LOST JEEPS :: View topic - TC and Trans Pump Aggrivation

Did they ever get you a loaner car or did they just leave you hanging to rack up miles on your other personal vehicle?

I am starting to think maybe I should reconsider my decision not to purchase the 100k mile extended warranty.

I have 30k on mine, no tranny problems. Just had the tranny serviced at a local shop (not dealer); Changed fluids, filters, etc. He said there was "some" metal in the pan, but nothing beyond what would be expected at first tranny service. Cost was $ 154.

vtdog wrote:

Your transmission must have not been assembled on a Friday at the factory :lol:

no-blue-screen wrote:

I am starting to think maybe I should reconsider my decision not to purchase the 100k mile extended warranty.

They will not discount it, that's for sure! It seems awfully coincidental that they are getting the majority of the 2006 models reflashed with the recall, but none of the 2005 unless you really fight for it.

2006 models don't have the 7/70 powertrain warranty, so if they can make it last 36k miles with just a software flash, they win.

I know, I know, sounds like a conspiracy theory - but I just don't trust anything they (DC, dealers, ect) say anymore...

I know, I know, sounds like a conspiracy theory - but I just don't trust anything they (DC, dealers, ect) say anymore...

I believe a lot of the transmission issues on the 2005 models are caused by the plugged filters that were part of a TSB. I bought mine with 8K miles on it as a 5 Star certified vehicle. I couldn't believe any fool would trade in a 6 month old car with 8,000 miles unless he thought something was bad wrong (5 Star includes a Carfax no wrecks or floods certification).
Anyway I had it 3 days and every morning it would shake like heck when I first put it in drive and finally on day 3 it killed the engine pulling out of the driveway. Root cause - plugged filters and the torque converter pump was struggling to get the TC refilled. No wonder the guy got rid of it. A guy on this site was kind enough to share the TSB with me and heck any good tranny shop always changes fluid and filters if an auto is misbehaving.
I took it back to the dealer and he told me nothing was wrong with the tranny until I told him under PA law it was less than 5 business days since I bought the vehicle, and I wanted my money back. He did the TSB real fast after that promise and changed the fluid and filters (there are 2 filters) and it has not misbehaved since in 4 months and 5k miles.
A lot of the offroaders are buiding TJ's with hemi's and 545 transmissions and they say they are bullet proof. (they get them from wrecked Jeep Grand's and it's a "drop in" installation if you leave the hemi, tranny and computer intact. Four Wheeler had an article a while back where the owner of Currie Enterprises had built a TJ like this for his off road "lab".
This transmission was recenly noted in a Four Wheeler article for it's tough reputation for what that's worth. If these things are built right they will take a lot more torque and abuse than the little old CRD 2.8 can give them. These TJ Wrangler guys flog them!!!

I believe a lot of the transmission issues on the 2005 models are caused by the plugged filters that were part of a TSB

I believe a lot of the transmission issues on the 2005 models are caused by the plugged filters that were part of a TSB.

A lot of the offroaders are buiding TJ's with hemi's and 545 transmissions and they say they are bullet proof. (they get them from wrecked Jeep Grand's and it's a "drop in" installation if you leave the hemi, tranny and computer intact. Four Wheeler had an article a while back where the owner of Currie Enterprises had built a TJ like this for his off road "lab".
This transmission was recenly noted in a Four Wheeler article for it's tough reputation for what that's worth. If these things are built right they will take a lot more torque and abuse than the little old CRD 2.8 can give them. These TJ Wrangler guys flog them!!!

o, we can extoll the merits of the 545RFE in other models, but remember the 545RFE TCM is having a hard time speaking Italian with the VM Motori ECM.

Joe,
I have personally had pretty good experience with my dealer, and he didn't sell me my Liberty CRD. I found my Liberty thru Carfax, and had to drive 50 miles to get it, as I got a good deal on a used one.
The local dealer also takes care of my Rubicon, and I didn't buy that one from them either.
He just happens to be a good dealer and takes care of his customers. They also own a GMC-Pontiac dealership, Subaru store, Volvo and a Toyota business as well. A lot of successful car dealers horizontally integrate these days.
I think the trick is to find a good dealer and have a mutual relationship. He only retailed one CRD himself, and I use this wonderful website to help him fix the few problems I have had (mainly EGR) on mine. He views it as I am helping him, and he says 2 CRD's are easier to support than 1.
I think that establishing a positive relationship with a successful dealer that wants to grow his business is the key. You can find them.
I also don't think Toyota builds as strong a car as the USA. This Liberty will outlive any ordinary rice burner. They don't call our cars "Yank Tanks" overseas for nothing!

