Input from California CRD owners - CA Emission Tests

kidjedi · **Posted:** Wed Apr 17, 2013 5:05 pm

Infinite_Karma wrote:

Good to hear that it was relatively painless.

When I had my 05 Jeep Liberty CRD lmt. smogged, the mechanic opened the hood, took out a manual and read it for five minutes. He ran the engine for 20 minutes while he ate lunch, came back and looked for any CELs (none), revved the engine while looking in the side mirror for black smoke (saw none) and passed my vehicle.

$50.00 and done.

I am not sure how often we have to smog it here in California, but I'll find out soon I'm sure.

Here on the Front Range it used to just be a visual inspection like that, but now they hook the exhaust up to a computer and run the vehicle like it's pulling a trailer uphill at 60mph (at least that's how the tech described it). Vehicles 10 years old and older have to pay their $50-$100 and do the emissions test every two years (regular gas vehicles simply drive by the road side check points and are cleared --doesn't seem fair, but what are you gonna do?).

SFHLibertyCRD · **Posted:** Fri Aug 09, 2013 12:53 pm

I might be getting an out of state CRD that has a provent installed. Will I need to reverse this for CA smog inspection? I'm guessing it qualifies as "tampering" with the emissions system?

The car I'm looking at has GDE tune, which I understand is no problem, and a pretty obvious provent job (or some other filter) with 2 very red hoses running across the engine.

Would appreciate any feedback you have. I have a stock Golf TDI that I've never had any problem with. But it's stock so . . .

Thoughts? Should I even risk trying to get it smogged, or just pull it all back to stock first?

DOC4444 · **Posted:** Fri Aug 09, 2013 1:26 pm

It is so easy to put back to stock, no sense risking it.

DOC

kidjedi · **Posted:** Fri Aug 09, 2013 10:40 pm

SFHLibertyCRD wrote:

I might be getting an out of state CRD that has a provent installed. Will I need to reverse this for CA smog inspection? I'm guessing it qualifies as "tampering" with the emissions system?

The car I'm looking at has GDE tune, which I understand is no problem, and a pretty obvious provent job (or some other filter) with 2 very red hoses running across the engine.

Would appreciate any feedback you have. I have a stock Golf TDI that I've never had any problem with. But it's stock so . . .

Thoughts? Should I even risk trying to get it smogged, or just pull it all back to stock first?

I would call the place you're taking it to. The guy I took mine to was very down to earth. I didn't have my provent installed yet, but I'm sure he would have told me if I needed to unhook it before performing the test. He may have also told me not to worry about it. The provent is actually removing impurities that would end up in the environment, so it should be viewed as a good thing as far as emissions go. Who knows what they'll say though.

MtnClimber · **Posted:** Sun Dec 29, 2013 6:35 pm

kidjedi wrote:

I'm posting this not to start any arguments, but for those finding this thread in the future who are as "terrified" as I was after hearing all these horror stories about diesel emissions testing and needing to be on a four-wheel dynamometer. This is simply my personal experience with getting the diesel emissions test done.

It seems that all of the hubbub over the "dangers" of putting your '06 CRD on a two wheel dynamometer are WILDLY exaggerated. Perhaps they stand for the '05 model, but evidently whatever changes they made to the '06 took care of any issues with testing the vehicle on a two wheel dynamometer with the ESP disengaged.

I just had my inspection done at S&S Services off 120th in Broomfield, CO. No issues whatsoever. In fact, I did everything "wrong" just to play guinea pig. I didn't warm up the vehicle. I didn't worry about how full the tank was. I didn't use biodiesel. Etc. etc. I basically ignored all the recommendations I've found in my research over the past two months. Actually... I had cleaned out my MAP sensor and I did use a fuel additive (but that's just because I've been adding it at every fill up).

I made my appt. for a day where the weather wouldn't be bad and the temp would be over 40 degrees (their rules). At the time of testing, the ambient air temperature was right around 50 degrees, maybe just a little under.

10 minutes before the appt. I started my Jeep and drove it to the testing facility (FWIW, the tank was about half full). After hearing all the horror stories of people putting their CRD's on the two-wheel rollers, I cringed a little bit when I handed over my keys. I did make sure to tell the tech to MAKE SURE the ESP button was pushed so everything was off. He let me know he knew all about it, and said they would even unhook the ABS if it was necessary (turns out it wasn't).

Half an hour later, I got my keys back and was on my merry way. The ABS and a few other lights came on when I started the car, but they all turned off before I even had a chance to put it in drive.

The tech said the vehicle blew a little dirty, but was because I hadn't warmed up the engine (at all). Zero shift 0% opacity. 40mph was 4% opacity. 50mph was 5%. 60 mpg was 9%.

