try tightening the fitting, before tearing it down etc.?

Thanks for anyone's help, in advance.

Best,

Marc

Someone will have to correct me, but I think that's the transmission cooler, that radiator serves multiple purposes.

CATCRD · **Posted:** Sun Mar 31, 2013 8:30 pm

I know it's too late now, but for anyone reading this thread in the future, you can sneak the intercooler out without draining the coolant or removing the radiator. I have done it that way to repair an intercooler leak.

DOC4444 · **Posted:** Sun Mar 31, 2013 9:50 pm

CAT,

Any suggestions how to do just that?

Thanks!

DOC

kapalczynski · **Posted:** Sun Mar 31, 2013 10:47 pm

If I remember right I was able to get the intercooler out w/o the radiator as well. though I think I had to disconnect the AC connection and recharge the AC coolant after. I don't remember anything specific as a snag or anything so I can't remember any one specific tip.

- Mark

Glend · **Posted:** Mon Apr 01, 2013 1:40 am

You can change the timing belt without removing the radiator or dis-assembly of the front end, just do the fan shroud mod and you can reach everything.

kapalczynski · **Posted:** Mon Apr 01, 2013 7:39 am

I was able to remove the fan and shroud w/o removing the radiator or intercooler. But if you have an intercooler leak you obviously need to remove it.

I was able to find a intercooler new in box from someone for $350 as they purchased it to rebuild a CRD and changed their mind. I felt bad, but he only wanted $350. There was a local aluminum welder willing to fab end caps and hose outputs/mount points for me for around $450 and had I not found the new one so cheap I was gonna do that. When I was looking the new ones were going for $700 at moparonlineparts.com.

CATCRD · **Posted:** Tue Apr 02, 2013 8:42 pm

DOC4444 wrote:

CAT,

Any suggestions how to do just that?

Thanks!

DOC

Well you basically start in the same way that you would if you meant to remove the radiator. Take off grille cover, mechanical fan, fan shroud, upper radiator support, header panel with headlights, hood latch, electric fan. Separate the AC condenser/tranny cooler from the intercooler, remove intercooler attachment points, and basically jimmy it out from in between the two other cores. I didn't discharge refrigerant or drain coolant. I remember it being a bit of a struggle and there were a couple things I had to pry on a little more than I was comfortable doing at the time, but I would do it the same way again.

DOC4444 · **Posted:** Tue Apr 02, 2013 11:12 pm

THANKS!

DOC

marcvky · **Joined:** Tue Feb 05, 2013 6:24 pm **Posts:** 7

Guys, I am down to the crank pulley and have removed the 4-each 10mm bolts..... but it really looks like it wants me to back the 21mm crankshaft bolt out, in order to drop the pulley off. yes or no?

I realize that there may be models where the 10mm could be removed and a slip-one grooved belt ring may have been able to slide off of the crank wheel, but my 2005 doesn't appear to have that part/configuration.

If yes, is it threaded backwards like a couple of those serpentine pulleys?

Thanks,

Marc

msilbernagel · **Posted:** Thu Apr 04, 2013 2:46 am

NO, it doesn't.

See Page 9-228 (PDF page 1493) of the 2005 (your year/page may vary) Service Manual:

VIBRATION DAMPER REMOVAL
(1) Disconnect negative battery cable.
(2) Remove viscous cooling fan and shroud (Refer to 7 - COOLING/ENGINE/FAN DRIVE VISCOUS CLUTCH - REMOVAL).
(3) Remove accessory drive belt (Refer to 7 -COOLING/ACCESSORY DRIVE/DRIVE BELTS - REMOVAL).
(4) Remove vibration damper retaining bolts and damper (Fig. 109).

The big bolt holds the pulley that turns the timing belt..

Mark

GreenDieselEngineering · **Joined:** Sun Jun 07, 2009 5:10 pm **Posts:** 1111

After removing the 4 bolts on the harmonic balancer it will come off, no need to touch the center hub bolt. The balancer will be rusted to the hub so you may want a little puller, spray it with penetrating oil and/or bang it with a hammer until it frees up.

marcvky · **Joined:** Tue Feb 05, 2013 6:24 pm **Posts:** 7

Thanks for the reassurance. I shocked the pulley along the circumference with a hammer (mild blows). Then used a cold chissel (placed into one of the slots) to induce a few degrees of rotation; at that point it just fell off.

Thanks again for everyone watching this thread and throwing in tips. Behold the pit of despair..... abandon hope all ye who enter: http://www.flickr.com/photos/51808341@N ... hotostream

PS Discovered that one of the idler pulleys had a bad lubricant seal (hey, why is that pulley wet??). So, now ordering 2-each idlers and 1-tensioner pulley (since you can't trust MOPAR to engineer ANYTHING to last).

PPS I had the same leak in the same place on my intercooler that EVERYONE else in the whole world had. Makes you wonder why MOPAR didnt have several class-action suits.... especially for the leak-failure of the CCV and/or flexible turbo exhaust intake hose (all on the exhaust-side of the engine compartment. DUH!)

kjjet · **Posted:** Thu Apr 04, 2013 8:33 pm

kapalczynski wrote:

I was able to remove the fan and shroud w/o removing the radiator or intercooler. But if you have an intercooler leak you obviously need to remove it.

