so i got bored and thought i would try to get the wires ran as far as i could...
without dropping the tank so when i do get the unit it would be a pretty quick
thing... well i inadvertently dropped the tank... on me... haha

so i got the wires ran all the way and put it all back together.. should i remove
the fuse or just run it?

_________________
Trevor

'05 Limited CRD Inferno Red Pearl Coat
Home made provent installed @ 35443, SEGR installed @ 35466, Fumoto valve @ 37500, trans and transfer case skid, In tank pump installed @ 43500, Suncoast TC & Transgo Shift Kit @ 44730, EGT, Boost, Trans temp gauges, Samco hoses, Rebuilt Trans w/ HD454RFE kit @ 56K, Inmotion Stage 2 @ 56K

Rob - you can feed the wire thru the connector, strip it double required length, fold that so the wire end does not overlap the end of the insulation, insert into the cabin connector pin to make contact, feed the connector over the wire till the other pins seat, try it like that till you get a pin

Trevor - always defuse the circuit till it's properly terminated - no use in taking chances at this stage, right?

_________________
'05 CRD Limited
Pricol EGT, Boost
GDE Hot '11; EDGE Trail switched
SEGR; Provent; Magnaflow;
Suncoast T\C, Transgo Tow'n'Go switch;
Cummins LP module, Fleetguard filter, Filterminder
2.5" Daystar f, OME r; Ranchos; K80767's, Al's lifted uppers
Rubicons, 2.55 Goodyears
Four in a row really makes it go

JD,

Thanks.
You folks are making this challenge feel like a group effort.
Tough jobs are best done with friends.

_________________
'06 Jeep Liberty Sport CRD with: GDE Hot Flash and Tranny Flash, ehm, Cummins fuel pump, 3" Magnaflow muff, Moog K3199's, Skids, 225-75-16 10 ply, OME springs, Euro T/C, Shift kit, Trans cooler w/thermal bypass, Bigboy bkt, Samco CAC, Brake controller, Trans temp gauge, Al's Upper Arms

No wonder I destroyed them. I thought they were clips and was trying to pull them out to release the line.

Funny that yours are orange and green, I had red, green on the tank side and orange yellow on the fuel line side. with four different colors I thought that would actually be an assembly key, but looks like they are reversable.

Drove from Chicago to Kearney Nebraska today, ran two tanks through and no issues, no leaks. 1/4 tank on the gauge is empty so I start looking at 1/2 tank. I'll take it apart when I get back from this trip and swap the sending units.

_________________
2005 CRD "Ol' Blue"
Red Ryder carbine-action, two hundred shot range model air rifle with a compass in the stock and this thing which tells time.
My build page- RL Komodo Rear and TJM Front Bumper, armored, lifted, JBA Steel D30, 4.10s and ARB air lockers.

Went to the dealer looking for pins this morning. The guy was helpful, did his best to help me out and would not take any money.
In all, this lift pump install was simple. It was so simple, gee I feel stupid.
GMCTD did the ground work, thanks JD.
The learning curve is not so steep any more. Would not have completed it without you folks, thanks again.
My tank read just like before, I think it is the orientation (indexing) of the lift pump in the tank, there are bumps down there at the bottom of the tank that could give you a higher fuel indication because the float can not go down..
When we bled the fuel manager this afternoon it sprayed fuel all over the engine, easy on the bleed valve fella.
Took it out for a spin, warmed it up, spooled it up and hunted for 50-60 mph hesitation, so sorry by gory, could not find any.
My son helped me, not on this forum, a gamer, but he wants to help lift it a little, ok.
Took us parts of 2 days, they do not call me fastRob for nothing.
Drove the tank down to just about empty, it was much easier removing and reinstalling a light tank.
It would have been easier to buy the harness, but if you can get to the body shop or wire bin of a Dodge, Jeep or Chrysler dealer, 2- 66" wires, 2 female, 1 male and a ground end are all you need.
Look at the pictures from the other's posts and think simple.

