LOST JEEPS :: View topic - Buy a New Diesel In CA, NY, MA, ME, VT From a Dealer ...

O mi Gawrsh. It costs as much as two Liberty CRDs. They should capitalize the word LUXURY whenever they use it. "LUXURY SUV" -- Isn't that an oxymoron?
It has 10 diesel cylinders and they only officially rate the towing capacity at 7700 lbs? Kinda lame.

One other thing: the V-10 costs a bit more than the V-8. As in $16,030 more

Quote:

One other thing: the V-10 costs a bit more than the V-8. As in $16,030 more

HOLY PRICE GOUGING BATMAN! There has got to be something else that comes with the diesel package, besides just the enging and tranny, Thats insane!

Maybe we shouldnt say anything about the extra cost for the diesel until we see what DC is going to charge for the 3.0 on the GC

I wonder what the Touareg TDI resale will be like...

While I admit the Toureg is a formidable vehicle and that thing has to be a rocket (with 7,500 extra lbs along for the ride) I wouldnt be caught dead paying that much for any vehicle.

IMHO the manufacturers (DC included) are making a mistake only playing with diesel in select vehicles built for the more affluent market. They are also damaging the image of diesel as a responsible fuel choice by deploying SUVs tuned for performance that get marginally better fuel economy than their gasoline contemporaries.

Take the Jetta TDI (what I would like my GF to get) and give us a Toureg TDI (VW)
Take the Liberty CRD and give us a GC and Mercedes Diesels (DC) Not to mention not making a Diesel JK available.

Do we have to look to Honda to introduce more modest diesel vehicles?

I definately agree with you on that one. Keep in mind when I talk about tuned for performance I should say "overtuned" with a V10 and twin turbocharger. The GC's 3.0L is a little more appropriate.

To clarify when I refer to less affluent I am talking about the person who has the means and desire to buy a reasonably sized car (Jetta), wagon (Legacy) or small to mid-sized SUV (sort of like a KJ) not necessarily a Nissan Versa! I do realize the manufacturers are trying to do some "get your cake and eat it too" by dropping diesel's in larger SUVs.

I can agree with that. Don't get me wrong, I would NEVER pay 60k for a car...period. I also agree that a V-10 twin turbo is also overkill. I don't imagine the repair bills on that engine would be very cheap :shock:

Author:	richardkf [ Sun Dec 17, 2006 12:36 am ]
Post subject:	Buy a New Diesel In CA, NY, MA, ME, VT From a Dealer ...
Buy a New Diesel In CA, NY, MA, ME, VT From a Dealer ... While You Can. I wonder if this applies to other Diesels, or just the Touareg. From the NY Times ( http://www.nytimes.com/2006/12/17/autom ... BLOCK.html ): Around the Block A Diesel Sold Everywhere (for a Limited Time) By EZRA DYER Published: December 17, 2006 TESTED: 2006 Volkswagen Touareg V-10 TDI WHAT IS IT? Four-door midsize luxury S.U.V. HOW MUCH? $59,690 base, $63,540 as tested with $3,350 Navigation Plus Package (navigation system, rear camera and 11-speaker audio system) and $500 trailer hitch. WHAT’S UNDER THE HOOD? A 5-liter diesel V-10 with twin turbochargers (310 horsepower, 553 pound-feet of torque); 6-speed automatic transmission. E.P.A. MILEAGE: 17 m.p.g. city, 22 highway. EUROPEANS get all the cool diesels. A few months ago in Italy, I drove a diesel-powered Saab 9-3 convertible that did 125 miles an hour on the autostrada and returned 45 m.p.g. at more relaxed speeds. Modern diesels get hybridlike fuel economy without the complexity and wonky driving experience of a full hybrid. With monstrous torque, they’re relaxed on the highway and don’t need to rev hard to keep pace in stop-and-go traffic. And lest you think diesels represent some kind of worthy hardship, a grim penance in the name of economy, consider that 67 percent of the BMW’s sold in Europe are diesels. So why don’t we have more of them here? It all comes down to emissions laws — especially California’s. Getting a diesel engine to meet California’s rules is harder than getting a salary concession out of Scott Boras. New York, Massachusetts, Maine and Vermont also adhere to California standards, which takes a huge chunk of the market out of play. To paraphrase the Soup Nazi, then, “No diesel for you!” So how is it possible that right now you can walk into a Volkswagen dealership in Vermont — where the haze in the air doesn’t necessarily come from tailpipes, if you know what I’m saying — and buy a Touareg S.U.V. stuffed with a take-no-prisoners, 310-horsepower twin-turbo diesel V-10? It’s all about timing. Volkswagen took a look at its calendar and realized that the last few months of 2006 presented an opportunity to sell its monster V-10 Touareg in all 50 states. (The Touareg V-10 TDI was last available in 2004 as a 45-state model). The opportunity arose after the United States finally rolled out ultra-low-sulfur diesel fuel in September. The low-sulfur fuel permits the use of a particulate filter, which, in combination with the cleaner fuel, allows the engine to meet California emissions standards — 2006-level California emissions standards. The regulations ratchet up to a new degree of severity on Jan. 1, at which point the mighty diesel will once again be motora non grata in Manhattan, N.Y., and Manhattan Beach, Calif. Still, however, VW can sell 2006-model Touareg V-10s in all 50 states into 2007, until the ones it has imported (750 or so) are sold off. The company estimates that the supply will be gone by March. Audi, BMW, Ford, DaimlerChrysler, Honda, General Motors and VW are among the companies working on 50-state diesels for introduction in 2008 and 2009, so the ’06 Touareg diesel can be thought of as a preview of good things to come. With 553 pound-feet of torque, a prod of the accelerator sends the Touareg surging forward, often with a chirp from the front tires as the all-wheel-drive system shuffles power to cope with the thrust. While the V-10 isn’t as quick to 60 m.p.h. as the 350-horsepower gasoline V-8 (7.5 vs. 7.1 seconds, according to VW), it feels as if it wouldn’t be much slower while, say, towing a Boeing 747 down a runway. In fact, VW recently engaged in a bit of showmanship by doing exactly that, using a V-10 Touareg to tow a 155-ton 747 about 150 yards. While the V10’s official tow rating of 7,716 pounds isn’t any higher than the V-8’s, the V-10 is the one that would give your horses whiplash back in the trailer. (As I am very much against horse whiplash, I recommend towing only boats and inanimate objects with the Touareg V-10). As you’d expect, the diesel gets moderately better fuel economy, 22 m.p.g. on the highway to the V-8’s 19. One other thing: the V-10 costs a bit more than the V-8. As in $16,030 more — $59,690 versus $43,660. So there’s really no objective reason to buy this thing. You just have to want it because it’s cool, it’s exclusive and it puts a big smile on your face when those turbos light up and your 5,924-pound S.U.V. rockets forward as if it weighs less than a Miata. With respectable fuel economy and prodigious power, the 2006 Touareg V-10 TDI is a foreshadowing of America’s diesel future that you happen to be able to buy right now. Even in California.

