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 Post subject: Guess what Loctite does before it sets up
PostPosted: Wed Feb 11, 2009 1:58 pm 
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It lubricates the threads, so if Suncoast recommends Loctite on the bolts and prescribes a torque, I will bet that torque is close to the lubricated torque. Unlike generic torque charts, torquing by testing and experience is the best way to go.

To put it into perspective, most generic torque charts are based upon the torque the lousiest bolt in the batch can take with out failing or snapping off. Generic Bolt Torque Charts are like Building Codes so every installation does not need to be engineered.

MY former employer had an application that had to have the 1/4" X 20 TPI 316 Stainless Steel bolts torqued to 10 ft-lb. Generic torque charts called for 8 ft-lb max. We tested and found the stretch torque was 16 ft-lb. Since the applications was through bolted with a nut that had 2760 Loctite applied, we figured that if the bolt twisted off, good grab another. It was better to have the bolt fail in ones hand that fail in the application and cause damage, we shipped extra bolts.
I am sure Suncoast has gone through extensive field testing and evaluation and did not stretch their rectum to get the data.

Save the Generic bolt torque charts for bolting on skid plates and other goodies.

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Wed Feb 11, 2009 3:36 pm 
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I would surmise the reason for the loctite on the stainless bolts was to prevent galling, as dry ss threads tend to stretch'n'gall easily during tensioning and de-tensioning (both on and off) - only solution(s) is to attempt to break the bolt shank or get a nut-bust'r or get a bmfh and chisel

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 Post subject: Galling plus falling out
PostPosted: Wed Feb 11, 2009 4:07 pm 
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gmctd wrote:
I would surmise the reason for the loctite on the stainless bolts was to prevent galling, as dry ss threads tend to stretch'n'gall easily during tensioning and de-tensioning (both on and off) - only solution(s) is to attempt to break the bolt shank or get a nut-bust'r or get a bmfh and chisel


In that application the bolts would come loose, let the retainer clip come loose, and then fall out. The few that did not fall out before they came loose, were the ones that galled.

Any time I tighten up a stainless steel bolt beyond snug, it either gets Loctite or anti-seize.

Again, Generic Bolt Torque Charts are like Building Codes, good idea, but not absolute. With a wall or with a bolt, a good engineer can engineer the application when needed. When not needed, Building Codes and generic bolt torque charts save a lot of time.

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Feb 17, 2009 12:48 pm 
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Double check the bolt lengths by hand before installing into the trans. If the bolt bottoms out in the threads before seating the head, you can meet your torque spec and have zero clamp torque.

Try putting a piece of paper next to the hole where the head will clamp on it. Run the bolt down with your finger. Hopefully the paper will tear out from under the bolt head.

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Feb 17, 2009 11:07 pm 
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Hmmm. Most every bolt torque chart that I have seen specifies lubricated threads.
Does LocTite qualify as thread lubricant?


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 Post subject: Loctite as thread Lube
PostPosted: Wed Feb 18, 2009 8:32 am 
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Turbo Tim wrote:
Hmmm. Most every bolt torque chart that I have seen specifies lubricated threads.
Does LocTite qualify as thread lubricant?


Some companies have independently gone through R&D (like a former employer, a vendor, and others) and have come up with the determination that Loctite acts as a thread lubricant for bolt torquing. Some Loctite people will quietly acknowledge their product acts as a lubricant for bolt torquing applications.

I suspect one reason for no across the board endorsement for the use of Loctite as a thread lubricant for torquing bolts is the IDIOT FACTOR. Most members know that you do not apply Loctite to a bolt, torque it and retorque in 48 hours later, but some where out there is a SPACE CADET who flunked out of the academy, will retorque a bolt that was installed with Loctite that has cured with out removing the bolt, cleaning it off, reapplying the Loctite, and reinstalling it to the torque specification.

Another item to take into consideration is how Engineering people are overburdened with excess work from countless codes and regulations and get very little time for engineering. Having a little trade secret not published in some manual but passed down by memo and word of mouth gives them a little freedom from the BULL $#!t.

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KJ Extra Leg Room Brackets, Carter Lift Pump, V6 Airbox, ORM
Fuel cooler, Oil Separator, Progard 7
Gauges EGT Boost Trans Temp Oil Pres, Michelin LXT AT2 245 70 R16
7,000# Draw Tight hitch, PML EX Deep Trans Pan
Centrifuge, SunCoast, Transgo, RAM TCM, InMotion Stage 2
Wife's 99 TDI VW Beetle


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