CRD rocker arm wear...more info

dieseldoesit · **Posted:** Tue Mar 12, 2013 5:56 pm

GDE,

When you state that the engine was toast, was it just the rockers? If not what else was worn out on the engine?

GreenDieselEngineering · **Joined:** Sun Jun 07, 2009 5:10 pm **Posts:** 1111

dieseldoesit wrote:

GDE,

When you state that the engine was toast, was it just the rockers? If not what else was worn out on the engine?

It dropped an exhaust valve in the #4 cylinder and wasted it. It is toast until we rebuild that cylinder and a full bearing set at a minimum.

Glend · **Posted:** Wed Mar 13, 2013 8:15 am

I support Keith's words on the absence of rocker failures in Australia, I have not been able to find a single one and that's on a base of vehicles going back to the 2.5L in 2002.
There have been some timing belt failures, most due to ignoring the manufacturers (ie, VM's) recomendation on service interval and of course rockers are usually damaged then; but none self-destructing on their own.

dieseldoesit · **Posted:** Wed Mar 13, 2013 10:27 am

GreenDieselEngineering wrote:

dieseldoesit wrote:

GDE,

When you state that the engine was toast, was it just the rockers? If not what else was worn out on the engine?

It dropped an exhaust valve in the #4 cylinder and wasted it. It is toast until we rebuild that cylinder and a full bearing set at a minimum.

Sorry, I forgot that you mentioned that already. Thanks for all the work you guys do!

caseyg · **Posted:** Sat Mar 16, 2013 10:17 am

You people are scaring the crap out of me. I got a 2005 CRD with 205000 on it. I been using 0-40 Mobile one since I got it at 56000. I have also been too lazy about oil changes, seldom earlier than 8000 mi more like 10000. put the t-6 in for two change intervals and my turbo quit at around 165000 mi. I don't think that had anything to do with it but I wonder.
I have been driving with a check engine light since 90,000. Had mechanic look at it and read the posts about the EGR so didn't sweat it. Had to stomp the gas pedal when I went to change lanes and got in front of a BIG truck at around 198000 mi blew a VERY dark cloud out the tailpipe got slammed into the seat as I launched out of the way. Never knew it had that much power. CEL light is out and only see it at start up like I should.?? wtf!
The only noise I hear is when I first start on a real cold day. I get a lot of rattle but quiets down right away. I drive the crap out of it too, over 700 miles a day. I had to replace the rear end at around 100,000 mi and changed the timing belt at 130000. only other problem was the fuel heater/filter. Changed that because of the leaky heater plug.
I need to fix the left rear window cause that clip broke and I'm getting signs of rust under the paint at the upper brake light in back.
So whats the shpiel in the oil and rocker wear?I'm like a "it ain't broke don't fix it " kind of guy. But with my income if i go down I'm in a world of s--t.
One other thing, I have been reading posts about some kind of GDE tune people have done. What is that and is it important. Figure I'm as dumb as a rock when it comes to CRD's. not really but pretty close.

papaindigo · **Posted:** Sat Mar 16, 2013 11:34 am

GDE tune see http://www.greendieselengineering.com/g ... ethod=home Worth every penny and more.

caseyg · **Posted:** Sat Mar 16, 2013 11:51 am

Thanks,looks like good info. Ill try to get in touch with someone there to find out about turnaround time and so on. Don't want to try the reflash myself cause computers never do what I want them to do. One Question, I see the $50.00 flash they sell but whats the diff between that and the $500.00 one?

DOC4444 · **Posted:** Sat Mar 16, 2013 12:22 pm

The $50 fee is to restore a tune that was lost due to a dealer or other reflash.

There is no cheaper way to get all the benefits of a GDE tune any other way. Regular ECO tune is the way to go if you do not plan to replace your torque converter. (You can always upgrade later for a small fee if you get a stronger TC.)

I would say that you have gotten your $$$ worth as much as anyone has from your CRD.

My suggestion is that you buy an ELM327:

http://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_trksid= ... &_from=R40

and the Torque Pro app for your phone and do the MAP idle test.

This will assess the level of rocker bearing surface wear without taking anything apart.

CATCRD thinks anything over 17 at 760 RPM at sea level means you are OK.

Please post results.

DOC

papaindigo · **Posted:** Sat Mar 16, 2013 12:48 pm

Turn around time is usually amazing but not right now as they are on vacation or some such until March 25. Ship the ECU to them in a USPS flat rate box and my experience has been you will have it back in 4-5 days not counting Sunday and that's the elapsed time from N. Florida.