Author:	KenJennings [ Sun Dec 17, 2006 1:17 am ]
Post subject:
O mi Gawrsh. It costs as much as two Liberty CRDs. They should capitalize the word LUXURY whenever they use it. "LUXURY SUV" -- Isn't that an oxymoron? It has 10 diesel cylinders and they only officially rate the towing capacity at 7700 lbs? Kinda lame.

Author:	oldnavy [ Sun Dec 17, 2006 1:55 am ]
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KenJennings wrote: O mi Gawrsh. It costs as much as two Liberty CRDs. They should capitalize the word LUXURY whenever they use it. "LUXURY SUV" -- Isn't that an oxymoron? It has 10 diesel cylinders and they only officially rate the towing capacity at 7700 lbs? Kinda lame. My guess it would be possible frame restriction or length restriction or a combo of both to limit it that low.

Author:	Jeger [ Sun Dec 17, 2006 7:27 am ]
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Quote: One other thing: the V-10 costs a bit more than the V-8. As in $16,030 more HOLY PRICE GOUGING BATMAN! There has got to be something else that comes with the diesel package, besides just the enging and tranny, Thats insane!

Author:	oldnavy [ Sun Dec 17, 2006 9:56 am ]
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Jeger wrote: Quote: One other thing: the V-10 costs a bit more than the V-8. As in $16,030 more HOLY PRICE GOUGING BATMAN! There has got to be something else that comes with the diesel package, besides just the enging and tranny, Thats insane! There is a big package deal with the TDI version that is optional or unavailable on V8 Touareg. Hey 2 turbos do raise the $$$ cost somewhat. I would love to have one that does not have half the standard lux crap that they put on this puppy.

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Author:	no-blue-screen [ Sun Dec 17, 2006 10:13 am ]
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way too expensive! Almost enough to buy 3 CRDs!

Author:	vtdog [ Sun Dec 17, 2006 11:52 am ]
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Maybe we shouldnt say anything about the extra cost for the diesel until we see what DC is going to charge for the 3.0 on the GC

Author:	oldnavy [ Sun Dec 17, 2006 12:42 pm ]
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vtdog wrote: Maybe we shouldnt say anything about the extra cost for the diesel until we see what DC is going to charge for the 3.0 on the GC Should be about the same as the 5.7L option. Just as on '05 CRD was about the same price over the 4 cyl as the V6, then in '06 they dropped the 4 banger option and raised the price on the CRD option when it was dicovered that people wanted the CRD option bad enough to pay the extra. The actual production cost difference in the engines delivered in the vehicle is probably less then $500 is my guess.

