Well, 168 is just to the left of 12:00, maybe 1-2 needle widths, I would guess that 170-175 is straight up.

The highest I've seen is about 2:00, which was around 200-210

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2005 CRD "Ol' Blue"
Red Ryder carbine-action, two hundred shot range model air rifle with a compass in the stock and this thing which tells time.
My build page- RL Komodo Rear and TJM Front Bumper, armored, lifted, JBA Steel D30, 4.10s and ARB air lockers.

Ours ~165 is halfway between the 1/4 mark and the 1/2 mark

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'05 CRD Limited
Pricol EGT, Boost
GDE Hot '11; EDGE Trail switched
SEGR; Provent; Magnaflow;
Suncoast T\C, Transgo Tow'n'Go switch;
Cummins LP module, Fleetguard filter, Filterminder
2.5" Daystar f, OME r; Ranchos; K80767's, Al's lifted uppers
Rubicons, 2.55 Goodyears
Four in a row really makes it go

One question - what temp are you heating the SVO to before feeding it to the engine?

If MrMopar64 was correct, at a fuel temp of roughly 75 degrees C seen at the fuel temp sensor in the filter, the ECM will go into serious defueling mode - from what I remember of his description, it's essentially a limp mode. In his words, the ECM does this to protect the injection pump from lack of lubrication with very hot and thin fuel.

You may be working at cross purposes here - you need to have the SVO at XX temp for it to flow, lubricate, and combust properly - but the ECM is trying to keep the fuel from reaching XX temp because it thinks it's running regular #2 dino and is defueling the engine to protect it.

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Mitchell Oates
'87 MB 300D Diamond Blue Metallic
'87 MB 300D - R.I.P. 12/08
'05 Sport CRD Stone White
Provent CCV Filter/AT2525 Muffler
Stanadyne 30 u/Cat 2 u Fuel Filters
Fumoto Drain/Fleetguard LF3487 Oil filter
V6 Airbox/Amsoil EAA Air Filter
Suncoast TC/Shift Kit/Aux Cooler
Kennedy Lift Pump/Return Fuel Cooler

This is quite an interesting idea. These engines run on the cool side to begin with. Fuel economy goes down quite a bit in the winter because the viscous heater must run to achieve (and maintain) operating temperature. Lots of us have reduced or removed EGR function to resolve the oil/soot intake clogging issues. Since the EGR is no longer adding heat to the system, this adds to warmup times and sustained heating requirements. Without the heat from the EGR being added to the system, the temperature headroom needed in the cooling system is lessened, and the engine might stand to gain some efficiency from a higher operating temperature.

- Chris

I agree. Plus, SVO aside, I'd rather have a thermostat that was easy to change.

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05CRD: GDE Hot ECU & TCM tunes, Provent, Cat filter, Facet lift pump, TransGo kit, Florida TC, Samcos, stainless brake lines, HDS thermostat, Renegade light bar,
RL super sliders, Bilstein adjustables, Al's Gen 4.5 Arms, 235/85-16 Duratracs, DTT rear, Elocker front, EVIC+TPMS, Turbo timer, McNally pillar gauges, Weeks Stage II kit.

My opinion on this: While it’s true that the EGR would add “Some” heat to the intake manifold, remember that it’s the job of the EGR to REDUCE combustion temperatures.
In the big picture of things, it’s the thermostat’s job to control the engine’s temperature. There is no computer input to the thermostat. It's a mechanical device and it does what it does.

Another thing to consider if one were to change the setting on the thermostat. Since the computer doesn't have any control over the base temperature, it can help by cutting back fuel if it thinks things are getting too hot. Something to keep in mind…..

My thoughts, exactly retmil46 - we can manage that with a fuel return-line cooler, not even possible where the VO fuel temp must remain hot to be functional - that's why I suggested the FTS would give better indication of CRD performance, vis a vis the failures of the afore-mentioned systems.

Even our ultra hi-tech coolant-cooled EGR doesn't add much BTU to the engine coolant when unloaded, but would do so under long-term loading, where much EGR would be used to reduce NOx - this, of course, on vehicles with unmodified emissions systems, as required by law

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'05 CRD Limited
Pricol EGT, Boost
GDE Hot '11; EDGE Trail switched
SEGR; Provent; Magnaflow;
Suncoast T\C, Transgo Tow'n'Go switch;
Cummins LP module, Fleetguard filter, Filterminder
2.5" Daystar f, OME r; Ranchos; K80767's, Al's lifted uppers
Rubicons, 2.55 Goodyears
Four in a row really makes it go

Ill take a look at the FTS and see if theres any power losses as temperature goes up. I'll try and record that data over a period of time to see is we notice anything that correlates. Increasing the coolant temp would increase the fuel temp on the diesel side of things but as mentioned above a return fuel cooler would keep the tank temperatures in check. Our installed fuel temperature sensor monitors both fuels because it is installed on the common line to the ip we can roughly monitor the temp increase in diesel as we increase the coolant temp. Ill report back on this once we've begun to tweak the temperatures.
Retmil- If i understand you correctly your saying when the temp sensor in the filter housing reads 75C it detunes the engine? What about folks not running the electric heater. (i don't have the vehicle in front of me) is the temp sensor in the heater housing? Or at the filter head? I'm assuming the FTS will also cause this to occur. We are looking for a min of 160 on the Vo side and thus far have not noticed any detuning. The customer did report the vehicle kicking into limp mode twice however i feel it was unrelated as they said it was on diesel without the engine warmed up.
Chad- what are you referencing 33,000 gallons per acre? that seems like an impossible figure with high yield crops only just pushing 1,00 gal per acre
If folks are interested in a new thermostat housing i can put together the drawings and come up with a price from our machinist. Anyone have suggestions on the thermostat to accept? Off the top of my head the powerstroke seems to have the most available temperatures.
~Colin

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www.fossilfreefuel.com

The stock FTS and fuel heater are mounted in a plastic puck that's installed on the stock fuel filter head, held on by the standpipe that the fuel filter screws on to. In other words, it's sandwiche in between the filter head and the filter itself. Those are the two electrical connectors that connect to the fuel filter assembly.