Pretty painless (other than being out the $55). Two years and I'll have to do it again.

I also had my 2006 CRD emissions test done at S&S Services off 120th in Broomfield, CO back in Feb. 2012 and mine passed just as yours did, but my CRD also had the ABS and a couple of other lights come on as I started my jeep up when leaving. Had the tech seen this he would have had to fail the vehicle. Just as your though the lights went off within a couple of minutes.

I am coming due for my 2 yr emissions test and this time I will be going to GO Jeep as I want my vehicle tested on the 4-wheel all-wheel drive Dyno so as to not put the jeep into the fault condition again.

As far as not being able to just use the roadside drive-by emissions test units is a bunch of crock, but what are you going to do.

kidjedi · **Posted:** Sun Dec 29, 2013 7:03 pm

MtnClimber wrote:

I also had my 2006 CRD emissions test done at S&S Services off 120th in Broomfield, CO back in Feb. 2012 and mine passed just as yours did, but my CRD also had the ABS and a couple of other lights come on as I started my jeep up when leaving. Had the tech seen this he would have had to fail the vehicle. Just as your though the lights went off within a couple of minutes.

For the record, this is not true. All Liberty CRD's will enter "limp mode" after the test on a two wheel dynamo. The tech guy will tell you that himself. However, the warning lights (ABS, etc.) go off after 15 minutes or less and everything's fine.

MtnClimber wrote:

I am coming due for my 2 yr emissions test and this time I will be going to GO Jeep as I want my vehicle tested on the 4-wheel all-wheel drive Dyno so as to not put the jeep into the fault condition again.

Be aware that it's going to cost you nearly twice as much. I am curious though as to whether this will also trigger limp mode. Hopefully you can post after the test? Thanks.

kidjedi · **Posted:** Fri Apr 24, 2015 1:23 pm

Sitting here outside of S&S having my test done again (on a two wheel dynamo). Fingers crossed. Would love to hear from others who've had their tests done on a four wheel dynamo (specifically did the same lights come on, did it enter limp mode?).

stp2136 · **Joined:** Sat Sep 29, 2007 8:30 am **Posts:** 35

There is no problem emission testing an '06 on a 2 wheel dyno as long as ESP is disabled. Had mine done since new (every 2 years) in several different shops in Ft. Collins area. No limp mode after either. When car is restarted ESP is automatically re-enabled. And it doesn't really stress the Liberty much either. Also no problem emission testing the Jetta TDI either with similar ESP system.

kidjedi · **Posted:** Sat Apr 25, 2015 12:20 pm

Thanks for chiming in, stp2136. While I don't know if there's absolutely *no* problem (it does trigger your dash lights --I've attached a photo), this is the second time I've put mine on a two wheel dynamo with only about a 15 period of "sub-par" (lights and last time limp mode) after the test.

Sometimes if those dash lights are on too long (brake, esp/bas, abs, esp on/off) the vehicle will throw a CEL that then has to be turned off (by someone with an OBD/ECM Scanner).

I'd still like to know how the Jeep CRD behaves on a 4 wheel dynamo, and if the lowest price is still around $100 for the 4 wheel (vs. $50 for the 2 wheel, the cheapest I've been able to find).

p.s. Shout out to Steve at S&S Services on Teller in Broomfield for this go round.

SFHLibertyCRD · **Posted:** Mon Apr 27, 2015 6:18 pm

Infinite_Karma wrote:

Good to hear that it was relatively painless.

When I had my 05 Jeep Liberty CRD lmt. smogged, the mechanic opened the hood, took out a manual and read it for five minutes. He ran the engine for 20 minutes while he ate lunch, came back and looked for any CELs (none), revved the engine while looking in the side mirror for black smoke (saw none) and passed my vehicle.

$50.00 and done.

I am not sure how often we have to smog it here in California, but I'll find out soon I'm sure.

I'm pretty sure it's every 2 years.

weeks101 · **Joined:** Mon Jul 30, 2012 3:29 pm **Posts:** 747

Would any of you Californians or anyone having to perform regular emissions testing, specifically with GDE tunes, be interested in an intake elbow kit that retains the over-boost functionality Keith developed for his tunes? Essentially, the kit wouldn't bypass any of the EGR components, but you would get the benefits of a higher flow intake elbow and much easier glow plug access. It would include a replacement intake-side EGR tube (from intake elbow to EGR valve). The elbow would be powdercoated texture black; it basically looks OEM unless you REALLY know what to look for.