_________________
'06 Jeep Liberty Sport CRD with: GDE Hot Flash and Tranny Flash, ehm, Cummins fuel pump, 3" Magnaflow muff, Moog K3199's, Skids, 225-75-16 10 ply, OME springs, Euro T/C, Shift kit, Trans cooler w/thermal bypass, Bigboy bkt, Samco CAC, Brake controller, Trans temp gauge, Al's Upper Arms

Glad to hear it went well and congrats on the install! Another wiring option has been pioneered. A short piece of hose into a bottle keeps the spray in check, not that you'll have a need to bleed anytime soon.

That reminds me- As I mentioned after my install, my new filter head was leaking with the pump. Took it to the dealer, they said it was "assembly grease" but keep an eye on it. Took it back the next week to show them the diesel pooled up in the rim of the filter which wasn't there the week before. They cleaned it out with brake cleaner and said it might have been from their install, keep an eye on it. Since then, I have not been able to detect any leakage, surprisingly. Can't explain the mechanics of it but the leak seems to have sealed itself or something.

_________________
2005 CRD rolled August 2009

Interesting. did you happen to take a picture of where you placed the index tab? I looked carefully and am pretty sure I got the float on a flat part. also doesn't make sense since if it was resting on a bump, I would expect the gauge to read correctly until I hit 1/4 tank, then it would not go any farther.

What I've found is that the gauge drops off the peg to full when I have 3/4. Its indicating 3/4 when I have 1/2 tank, reads 1/2 when I have 1/4 and indicates 1/4 when I'm almost empty. That sounds like a mis calibrated sending unit. I'm not home right now, but I will double check the part number when I get back.

_________________
2005 CRD "Ol' Blue"
Red Ryder carbine-action, two hundred shot range model air rifle with a compass in the stock and this thing which tells time.
My build page- RL Komodo Rear and TJM Front Bumper, armored, lifted, JBA Steel D30, 4.10s and ARB air lockers.

Just a thought here but is the top of the tank where the pump fits in level when installed in the tank or is it at a angle? If at a angle then being positioned differently could be the problem and cutting the tab off and position it by eye as GMCTD suggested might be the solution

_________________
Atlantic Blue 06 CRD Limited (his)
Joined by a 2000 XJ Classic (hers)

The indexing was different in the replacement unit. I installed the pump rolled the tank to check the level and look for bumps in the bottom. Pulled the pump and rotated it a little to the right to avoid a bump is all. To verify the float movement. Pulled the lift pump fuse first Turned the key on with the wires connected and rolled the tank to check function. Note: I had less than a 1/5 tank during this all. My son read the gauge as the tank was rolled, he said it was on Empty as the tank was rotated backwards. My float was, looking from the top pointed towards about 10 o'clock in the tank. I also bent the float wire to make sure that the sending unit was operating in the full range in relation to the float.

On another item; I thought the tank was leaking but a vent was simply below the inlet tube. Just added 2' and put the end of the vent up by the inlet.

_________________
'06 Jeep Liberty Sport CRD with: GDE Hot Flash and Tranny Flash, ehm, Cummins fuel pump, 3" Magnaflow muff, Moog K3199's, Skids, 225-75-16 10 ply, OME springs, Euro T/C, Shift kit, Trans cooler w/thermal bypass, Bigboy bkt, Samco CAC, Brake controller, Trans temp gauge, Al's Upper Arms

Doesn't take but a sec to place a clean garbage bag on a flat surface, place the two modules in juxtaposition, compare the Dodge to the Jeep configuration in form and factor B4 proceeding - it's no longer odd that all the new modules are showing similar offset - difference should be obvious to even the jaundiced eye - plus, the fuel sender module\float\arm is of unit-construction and complete, thereof - just pops out\pops in

_________________
'05 CRD Limited
Pricol EGT, Boost
GDE Hot '11; EDGE Trail switched
SEGR; Provent; Magnaflow;
Suncoast T\C, Transgo Tow'n'Go switch;
Cummins LP module, Fleetguard filter, Filterminder
2.5" Daystar f, OME r; Ranchos; K80767's, Al's lifted uppers
Rubicons, 2.55 Goodyears
Four in a row really makes it go

Got the new harness today, preparing for install.

On the new pump module (with a lift pump) Measured resistance on the new sender module, 20 ohms (in the full position) to 220 ohms in the empty position. Confirmed below with except from the fine manual.

For reference in the JEEP manual the other day. If its already somewhere in threads let me know and Ill prune this message or delete as necessary, threads are getting huge.