Author:	DZL_LOU [ Fri Aug 18, 2006 11:28 am ]
Post subject:	TC and Trans Pump Aggrivation
The 05 CRD with 24K miles has been at the Dealership for two weeks now waiting on parts the TC and Transmission Pump. DCX has advised the tech to warranty these items after failure. Since the 545RFE is in the CRD, I would assume that the TC and transmission pump would be readily available. However, I have been told that the pump has been redesigned and is on back order. Last update from the Dealership tech was that the pump is being shipped via "Special Order" and "Vehicle Off Road" statusto expedite the delivery, but that update was last week. This week the tech was setting expectations that the pump, when it arrives, will need to be assembled on site since orders for this pump are so numerous that the factory does not have time to assemble them. Can't get a straight answer out of anyone just yet so I keep making twice daily visits to the dealership. I just can't see the GC coming out successfully with the Diesel Blue-tec option if service is going to be this dismal for the GC as it is for the CRD. Thank heavens that the CRD VM Motori engine has been bullet-proof in service. It's sad, it's weak point is the transmission. IMHO, I wish that DCX would have offered the manual option upon purchase or even the manual option as a retro-fit along with reprogramming the ECM and TCM for the manual. We know it's currently sold as a manual option for export. The CCV, EGR issue unless re-designed in the GC will also haunt it's success. I hope DCX has learned from it's mistakes with the rollout of the CRD

Author:	alljeep [ Fri Aug 18, 2006 1:08 pm ]
Post subject:
This should have all of us VERY worried. I know I will not be abble to afford 2+ weeks without my vehicle once my CRD hits the mileage you are at. If you ever do get the redesigned pump, the rest of us are still screwed to eventually go through the same process. I have been keeping mine in the garage as much as possible to allow for these redesigned parts to get produced so when it happens to me they can actually fix it. My TC shudder has been slowly getting worse - even with the absolute up to date most recent reflash of the TCM & ECM. Too bad you are at 24k when this happened as Indiana Lemon Law applies for up to 18 months or 18k miles from the in-service date. Did they ever get you a loaner car or did they just leave you hanging to rack up miles on your other personal vehicle?

Author:	Bovie [ Fri Aug 18, 2006 1:19 pm ]
Post subject:
That sucks, I hope they are giving you a loner. Let us know if they get everything fixed. Mabye it's a good thing they are redesigning the TC.

Author:	no-blue-screen [ Fri Aug 18, 2006 1:36 pm ]
Post subject:
Sorry to hear about this. I have an appointment to take mine in for the ECM/TCM TSB next Thursday. I currently have 1100 miles on mine, and I hope this reflash is enough to make this baby last. I am starting to think maybe I should reconsider my decision not to purchase the 100k mile extended warranty.

Author:	DZL_LOU [ Fri Aug 18, 2006 1:38 pm ]
Post subject:
alljeep wrote: Did they ever get you a loaner car or did they just leave you hanging to rack up miles on your other personal vehicle? I asked for a loaner this just Wednesday after the wife wanted the MiniVan back. Warranty coverage only allots $35/day for 5 days on the loaner. They "fixed" me up with a new PT Cruiser to drive. It's a piece of junk that only gets 22 mpg highway compared to 30mpg for my CRD. I call it the PT Bruiser since it the seats are so uncomfortable. About the only head turns I get are from pre-teens (due to the candy apple red paint color) and geriatrics! Why in the world did GM copy this thing with the HHR?

LOST JEEPS http://www.lostjeeps.com/forum/phpBB3/

TC and Trans Pump Aggrivation http://www.lostjeeps.com/forum/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=5&t=11522	Page 1 of 8

Author:	alljeep [ Fri Aug 18, 2006 1:41 pm ]
Post subject:
no-blue-screen wrote: I am starting to think maybe I should reconsider my decision not to purchase the 100k mile extended warranty. They will not discount it, that's for sure! It seems awfully coincidental that they are getting the majority of the 2006 models reflashed with the recall, but none of the 2005 unless you really fight for it. 2006 models don't have the 7/70 powertrain warranty, so if they can make it last 36k miles with just a software flash, they win. I know, I know, sounds like a conspiracy theory - but I just don't trust anything they (DC, dealers, ect) say anymore...