GreenDieselEngineering · **Joined:** Sun Jun 07, 2009 5:10 pm **Posts:** 1111

weeks101 wrote:

Would any of you Californians or anyone having to perform regular emissions testing, specifically with GDE tunes, be interested in an intake elbow kit that retains the over-boost functionality Keith developed for his tunes? Essentially, the kit wouldn't bypass any of the EGR components, but you would get the benefits of a higher flow intake elbow and much easier glow plug access. It would include a replacement intake-side EGR tube (from intake elbow to EGR valve). The elbow would be powdercoated texture black; it basically looks OEM unless you REALLY know what to look for.

Seth,

We did not develop over-boost code on the KJ. I think you are referring to the turbo surge protection that is in the base software from Chrysler. We kept those settings stock. The situation when it activates is after accelerating up a hill and cresting, then letting off the throttle quickly. There are high levels of boost in the intake that puts pressure on the compressor wheel and can cause a flow reversal leading to turbo surge, sounds like whoosh, whoosh, whoosh from the airbox. Chrysler opens the egr valve in that situation to bleed off excess boost out through the egr loop to reduce stress on the compressor wheel.

In a past job at Detroit Diesel, we had similar issues on the Series 60 engine for semis. The surging led to low cycle fatigue failure of the compressor wheel. That engine was designed for 1 million miles and we were failing turbos after about 300,000 miles due to the surging. This was back in the year 2000 and many OEMs developed algorithms to address the surging for improved turbo life in subsequent years.

Bleeding boost through an egr loop is one method and the other method is opening the turbo vanes. The KJ cannot implement the turbo vane opening algorithm due to the slow response of the vacuum control on the turbo vanes, that is the primary reason they chose the egr bleed method.

weeks101 · **Joined:** Mon Jul 30, 2012 3:29 pm **Posts:** 747

GreenDieselEngineering wrote:

I think you are referring to the turbo surge protection that is in the base software from Chrysler. We kept those settings stock.

Yes, that's what I was referring to, thanks for the clarification Keith.

Rixram · **Posted:** Tue May 05, 2015 8:26 am

ChooChooman74 wrote:

Rixram use to work at Newport Biodiesel and ran B100 in the summer with no issues.

Sounds like the Colorado test is a pain.

Sent from my DROID BIONIC using Tapatalk 2

Wow. Good memory!

Yes, I ran B100 (technically B99, for legislation in RI classifies Bio as an "additive", thus avoiding state tax, so 1 gallon of diesel/1,000 gallons bio added) from spring to fall.

I made a calculation error this past winter, and accidentally blended up B40 in the tank (splash-mixed) when it was 20° outside. Had to burn that one down ASAP, and install a new fuel filter.

Overall, the CRD ran better on the biodiesel, quieter. The mileage dropped by about 3-5%, due to a slightly lower BTU equivalent compared to dino-diesel, but that was acceptable. Never any emissions issues, visually or olfactory. Worst drawback is craving French fries when smelling the exhaust.

chefsal · **Posted:** Thu Jun 11, 2015 1:13 pm

weeks101 wrote:

Would any of you Californians or anyone having to perform regular emissions testing, specifically with GDE tunes, be interested in an intake elbow kit that retains the over-boost functionality Keith developed for his tunes? Essentially, the kit wouldn't bypass any of the EGR components, but you would get the benefits of a higher flow intake elbow and much easier glow plug access. It would include a replacement intake-side EGR tube (from intake elbow to EGR valve). The elbow would be powdercoated texture black; it basically looks OEM unless you REALLY know what to look for.

I would most likely be interested in this kit, for the benefits you describe as well as maintaining the Chrysler turbo surge protection programming.

weeks101 · **Joined:** Mon Jul 30, 2012 3:29 pm **Posts:** 747

So far you are the sole person who has expressed interest. If I can get 10 people to commit I can make it happen, so spread the word. If you send me your email address I will keep you in the loop on this.

Mike92104 · **Posted:** Thu Jun 11, 2015 6:53 pm

weeks101 wrote:

Would any of you Californians or anyone having to perform regular emissions testing, specifically with GDE tunes, be interested in an intake elbow kit that retains the over-boost functionality Keith developed for his tunes? Essentially, the kit wouldn't bypass any of the EGR components, but you would get the benefits of a higher flow intake elbow and much easier glow plug access. It would include a replacement intake-side EGR tube (from intake elbow to EGR valve). The elbow would be powdercoated texture black; it basically looks OEM unless you REALLY know what to look for.

I'd be interested as well.

weeks101 · **Joined:** Mon Jul 30, 2012 3:29 pm **Posts:** 747

Mike, please send me your email address I will add to to the list of interested parties.

Input from California CRD owners - CA Emission Tests

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