Tinman · **Joined:** Mon Apr 10, 2006 10:45 am **Posts:** 308

Keith: To be clear, it is acceptable to run 15w40 in these engines? I have been wanting to try this as my family has 6 other engines that run 15-40 and would love to just have one oil type to buy. Plus I think I found a source for large quantities of CI-4+ but I have to confirm for myself.

Mark: the 06 Cummins is a great engine and I bought an 06 just to get ahead of the emissions crap. While Keith is a great tuner, the CAN-BUS 06 and 07 5.9 Cummins are supported by EFILive and there are a bunch of really knowledgeable turners out there right now. I've been tuning my own but need to get to a pro. To clarify, the '04.5 to '07.5 (5.9 engines) DO NOT have external EGR as does Ford and Chevy. It does have an "internal" egr effect from cam timing, injection timing, turbo exhaust manifold and piston crown design. The cam exhaust valve timing is the most crucial as it opens very late and doesn't scavenge all the exhaust gases out so some get left behind, creating an auto "internal" egr. For this reason I put in a proper performance cam. This engine series has a cat but none of the other exhaust after treatment on the 6.7. I agree that this is one of the best, if not the best engine in the Dodge/Cummins line (sans maybe a 12 valve with a p7100 pump). This engine with a proper cam and EFILive to tune it, it's hard to beat. Good luck trying to find someone willing to let go of one.

GreenDieselEngineering · **Joined:** Sun Jun 07, 2009 5:10 pm **Posts:** 1111

15W-40 and 10W-40 are the most common engine oils used in the VM engine outside of North America. VM states the oil must have a CG rating or later, so just about anything will work. I would base the oil change interval on the quality of oil you use and maybe a few samples sent in for oil analysis. 15W-40 is specified for ambient temps from -10 to 40 C.

The official VM "green book" does not even list the 0w-40 in the 2005 and 2006 model years. This was an internal push by Chrysler to gain 1mpg in the emission test cycle and have better starting in Canada.

I would have fixed the starting issue with an extra tooth on the starter pinion, a larger CCA battery and a higher kW rating for the starter motor. Of course, that all costs money and would be a non starter with the brain power at Chrysler.

spoon · **Posted:** Sat Mar 23, 2013 12:33 am

DOC4444, what should the MAP idle test be for a 7000 ft altitude. I would have a long way to get to sea level.

DOC4444 · **Posted:** Sat Mar 23, 2013 7:19 am

CATCRD would be the person to ask.

DOC

Tinman · **Joined:** Mon Apr 10, 2006 10:45 am **Posts:** 308

Thanks Keith. I confirmed I can get delo 400 multigrade CI-4+ so I am gonna switch to that at next oil change. I'll follow that up with some UOA's and post. I live Georgia so it really don't get cold enough to work about changing in winter.

Terrence · **Posted:** Wed Mar 27, 2013 5:33 pm

spoon wrote:

DOC4444, what should the MAP idle test be for a 7000 ft altitude. I would have a long way to get to sea level.

I am wondering the same thing I am about 6500ft but can drive up the hill to get to an even 7000 I have 172K with no GDE and EHM and ORM only since 156K and as far as I know Mobil 1 0W40 since new At 6K intervals.

CATCRD · **Posted:** Wed Mar 27, 2013 10:55 pm

Well mine are both 15 at 5000 ft, so at 7000 I would ballpark it at 14.

Terrence · **Posted:** Thu Mar 28, 2013 12:54 pm

CATCRD wrote:

Well mine are both 15 at 5000 ft, so at 7000 I would ballpark it at 14.

Thanks, without hearing that I would probably freak out when I do it and see the results. (I may still if it looks bad)

kapalczynski · **Posted:** Sat Mar 30, 2013 8:38 am

Keith, did you snap any photos of the wear and the damage at the failure points? Just curious what the worn arms and cams look like compared to the new ones.

- Mark

Terrence · **Posted:** Tue Apr 02, 2013 3:23 pm

So I checked my MAF readings today and got 14.1 @ 6900 Ft elevation, engine at operating temp and idle @760RPM. So I am assuming my rockers should be in relatively good shape. Anyone have any input on the number?
BTW I have been running the ORM since I got the jeep and was never sure if I had any other codes in the computer I was glad to see only the MAF code.
Thanks Terrence

CATCRD · **Posted:** Tue Apr 02, 2013 7:24 pm

Terrence wrote:

So I checked my MAF readings today and got 14.1 @ 6900 Ft elevation, engine at operating temp and idle @760RPM. So I am assuming my rockers should be in relatively good shape. Anyone have any input on the number?
BTW I have been running the ORM since I got the jeep and was never sure if I had any other codes in the computer I was glad to see only the MAF code.
Thanks Terrence

Sounds good to me.

CRD rocker arm wear...more info

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