Author:	oldnavy [ Fri Aug 18, 2006 1:43 pm ]
Post subject:
If the GC comes with a MB tranny instead of the 545RLE we might trade the Liberty in, but the wife likes the up high perch of the Liberty.

Author:	vtdog [ Fri Aug 18, 2006 1:45 pm ]
Post subject:
I have 30k on mine, no tranny problems. Just had the tranny serviced at a local shop (not dealer); Changed fluids, filters, etc. He said there was "some" metal in the pan, but nothing beyond what would be expected at first tranny service. Cost was $ 154.

Author:	DZL_LOU [ Fri Aug 18, 2006 1:50 pm ]
Post subject:
vtdog wrote: I have 30k on mine, no tranny problems. Just had the tranny serviced at a local shop (not dealer); Changed fluids, filters, etc. He said there was "some" metal in the pan, but nothing beyond what would be expected at first tranny service. Cost was $ 154. Your transmission must have not been assembled on a Friday at the factory

Author:	no-blue-screen [ Fri Aug 18, 2006 2:42 pm ]
Post subject:
DZL_LOU wrote: vtdog wrote: I have 30k on mine, no tranny problems. Just had the tranny serviced at a local shop (not dealer); Changed fluids, filters, etc. He said there was "some" metal in the pan, but nothing beyond what would be expected at first tranny service. Cost was $ 154. Your transmission must have not been assembled on a Friday at the factory Or right after they distributed bonuses

Author:	Joe Romas [ Sat Aug 19, 2006 8:06 am ]
Post subject:
alljeep wrote: no-blue-screen wrote: I am starting to think maybe I should reconsider my decision not to purchase the 100k mile extended warranty. They will not discount it, that's for sure! It seems awfully coincidental that they are getting the majority of the 2006 models reflashed with the recall, but none of the 2005 unless you really fight for it. 2006 models don't have the 7/70 powertrain warranty, so if they can make it last 36k miles with just a software flash, they win. I know, I know, sounds like a conspiracy theory - but I just don't trust anything they (DC, dealers, ect) say anymore... Ditto Here. I'm a low mileage driver have a 06 and definetly will get screwed unless DC is forced to recall them all.. Or I have to fork out more money on the extended warranty to cover their screw up..

Author:	vtdog [ Sun Aug 20, 2006 4:52 pm ]
Post subject:
Quote: I know, I know, sounds like a conspiracy theory - but I just don't trust anything they (DC, dealers, ect) say anymore... You should never, ever trust a dealer, or any employee thereof. It doesnt matter if its DCX, or Rolls Royce. They are all lying weasles. It's just a matter of trying to find the dealer thats the least weasly.

Author:	TDICRD58 [ Sun Aug 20, 2006 6:45 pm ]
Post subject:
I believe a lot of the transmission issues on the 2005 models are caused by the plugged filters that were part of a TSB. I bought mine with 8K miles on it as a 5 Star certified vehicle. I couldn't believe any fool would trade in a 6 month old car with 8,000 miles unless he thought something was bad wrong (5 Star includes a Carfax no wrecks or floods certification). Anyway I had it 3 days and every morning it would shake like heck when I first put it in drive and finally on day 3 it killed the engine pulling out of the driveway. Root cause - plugged filters and the torque converter pump was struggling to get the TC refilled. No wonder the guy got rid of it. A guy on this site was kind enough to share the TSB with me and heck any good tranny shop always changes fluid and filters if an auto is misbehaving. I took it back to the dealer and he told me nothing was wrong with the tranny until I told him under PA law it was less than 5 business days since I bought the vehicle, and I wanted my money back. He did the TSB real fast after that promise and changed the fluid and filters (there are 2 filters) and it has not misbehaved since in 4 months and 5k miles. A lot of the offroaders are buiding TJ's with hemi's and 545 transmissions and they say they are bullet proof. (they get them from wrecked Jeep Grand's and it's a "drop in" installation if you leave the hemi, tranny and computer intact. Four Wheeler had an article a while back where the owner of Currie Enterprises had built a TJ like this for his off road "lab". This transmission was recenly noted in a Four Wheeler article for it's tough reputation for what that's worth. If these things are built right they will take a lot more torque and abuse than the little old CRD 2.8 can give them. These TJ Wrangler guys flog them!!!