OPERATION
For Fuel Gauge Operation: A constant current source of approximately 32 milliamps is supplied to the resistor track on the fuel gauge sending unit. This is fed directly from the Engine Control Module (ECM). NOTE: For diagnostic purposes, this 12V power source can only be verified with the circuit opened (fuel tank module electrical connector unplugged). With the connectors plugged, output voltages will vary from about 0.6 volts at FULL, to about 8.6 volts at EMPTY (about 8.6 volts at EMPTY for Jeep models, and about 7.0 volts at EMPTY for Dodge Truck models). The resistor track is used to vary the voltage (resistance) depending on fuel tank float level. As fuel level increases, the float and arm move up, which decreases voltage. As fuel level decreases, the float and arm move down, which increases voltage. The varied voltage signal is returned back to the ECM through the sensor return circuit.

Both of the electrical circuits between the fuel gauge sending unit and the ECM are hard-wired (not multi-plexed). After the voltage signal is sent from the resistor track, and back to the ECM, the ECM will interpret the resistance (voltage) data and send a message across the multi-plex bus circuits to the instrument panel cluster. Here it is translated into the appropriate fuel gauge level reading. Refer to Instrument Panel for additional information.

DIAGNOSIS AND TESTING - FUEL LEVEL SENDING UNIT
The fuel level sending unit contains a variable resistor (track). As the float moves up or down, electrical resistance will change. Refer to Instrument Panel and Gauges for Fuel Gauge testing. To test the gauge sending unit only, it must be removed from vehicle. The unit is a separate part of the lower fuel tank module section. Refer to Fuel Tank Module Removal/Installation for procedures (remove only the upper section of the fuel pump module). Measure the resistance across the sending unit terminals. With float in up position, resistance should be 20 ohms (+/- 5%). With float in down position, resistance should be 220 ohms (+/- 5%).


So based on this:- Ill check resistances before I pull the old module : ie rotate the tank with module installed, check the resistance range. Put new module in and rotate the tank to see what resistance range I get, bend arm if necessary to get it the same.

If not happy, just swap the senders. Ill do the detail stuff too anyways.

I wonder if having been soaked in Diesel for a while if the OEM installed sender might behave a little differently, resistance wise.

Hey everybody, isnt it great to be a part of all this, Terrific FORUM ......

_________________
KJ CRD 2.8L AUTO 2007
BP ULTIMATE
Extra Transmission cooler
2.5 inch full flow muffler.
Fuel Heater Disconnected.
In tank lift pump
Provent
Boost, EGT and Trans temp.
Engine Bay Vents soon.
Transgo Valve body (no resistor)
Hemi TC P04736587AC replaced (original TC P04736582AD in '07 KJ CRD) - Nice -:)

If im not here Im there....

I installed a variable resistor inline with the fuel gauge signal wire (brown.green).

see

http://picasaweb.google.com/bill.barg/J ... 1012296898

Just a $3, 32 turn, 0 to 200 ohm "dashpot". Adjusted with a tiny flat head driver.

I adjusted the resistance to bring the fuel level indication lower. With a full tank, I adjusted the resistance until the needle indicated full, not pegged. I believe this was an additional 20 ohms or so.

The electronic damping of the siganl means you need to wait 10 seconds to see any chage in resistance show up at the gauge needle.

The variable resistor is under the rear seat, accessible by pulling up the carpet, without removing the seat.

I suppose you could install this in the engine compartment , but I just did not want to put in the time to get the right wire at the ECM.

Anyway... it works fine.

I plan to run the tank empty and then fine tune the resistance to give me 2.5 gallons (50 miles) after the "low level" light comes on.

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----------------------------------------------------------------------
06 CRD LTD - Suncoast TC- Shift Kit - Spicer UJ - FRKNLIFT - F37 - Magnaflow - 22.0 City - 24@65MPH - Fumoto F-102 - AUX T Cooler - Tank Lift Pump

good idea

_________________
http://www.Colorado4Wheel.com
"Its not about what you can DO with your Jeep, its about where you can GO with your Jeep."
Knowledgeable - But Caustic

Seems So Simple , provides an option of adjusting to guage or voltage through the sender, hmmmmm....

