LOST JEEPS :: View topic - bleeding fuel system

Well, I got it bled. I had to pump the primer with the bleeder cracked. I got "some" air, not enough imo to cause the studder that I've been dealing with(with a very intermitant hard-start also).

The fuel that came out looks green.....I'll go out on a limb and say "that-ain't-good" I had the wife swing by Wally World while she was out and get some Diesel Kleen and I guess I should replace the filter as well.

Any thing else I should do?

Jon

ok I think the pics will show up now

Well, I got it bled. I had to pump the primer with the bleeder cracked. I got "some" air, not enough imo to cause the studder that I've been dealing with(with a very intermitant hard-start also).

I can only guess that the air in the system was the reason that I was able to pump it with no resistance so many times. Once the air was out, it built up pressure very quickly and became hard to pump.

Maybe there was more air in there than I thought.

Reason why the pump gets hard is because with the key off, the pressure control valve on the rail is shut. with this being the case, once you continue pumping the plunger, you fill the pump and then the rail. Once it's full, fuel has no where to go so the pump gets hard. The plunger gets soft after you start the vehicle due to the fuel system being under suction versus under pressure from a lift pump as in other applications. It doesn't necessarily indicate air in the system if the plunger isn't rock hard.

I wasn't trying to bleed the system with the engine running. If there is a bunch of air in the system, you could pump that plunger till the cows come home, I pumped mine like crazy and there was no resistance at all, untill I got the air out, and the system was filled with uncompressable fuel(instead of air) at which point it became hard to push.

Author:	crackercrd [ Sun Jan 21, 2007 1:40 pm ]
Post subject:	bleeding fuel system
I must be doing something wrong, or have some sort of bad part. I pumped the primer at least 20 times and the slowly opened the bleeder and nothing came out, no air or fuel. I tried about 3 times and figured I would post here to ask for ideas. I will be fooling with it later this evening, I just thought I would try it real quick before I took my kids to the movies, oh well! tia Jon

Author:	Goglio704 [ Sun Jan 21, 2007 3:39 pm ]
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Mine didn't act right the first time I fooled with it either. I kept trying it and eventually bled out a lot of air. On mine it seemed like the pump wasn't actually moving anything the first time I tried it.

Author:	crackercrd [ Sun Jan 21, 2007 6:33 pm ]
Post subject:
Well, I got it bled. I had to pump the primer with the bleeder cracked. I got "some" air, not enough imo to cause the studder that I've been dealing with(with a very intermitant hard-start also). The fuel that came out looks green.....I'll go out on a limb and say "that-ain't-good" I had the wife swing by Wally World while she was out and get some Diesel Kleen and I guess I should replace the filter as well. Any thing else I should do? Jon

Author:	crackercrd [ Sun Jan 21, 2007 6:34 pm ]
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Also I took some pics but I still need to learn how to post them so bear with me.

Author:	oldnavy [ Sun Jan 21, 2007 6:52 pm ]
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crackercrd wrote: Well, I got it bled. I had to pump the primer with the bleeder cracked. I got "some" air, not enough imo to cause the studder that I've been dealing with(with a very intermitant hard-start also). The fuel that came out looks green.....I'll go out on a limb and say "that-ain't-good" I had the wife swing by Wally World while she was out and get some Diesel Kleen and I guess I should replace the filter as well. Any thing else I should do? Jon Color is not an indacation of quality, but most diesel is green. I use a 50 cetane + ULSD fuel that is green and the CRD needless to say loves the stuff.

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Author:	crackercrd [ Sun Jan 21, 2007 7:12 pm ]
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I was thinking it could have algae in it, I got scared because I try to run some bio in each tank and I read that algae will go nuts with bioD in there ( I have not had any bioD for a month and was about to put some in untill I saw green fuel!) what does algae look like?, is it chunky, does it form at the top or bottom, or does it tint the whole sample? I hope my fuel is ok!.....I just filled up!!!!

Author:	crackercrd [ Sun Jan 21, 2007 7:23 pm ]
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this is what the fuel looks like http://memimage.cardomain.net/member_im ... 1299_2.jpg http://memimage.cardomain.net/member_im ... 1299_3.jpg is this normal?

Author:	crackercrd [ Sun Jan 21, 2007 7:29 pm ]
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ok I think the pics will show up now

Author:	BlackLibertyCRD [ Sun Jan 21, 2007 8:05 pm ]
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crackercrd wrote: ok I think the pics will show up now Must be normal, same as I have from Hess. I think lots of us have air problem.