Author:	oldnavy [ Sun Aug 20, 2006 7:04 pm ]
Post subject:
TDICRD58 I pretty much concure with you, I had the TSB done at about 1500 miles. The wife always started the engine, put on seat belts, hit the garage door opener and even when not in the garage I have taught her to always give the vehicle at least 30 sec to a minute run time to pump up fluids before taking the tranny out of park. I think this is why we never had the problem with tranny and the jerking that so many people have had, between waiting and TSB the tranny was never damaged.

Page 1 of 8	All times are UTC - 5 hours [ DST ]
Powered by phpBB © 2000, 2002, 2005, 2007 phpBB Group http://www.phpbb.com/

Author:	Joe Romas [ Sun Aug 20, 2006 7:16 pm ]
Post subject:
TDICRD58 wrote: I believe a lot of the transmission issues on the 2005 models are caused by the plugged filters that were part of a TSB. I bought mine with 8K miles on it as a 5 Star certified vehicle. I couldn't believe any fool would trade in a 6 month old car with 8,000 miles unless he thought something was bad wrong (5 Star includes a Carfax no wrecks or floods certification). Anyway I had it 3 days and every morning it would shake like heck when I first put it in drive and finally on day 3 it killed the engine pulling out of the driveway. Root cause - plugged filters and the torque converter pump was struggling to get the TC refilled. No wonder the guy got rid of it. A guy on this site was kind enough to share the TSB with me and heck any good tranny shop always changes fluid and filters if an auto is misbehaving. I took it back to the dealer and he told me nothing was wrong with the tranny until I told him under PA law it was less than 5 business days since I bought the vehicle, and I wanted my money back. He did the TSB real fast after that promise and changed the fluid and filters (there are 2 filters) and it has not misbehaved since in 4 months and 5k miles. A lot of the offroaders are buiding TJ's with hemi's and 545 transmissions and they say they are bullet proof. (they get them from wrecked Jeep Grand's and it's a "drop in" installation if you leave the hemi, tranny and computer intact. Four Wheeler had an article a while back where the owner of Currie Enterprises had built a TJ like this for his off road "lab". This transmission was recenly noted in a Four Wheeler article for it's tough reputation for what that's worth. If these things are built right they will take a lot more torque and abuse than the little old CRD 2.8 can give them. These TJ Wrangler guys flog them!!! You've just verified what vt_dog stated. Some poor slob took a beating and traded his 05 crd in because of very poor service. Then you were lucky enouth to come here and get the answere to your problem then threaten the dealer with legal action unless he did what he was supposed to do. You lucked out but the guy before you got screwed royally by DC. No wonder Toyota is closing in on the number one US car maker.

Author:	Ranger1 [ Sun Aug 20, 2006 8:43 pm ]
Post subject:
Quote: I believe a lot of the transmission issues on the 2005 models are caused by the plugged filters that were part of a TSB The TSB defined the date range with the defective tranny filters that allowed the fluid to drain out of the tc when not running. There was no issue defined of filter blockage, just a defective drainback valve listed in the TSB. Many others not in that date range never had the issue you describe, including mine, which never had any problem on startup movement or first drive engagement, regardless if you started out 5 seconds or 5 minutes after engine ignition. Yet tc's failed on these models also, and the last recall shows a large number of vehicles (10K) that are eligible for software updates. Then there is the issue of shudder/bucking/jerking on acceleration and cruising at 55-65 mph that is not remediated at all by replacing defective filters. Mine has had both filters replaced at the tc replacement, tranny fluid replaced and still shudders and bucks, sometimes violently and did so right out of the dealership with the new tc and latest TCM software applied. Tranny software is still involved. If a couple of filters would solve it, the shudder issue would be history by now.

Author:	TDICRD58 [ Sun Aug 20, 2006 8:51 pm ]
Post subject:
Joe, I have personally had pretty good experience with my dealer, and he didn't sell me my Liberty CRD. I found my Liberty thru Carfax, and had to drive 50 miles to get it, as I got a good deal on a used one. The local dealer also takes care of my Rubicon, and I didn't buy that one from them either. He just happens to be a good dealer and takes care of his customers. They also own a GMC-Pontiac dealership, Subaru store, Volvo and a Toyota business as well. A lot of successful car dealers horizontally integrate these days. I think the trick is to find a good dealer and have a mutual relationship. He only retailed one CRD himself, and I use this wonderful website to help him fix the few problems I have had (mainly EGR) on mine. He views it as I am helping him, and he says 2 CRD's are easier to support than 1. I think that establishing a positive relationship with a successful dealer that wants to grow his business is the key. You can find them. I also don't think Toyota builds as strong a car as the USA. This Liberty will outlive any ordinary rice burner. They don't call our cars "Yank Tanks" overseas for nothing!