I was able to find a intercooler new in box from someone for $350 as they purchased it to rebuild a CRD and changed their mind. I felt bad, but he only wanted $350. There was a local aluminum welder willing to fab end caps and hose outputs/mount points for me for around $450 and had I not found the new one so cheap I was gonna do that. When I was looking the new ones were going for $700 at moparonlineparts.com.

That's Crazy $$$$. What I have seen, is intercoolers leaking on the sides where the MFG crimps the alum onto the plastic sides. This can be sealed up for a few dollars. Some have used JB weld. But I prefer aircraft tank sealant. I use it the whole way around each side. The sealant is used to keep Jet fuel in the wing! No more leaks for sure! If someone want to ship it to me, I will seal up? PM me. May save you a few hundred $$.

marcvky · **Joined:** Tue Feb 05, 2013 6:24 pm **Posts:** 7

Things are going back together, very well. a couple of things to note, if you decide to undertake this:

1) order the t-belt idler pulleys and tensioner pulley, at the outset. They are cheap and and they will fail (or are in the process of failing).
2) My t-belt came off with no cracks, just normal wear, after 111K miles...
3) The short section of rubber hose from the CCV to the vacuum-side of the turbo doesn't have clamps (stock) and appears to leak. I am adding adjustable clamps to each joint, in order to avoid oil in the garage.
4) JB Weld worked great in sealing the intercooler. I used a heat gun to warm the applied epoxy and that caused the epoxy to flow (somewhat like honey that has been heated in the microwave) into the small spaces and coat the area where the plastic meets the aluminum fins. Leak sealed.

QUESTION:

I want to remove the leaking tranny line(s) and move to a braided reinforced teflon -6 AN plumbing. Is that diameter sufficient (it's approximately the same as the stockers)? Does anyone know which fittings/sizes/threading is required at the tranny and then up-front at the core?

Thanks,

Marc

Big Jimmy · **Joined:** Thu Mar 24, 2011 9:48 pm **Posts:** 25

My 2006 Liberty CRD is now at 200,000 and I'm doing the timing belt job. I did the job myself at 100,000 as well and it all went very smoothly that time. But now this time I'm having an issue. I've got the new water pump and thermostat installed, along with the new rollers, belt, and tensioner. So I'm at the point where I just want to start it up and run it for 10 seconds or so, to make sure it will run properly... But that's not working for me.

The engine will start, but then it rev's up a bit higher than usual at first... Then it comes down to the more normal idle speed. But then it only idles for 1 or 2 seconds (or so) and then dies. So this full series of events is all happening within about 3 or 4 seconds. Does anyone know what this means? Is the timing somehow off? I'm not sure how to trouble shoot this exactly.

Here's what I know... The timing seems like maybe it's just barely off between the intake and exhaust cams. The lock pins still go in and out ok, but they don't seem like they are perfectly free and clear in the holes. There is just a little bit of resistance to turn them in and out. So my question there is: If they are just barely off, is that enough to cause this problem where it won't run properly? How far off is too far off? I would think that if the pins still both fit in, and I can turn the engine over multiple times and they still fit in, then that should be within spec, shouldn't it?

The only other thing is that my battery is not in the best shape. I've already ordered a new one, but it has not arrived yet. Although, the old battery is still sufficient enough to still start the engine. But my question with that is: Could it be possible to still start the motor, but then not be good enough to keep it going for 10 or 15 seconds since the alternator is not currently installed?

I can't figure out what's going on with this. Any insight would be greatly appreciated. Is there anything I'm not thinking of? What else could keep it from running for the test start up? I really don't want to reinstall anything else until I can verify that it will run.

Sincerely,
Jim

Big Jimmy · **Joined:** Thu Mar 24, 2011 9:48 pm **Posts:** 25

Well, I still don't get it, but it's working now.

I checked everything again, still seemed fine timing wise, so I didn't change anything there. The only thing I did differently was that I plugged in the two coolant related electrical connectors that I could plug in. The one for the thermostat and the one for the viscus heater. Then I tried to start it again and it idled just fine. I let it idle for about 10 to 15 seconds or so and then turned it off. Then I let it sit and cool back down for about 10 or 15 minutes and did it one more time to make sure it was still working. And everything went just fine the second time as well.

Do those two connectors need to be plugged in for the motor to run? I can't imagine those connections really making any difference, especially when the whole cooling system is still in pieces on the floor of my garage. But like I said, that's the only thing I did differently and now it runs. So I guess either those do need to be plugged in, or that was just some bizarre coincidence and whatever was wrong has somehow resolved itself.

I don't know... I'm still scratching my head about the whole thing... Very weird.

At least now I can finish putting it all back together though.

WWDiesel · **Posted:** Sat Dec 04, 2021 9:26 pm

The viscous heater connector has absolutely no impact on engine operation, it is simply a piece of ancillary equipment designed to provide a little extra heat in the coolant going to the heater core, which it does a poor job of at best.
There are plenty, and I do mean plenty of Jeep CRD's running around with the viscous heater totally removed and electrically unplugged and NO one has reported a problem of engine starting or anything else. I ran for several years with the viscous heater relay removed before I developed the delete kit and totally removed my viscous heater.

As the the coolant temperature, that may be a different animal and the ECM may have to have it in the loop for engine starting? I am not sure, but I bet Yeti could answer the question. :wink:

Disappointing Timing Belt Teardown - Need Help!

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