Author:	BioJeep [ Sun Dec 17, 2006 4:46 pm ]
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I wonder what the Touareg TDI resale will be like...

Author:	oldnavy [ Sun Dec 17, 2006 8:22 pm ]
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BioJeep wrote: I wonder what the Touareg TDI resale will be like... When I check last year about this time it was almost like buying a new one. I haven't checked lately, but I have heard mention trying to find a used one is like trying to find a chicken with teeth. After 2 years look how many used CRD's are available, used '05 Mustangs are on every used car lot in the country.

Author:	BLake [ Sun Dec 17, 2006 8:22 pm ]
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BioJeep wrote: I wonder what the Touareg TDI resale will be like... I look at these on ebay and I don't think one has gone for under 50k...ever. The thing is a locomotive wrapped in Porsche Cayenne clothing. Highly sought after despite its teething problems.

Author:	Jimbob [ Sun Dec 17, 2006 9:03 pm ]
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While I admit the Toureg is a formidable vehicle and that thing has to be a rocket (with 7,500 extra lbs along for the ride) I wouldnt be caught dead paying that much for any vehicle. IMHO the manufacturers (DC included) are making a mistake only playing with diesel in select vehicles built for the more affluent market. They are also damaging the image of diesel as a responsible fuel choice by deploying SUVs tuned for performance that get marginally better fuel economy than their gasoline contemporaries. Take the Jetta TDI (what I would like my GF to get) and give us a Toureg TDI (VW) Take the Liberty CRD and give us a GC and Mercedes Diesels (DC) Not to mention not making a Diesel JK available. Do we have to look to Honda to introduce more modest diesel vehicles?

Author:	Jimbob [ Sun Dec 17, 2006 11:16 pm ]
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I definately agree with you on that one. Keep in mind when I talk about tuned for performance I should say "overtuned" with a V10 and twin turbocharger. The GC's 3.0L is a little more appropriate. To clarify when I refer to less affluent I am talking about the person who has the means and desire to buy a reasonably sized car (Jetta), wagon (Legacy) or small to mid-sized SUV (sort of like a KJ) not necessarily a Nissan Versa! I do realize the manufacturers are trying to do some "get your cake and eat it too" by dropping diesel's in larger SUVs.

Author:	no-blue-screen [ Mon Dec 18, 2006 8:26 am ]
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Jimbob wrote: I definately agree with you on that one. Keep in mind when I talk about tuned for performance I should say "overtuned" with a V10 and twin turbocharger. The GC's 3.0L is a little more appropriate. To clarify when I refer to less affluent I am talking about the person who has the means and desire to buy a reasonably sized car (Jetta), wagon (Legacy) or small to mid-sized SUV (sort of like a KJ) not necessarily a Nissan Versa! I do realize the manufacturers are trying to do some "get your cake and eat it too" by dropping diesel's in larger SUVs. I can agree with that. Don't get me wrong, I would NEVER pay 60k for a car...period. I also agree that a V-10 twin turbo is also overkill. I don't imagine the repair bills on that engine would be very cheap Even though my wife and I make decent money, I just refuse to pay that much for a car. My Jetta TDI (which has been totaled) was $30,329 and I almost told em to shove it where the sun doesn't shine. I don't need a car to park itself, slow down for me when the guy in front does, etc. etc. I think cars today are being so over-engineered that they are taking too much control away from the driver.....everyone seems to forget...computers make mistakes too....after all, they are programmed by human beings

Author:	BiodieselJeep.com [ Wed Dec 20, 2006 2:44 pm ]
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They need to stop putting diesels in Luxury cars. Take the price of a new TDI Jetta vs a Ford Focus (larger car). The Jetta is easily twice the Focus (and three times the car). But a $1000 diesel upgrade to a cheap Ford Focus would be an amazing market competitor...45 mpg+ for $16-17k diesel Focus vs $30k hybrid or TDI Jetta? America gets the cars she deserves...we are a land idiots who let lawyers run the show.

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Author:	alljeep [ Mon Dec 18, 2006 9:04 am ]
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no-blue-screen wrote: I can agree with that. Don't get me wrong, I would NEVER pay 60k for a car...period. I also agree that a V-10 twin turbo is also overkill. I don't imagine the repair bills on that engine would be very cheap I wish I could find the AutoWeek magazine that had the write-up on this, but the engine was heavily "detuned" so as not to destroy transmissions in this application. The design specs on the V10 diesel twin turbo are another order of magnitude higher.

Author:	onthehunt [ Tue Dec 19, 2006 2:15 am ]
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Almost all diesel engines that end up in vehicles are severly detuned because they were never designed for vehicles. Most manufactures simply cannot put a transmission behind them that will handle the torque. They don't sell enough to justify a special trans. GM's Allison is close but I'm not a fan of Allison and look at the extra $$ they cost. Don't break one either because you will cry when you see the bill.