The ECM adjusts engine timing and fueling based on fuel temp (fuel filter is last component on the supply side before fuel reaches the CP3 injection pump). You'll throw a CEL if the stock FTS is disconnected. And there's the above-mentioned safety cutback at 75 C to protect the injection pump.

The stock fuel heater is SUPPOSED to cut off at 80 to 85 F fuel temp, just there to prevent gelling in cold weather (and also melt itself into oblivion and cause air leaks).

This past summer, many people started noticing a reduction in performance and rough idling during high ambient temps. From my experience, it seems once the FTS sees fuel temps start pushing past 120 F coming from the fuel tank, it starts detuning the engine.

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Mitchell Oates
'87 MB 300D Diamond Blue Metallic
'87 MB 300D - R.I.P. 12/08
'05 Sport CRD Stone White
Provent CCV Filter/AT2525 Muffler
Stanadyne 30 u/Cat 2 u Fuel Filters
Fumoto Drain/Fleetguard LF3487 Oil filter
V6 Airbox/Amsoil EAA Air Filter
Suncoast TC/Shift Kit/Aux Cooler
Kennedy Lift Pump/Return Fuel Cooler

I didn't realize there was a fuel temp sensor and a control in our filter head. What have people who have replaced the Jeep filter head with a Cat or Racor head done to assure proper fuel temperature, a happy ECU, and avoid warranty problems?

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George Reiswig
2005 Jeep Liberty CRD
Suncoast, SEGR, lift, InMotion tune, homebrew B100
At 138k, new head & gasket, timing belt, rockers and swearing vocabulary

Has anybody worked out the Scangauge parameters necessary to create a user defined xGauge that reads the fuel temp sensor?

While we're at it, how about the tranny temperature?

Well, in my case I consdered the stock fuel filter to be a lost cause, and completely replaced it with a Stanadyne unit. As far as the warranty, that would depend on the dealer and how Cerberus is handling things now, but I wouldn't lay good odds of getting warranty coverage for fuel-related issues if you go in there with a Racor setup under the hood.

For that matter I trust my own work and my own warranty far more than I trust Chrysler's.

I and several other people have used a thermistor temp probe from Omega Engineering, www.omega.com , that Ranger1 tested against the stock FTS and was near identical as far as it's temp curve and resistance readings. It's also threaded for 1/8 or 1/4 pipe, a lot easier to adapt to. I'd imagine a search for "omega" or "temp probe", either here or over in the CRD Tech section, would turn up the threads that list the particulars and part numbers.

_________________
Mitchell Oates
'87 MB 300D Diamond Blue Metallic
'87 MB 300D - R.I.P. 12/08
'05 Sport CRD Stone White
Provent CCV Filter/AT2525 Muffler
Stanadyne 30 u/Cat 2 u Fuel Filters
Fumoto Drain/Fleetguard LF3487 Oil filter
V6 Airbox/Amsoil EAA Air Filter
Suncoast TC/Shift Kit/Aux Cooler
Kennedy Lift Pump/Return Fuel Cooler

Stan has the Omega info on his Web site
http://liberty.eurekaboy.com/fuelpressuregauge.htm

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2005 CRD
stuff
Skeptic quod gratis asseritur, gratis negatur

Don't forget about the coolant cooker. (Viscous heater in service speak.)

It's basically a belt driven / electric clutch actuated 'torque converter' like pump in the coolant circuit. Acutate the clutch and it acts like a stalled torque converter, dumping energy from the accessory drive straight into the engine coolant.

It's purpose in life is to provide cabin heat quickly. It's downside is the additional torque (fuel) required to run it.

I've found a way to selectively disable it. The electric clutch is actuated by a mini ISO solenoid. Buy a spare, take the cover off, and rip out the armature. Put the cover back on and paint the top to keep then sorted out, then put the disabled solenoid in the spot for 'viscous heater' in the underhood junction box.

Then when it gets really cold and you want heat more than fuel economy, swap back to the 'good' solenoid. No fault codes that I can find.

Don't hold me to the numbers but the actuation limits are (from my memory of a conversation two years ago...)

Below 60° F ambient / below 170° engine coolant, cooker will actuate until either limit is met.

For me temperatures between 10° and 60°, I can live with getting heat a few minutes later.

It may be possible to rewire this to provide additional heat into the engine coolant circuit to keep your veggies warm...

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2005 CRD Limited Flame Red w/ Renegade rock rails & light bar, AirLift 1000. 225/75R16 MT/R's on cheap black steel wheels, dual MOPAR subwoofers, Ipod kit & seat covers, Samco hoses - totaled and gone. 2008 WK Laredo 3.0L diesel - AirLift 1000, wife won't let me mess with it much. 2013 JK Sahara on order.