Author:	crackercrd [ Sun Jan 21, 2007 8:24 pm ]
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last 5 tanks (at least) from the same Hess

Author:	oldnavy [ Sun Jan 21, 2007 9:37 pm ]
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Up untill now #2 diesel always had pariffin in the mix, and this is what grows the "bugs" in the fuel. Now with ULSD you have almost no periffin due to the process of making the fuel ULS, and this is why everyone was worried about lubrication of pumps and injectors. The additives that the refinery or supplier adds to the fuel may alter the color some what or the fuel may be dyed for identafication. Bio-diesel on the other hand is an excellent lube and is high in cetane but has no sulfur, it does have a very bad habit of bacteria growth however. Both the old LSD that most here are using and Bio-Diesel need to have a biocide of some sort added to the fuel, and is usually done by the supplier not the refinery. Problem is lot of times these are done improperly or not at all, and joe smuck has an bio bloom. From what I have been told the bio-diesel (B100) ( 1/4 to 1/2%) added to ULSD is becoming a common lube additive to ULSD, but that is just kind of hear say from a bio retailer. That same source says that with the ULSD beingh basicaly #1 diesel w/o sulfur will greatly reduce cold weather jelling and the need of much of the cold weather additives except in the very coldest of parts of the country.

Author:	BLake [ Sun Jan 21, 2007 10:18 pm ]
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Picture of bad fuel here: http://www.lostjeeps.com/forum/phpBB3/vie ... highlight= Green tint is fine. Cloudy with a green tint is bad. Jet-A has almost no paraffin in it and can get algae, Prist is added to prevent freezing and algae blooms. I remember reading somewhere that the algae grows in the layer between water and fuel. Keep the water out and the algae can't grow.

Author:	RFCRD [ Sun Jan 21, 2007 11:02 pm ]
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crackercrd wrote: Well, I got it bled. I had to pump the primer with the bleeder cracked. I got "some" air, not enough imo to cause the studder that I've been dealing with(with a very intermitant hard-start also). While you are messing with this system, start looking for places where you could be sucking air. The primer pump is now your friend. Pump it several times to build some excess head pressure (bleeder closed) and look for leaks around the filter head. Gut hunch with that much air in the system that you will find fuel leaking out of the electrical connections for the fuel heater.

Author:	no-blue-screen [ Sun Jan 21, 2007 11:38 pm ]
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The power-blend premium ULSD that I get from my local BP station is also green. So don't worry about color. On priming, I don't know how you were able to pump it 20 times with the bleeder valve closed. Mine won't even pump any more than 4 or 5 times, then I open the bleeder valve, close the bleeder valve, pump again, etc. etc. until I get a steady stream of Diesel coming from my bleeder valve.

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Author:	crackercrd [ Mon Jan 22, 2007 4:52 am ]
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I can only guess that the air in the system was the reason that I was able to pump it with no resistance so many times. Once the air was out, it built up pressure very quickly and became hard to pump. Maybe there was more air in there than I thought.

Author:	RFCRD [ Mon Jan 22, 2007 6:07 am ]
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crackercrd wrote: I can only guess that the air in the system was the reason that I was able to pump it with no resistance so many times. Once the air was out, it built up pressure very quickly and became hard to pump. Maybe there was more air in there than I thought. Exactly. You need to start looking for the source as I doubt your dealer will find it.

Author:	MrMopar64 [ Mon Jan 22, 2007 12:25 pm ]
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Reason why the pump gets hard is because with the key off, the pressure control valve on the rail is shut. with this being the case, once you continue pumping the plunger, you fill the pump and then the rail. Once it's full, fuel has no where to go so the pump gets hard. The plunger gets soft after you start the vehicle due to the fuel system being under suction versus under pressure from a lift pump as in other applications. It doesn't necessarily indicate air in the system if the plunger isn't rock hard.

Author:	BioJeep [ Mon Jan 22, 2007 3:55 pm ]
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Quote: Reason why the pump gets hard is because with the key off, the pressure control valve on the rail is shut. with this being the case, once you continue pumping the plunger, you fill the pump and then the rail. Once it's full, fuel has no where to go so the pump gets hard. Hmm...so I wonder if we can surmise what is normal by taking a poll. After plenty of driving and then sitting for a couple days (which is probably irrelevant), mine begins feeling resistance at the end of pump #4 and is fully resistant by pump #5.

Author:	crackercrd [ Tue Jan 23, 2007 10:36 am ]
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MrMopar64 wrote: Reason why the pump gets hard is because with the key off, the pressure control valve on the rail is shut. with this being the case, once you continue pumping the plunger, you fill the pump and then the rail. Once it's full, fuel has no where to go so the pump gets hard. The plunger gets soft after you start the vehicle due to the fuel system being under suction versus under pressure from a lift pump as in other applications. It doesn't necessarily indicate air in the system if the plunger isn't rock hard. I wasn't trying to bleed the system with the engine running. If there is a bunch of air in the system, you could pump that plunger till the cows come home, I pumped mine like crazy and there was no resistance at all, untill I got the air out, and the system was filled with uncompressable fuel(instead of air) at which point it became hard to push.

Author:	BioJeep [ Fri Jan 26, 2007 6:17 pm ]
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Quote: I wasn't trying to bleed the system with the engine running. If there is a bunch of air in the system, you could pump that plunger till the cows come home, I pumped mine like crazy and there was no resistance at all, untill I got the air out, and the system was filled with uncompressable fuel(instead of air) at which point it became hard to push. I think Mr Mopar was simply explaining the functioning to suggest that some number of easy pumps is normal before indicating air in the system, which at least I had previously misunderstood. However, it does sound like you've definitely got air in you case. Mine behaved similarly before getting it fixed.