Author:	DZL_LOU [ Sun Aug 20, 2006 9:22 pm ]
Post subject:
TDICRD58 wrote: I believe a lot of the transmission issues on the 2005 models are caused by the plugged filters that were part of a TSB. A lot of the offroaders are buiding TJ's with hemi's and 545 transmissions and they say they are bullet proof. (they get them from wrecked Jeep Grand's and it's a "drop in" installation if you leave the hemi, tranny and computer intact. Four Wheeler had an article a while back where the owner of Currie Enterprises had built a TJ like this for his off road "lab". This transmission was recenly noted in a Four Wheeler article for it's tough reputation for what that's worth. If these things are built right they will take a lot more torque and abuse than the little old CRD 2.8 can give them. These TJ Wrangler guys flog them!!! The TSB your referring to was to replace the sump filter and cooler return filter. It was because they were not the correct type causing symptoms of delayed transmission engagement after the vehicle sat overnight and the fluid drained out of the TC. The idea of "clogged" was never mentioned and would imply that something besides fluid was causing the clog. All things being equal, the 545RFE may be a great transmission. But in the case of the CRD, all things are not equal. The 545RFE does not seem to be "mated" correctly through both software and mechanics with the 2.8L Diesel. The export models equipped with the auto, are having the same issue according to posts from overseas. So, we can extoll the merits of the 545RFE in other models, but remember the 545RFE TCM is having a hard time speaking Italian with the VM Motori ECM.

Author:	Ranger1 [ Sun Aug 20, 2006 9:33 pm ]
Post subject:
Quote: o, we can extoll the merits of the 545RFE in other models, but remember the 545RFE TCM is having a hard time speaking Italian with the VM Motori ECM. Exactly. The (5)45RFE TCM works perfectly well when mated to the PCM on the V6 Liberty - my 02 shifts perfectly and has never had a shudder or a single flash update. But it's talking to the PCM Jeep/Chrysler designed. The CRD is using a Bosch ECM, talking to a Jeep/Chrysler TCM. No wonder its having problems - its speaking Italian to a German ECM.

Author:	Joe Romas [ Sun Aug 20, 2006 9:34 pm ]
Post subject:
TDICRD58 wrote: Joe, I have personally had pretty good experience with my dealer, and he didn't sell me my Liberty CRD. I found my Liberty thru Carfax, and had to drive 50 miles to get it, as I got a good deal on a used one. The local dealer also takes care of my Rubicon, and I didn't buy that one from them either. He just happens to be a good dealer and takes care of his customers. They also own a GMC-Pontiac dealership, Subaru store, Volvo and a Toyota business as well. A lot of successful car dealers horizontally integrate these days. I think the trick is to find a good dealer and have a mutual relationship. He only retailed one CRD himself, and I use this wonderful website to help him fix the few problems I have had (mainly EGR) on mine. He views it as I am helping him, and he says 2 CRD's are easier to support than 1. I think that establishing a positive relationship with a successful dealer that wants to grow his business is the key. You can find them. I also don't think Toyota builds as strong a car as the USA. This Liberty will outlive any ordinary rice burner. They don't call our cars "Yank Tanks" overseas for nothing! I agree totally about establishing good repore with the dealer. My dealer also has dealerships in several stated with most brands of cars. I service computers for a large company and know what they are up against with DC. But Some dealers just plain stink. My last new VW had the steering wheel off center while going stright ahead. The service writer told me that after the springs settled a bit it would be ok. Well that jetta tdi has 120k on it and the springs have not settled yet. Bull sh#$ or just good springs? I made a mental note not to return to that dealer. But the fact remains the first owner of your CRD took a bath and should not have had to. My dealer has sold several that I knew of and when a heater hose came off because of a clamp not properly placed I mentioned to the service manager the shudder/pulsing at 53 mph and he seemed to know just what I was talking about. I told him I didn't expect them to fix it but make note of it on the repair order. The dealers can't do a thing under warranty and get paid without DC's STAR approval. They are between a rock and a hard place and after the inferior ball joint problem I think DC will screw us if they can.