_________________
KJ CRD 2.8L AUTO 2007
BP ULTIMATE
Extra Transmission cooler
2.5 inch full flow muffler.
Fuel Heater Disconnected.
In tank lift pump
Provent
Boost, EGT and Trans temp.
Engine Bay Vents soon.
Transgo Valve body (no resistor)
Hemi TC P04736587AC replaced (original TC P04736582AD in '07 KJ CRD) - Nice -:)

If im not here Im there....

I was looking over my cummins pump to see how much trouble it would be to swap guage sending units. It looks like popping out the unit will be easy enough and assume that the two blue wires from it will have to be removed from the plug and the swap ones inserted. It looks like a similar type plug as in the harness so swaping them should be straight forward. My question is: both wires from the cummins unit are the same color and the two sending wires from the underseat plug are different colors. Does it matter which blue wire goes into the pin 2-3 pin locations? Are the wires in my Jeep unit the same colors? I can put them side by side and take what I believe are the same wire locations to the plug but just wondered what would happen if they get turned around?

Also, All this wiring in the fuel tank and the conections look the same as if they were outside. What keeps the fuel from making a short between wires? Does the fuel not conduct electricity? It must be OK but I would have been the last guy to try it on my own vehicle with me turning the key on. This unit has a 12v supply wire with a ground to complete the circuit. The ground is fully exposed and the hot wire does not appear any great pains were taken to keep it dry. The sending unit wires are exposed with the solder connections to the slide bar completely exposed. I would assume some kind of current is going thru it. How in the h*** does this work?

_________________
White Sport '05 Libby CRD - born on date: 6/3/2005, FIA Grill Blanket, Fumoto drain plug, 2.8 CRD Turbo Diesel hood decals, Jeep windshield bug & stone deflector, Molded tire cover with custom JEEP & Liberty CRD decals, Cummins Lift Pump, Pro-vent, GDE Eco no limit tune, Odyssey 34R drycell battery, Meziere in-line stat, ETecno1 glow plugs

Diesel fuel is a lubricating insulator, or an insulating lubricator, but never a shorting terminator - if I had it to do all over again, I wouldn't do it all over y'all - but I would stand the modules side-by-side for an intimate up close and personal comparison, even if it took taking one pair of vise grips and one pair of pliers and bending the float arm to match the indexing of the Jeep module................

_________________
'05 CRD Limited
Pricol EGT, Boost
GDE Hot '11; EDGE Trail switched
SEGR; Provent; Magnaflow;
Suncoast T\C, Transgo Tow'n'Go switch;
Cummins LP module, Fleetguard filter, Filterminder
2.5" Daystar f, OME r; Ranchos; K80767's, Al's lifted uppers
Rubicons, 2.55 Goodyears
Four in a row really makes it go

Could you you use 2 pairs of vice grips?

_________________
http://www.Colorado4Wheel.com
"Its not about what you can DO with your Jeep, its about where you can GO with your Jeep."
Knowledgeable - But Caustic

Have been trying to figure out why my replacement sending unit works just like the old one.
This was worth it to me because it is easier to bleed the air out, no 50-60 mph hesitation and when I dial up the power on the motor, the fuel will be there.
Is there a pump head in the new 08 v-6 diesel Jeepy?

_________________
'06 Jeep Liberty Sport CRD with: GDE Hot Flash and Tranny Flash, ehm, Cummins fuel pump, 3" Magnaflow muff, Moog K3199's, Skids, 225-75-16 10 ply, OME springs, Euro T/C, Shift kit, Trans cooler w/thermal bypass, Bigboy bkt, Samco CAC, Brake controller, Trans temp gauge, Al's Upper Arms

Rob.

Are you saying your guage is correct with the new module?

Joe

_________________
Atlantic Blue 06 CRD Limited (his)
Joined by a 2000 XJ Classic (hers)

Yes

_________________
'06 Jeep Liberty Sport CRD with: GDE Hot Flash and Tranny Flash, ehm, Cummins fuel pump, 3" Magnaflow muff, Moog K3199's, Skids, 225-75-16 10 ply, OME springs, Euro T/C, Shift kit, Trans cooler w/thermal bypass, Bigboy bkt, Samco CAC, Brake controller, Trans temp gauge, Al's Upper Arms