offroadsubaru wrote:
The only thing that is "below grade" is the torque converter. The 2.8 liter VM Motori engine is a great motor with a proven service record in Europe, and the CRD in the family has had 10k miles and zero issues. There are a few problematic CRDs out there, I will admit, but most haven't had the kind of teething troubles that those few have had.
In short -- if you find a good CRD with a service history that doesn't include a lot of issues -- buy it!
I like my CRD, and the engine rocks. It is an interesting vehicle and you should consider it something that may take time and effort to keep in good order. It is more like a Range Rover in that it will require lots of $ and time to keep it running right. Think plane, boat or other motorized hobby. I can't see this as something totally trouble or worry free until you replace the troublesome sub-par parts it comes with.
Here are some of the sub-par materials you can look forward to replacing or constantly tinkering with:
1. Torque Converter: made of cheap materials and not speced for a diesel.
2. Transmission pump: The pump seal had leak issues, so it was redesigned and other changes made. This is not a recall item, you may get the new pump with the F37 customer satisfaction service-- depending on if the dealer feels like it. Otherwise, you must buy it once warranty is over.
3. EGR Valve: Failures quite common as the valve was not designed with LSD in mind. This has been redesigned, but not recalled. If you have the old one and you get past warranty-- you get to buy the new redesign when the old one finally goes out. The new fuel is helping these last longer, so it should not be a reoccuring issue. You can also take it apart and clean it and put it back together to help prevent it from sooting up and binding... or you can not use it. I am not advocating law-bending of course, but it is a theoretical option.
4. Fuel System leaks: It is highly likely to suck air into the line. Some fuel line parts have been redesigned, but also not recalled as of yet. The factory fuel filter unit leaks and is subject to heat warp problems as it is made of cheap plastic. The assembly reminds me of the innards of a cheap coffee maker you get at wall-mart. People on this forum are working on solving the fuel filter assembly leak-- either my beefing it up or replacing it entirely. Once your fuel system starts leaking you may experience "bucking", a shivering hesitation, and/or a loss of power. You will have to burp the air out to get it to stop. I am doing mine on almost a daily basis (well, I drive 100 miles a day-- so maybe not quite that often). I now carry a 11mm wrench and some bleeder line in the glove box for just this purpose. Worse case, it starts leaking through the fuel heater switch, the switch comes on and burns your CRD to the ground. Of course, that may be the best case if your fully insured and sick of it.
4. EGR Flow control valve: first parts consisted of plastic gearing that jammed, the newer parts are better made. If the valve has not been replaced and makes it past warranty-- you get to buy the new valve, this is not a recalled part either.
5. D30a front diff: Subject to blowing if you wheel it. May replace under warranty if they feel like being real nice to you. This is common for all Liberty's. The diff case will stress fracture if repeatedly shock loaded (spin the wheels freely and then they suddenly grip). There is a "collar" to help keep the case together in the event of this happening, but it does not fit the CRD due to clearance issues.
6. F37 flash to fix Torque Converter-- deprograms engine torque and horsepower to make the torque converter last. There is no way for your dealer to "undo" it once done. It is a mandatory part of F37 and they will likely do the flash if you ever take your CRD in for any service related to the computer system. Better to get it done to any vehicle you buy so you are making your performance judgment on what the vehicle will actually handle like after DC gets their hands on its computer.
7. Ball Joints: So far, two recalls on Liberty ball joints. Unknown how much longer you can expect the new ball joints to last . Better factor in the cost of new ones every 30-50 thousand miles or so. This problem is common to all Liberties, gas or diesel.
8. CCV blows oil into the CAC. You can open vent it (illegal) or buy a provent gizmo to keep the oil out of your intake. Or live with the oil and whatever it does to your engine.
9. CAC line: Redesigned. The old one is orange on the inside. It becomes soft when it gets all the oil blown from the CCV in it. The new one is black on the inside and holds up better when oil saturated. If you don't get this replaced under warranty, you get to buy it too-- not a recall.
9. Goodyear SRA's: The stock tires are crap. They ride horrible. They wear fast and the traction is subpar. Most any stock tire is junk, though.
10. Air sensor on manifold clogs with EGR soot and oil passed in from the CCV: You get to clean this every oil change or your gas mileage and responsiveness goes down.
11. Air intake: It is too small and sucks direct from the front of the vehicle. It will take in water and saturate the filter causing oil to blow by the turbo seals in rainy conditions. Not everyone has this problem, but some have. A common solution is to buy an air box for a gasser and put it on (which has a snorkel to pull air higher and from the side and does not saturate the filter).
12. Blower motor (heater/ac fan): Just got recalled. May cause a vehicle fire.
13. Muffler. It is the same muffler they put on the gasser and is necked down and restricts flow. If yours has the stock muffler, you will want to replace it too.
14. Computer bridge: The ECM, PCM and TCM data bus does not meet industry specifications. Two or more of the computers think they are the "bus" master. This trickery is done by time-slicing the access to the bus between the two different computers. The software hack makes them both think they are the bus master because only they can see the bus at any given time. Because of this kludge, ODBII scanners won't work properly-- they will loose half the data feed when one of the computers is time-sliced (put to sleep) on the bus. A previous flash, F-31 I think, caused this problem to rear its head is such as way as to make this fail federal emissions requirements because the OBDII port would not work at all with federal emissions equipment.
15. Door seals: All door seals on liberties are prone to wind leaks. Make sure you check this if this will bother you or a significant other.
I think this is most of it. Do realize that if you need anything more than an oil filter for a CRD specific part-- you can expect to wait a week or more. Every part on this thing is either back-ordered or comes from another country. If you drive this daily and don't have a backup-- then plan on getting a rental car or the "max care" extended warranty which will get you a rental car. If you don't do the max care-- it is up to the dealer if you get a rental in many cases. If this thing throws a CEL in the middle of nowhere and dies-- you can expect the dealer to have it for awhile while they wait for parts. Consider this if you are going to travel across country with it. Also consider that many dealers don't want anything to do with it.
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. My dad got a 24' Caravelle Interceptor and although its very heavy I think its still able to pull it, braking is a different story.
...but a good used Liberty CRD seems to be a better buy even with the few known glitches.
I am looking for a 12 valve, short wheelbase, extra cab to turn into a middle aged guy's hot rod of sorts.
What is the deal these days, can't anyone make a decent diesel? I am not all that thrilled with my 96 Cummins either as it is in the dealership getting the Vacuum pump rebuilt for the 4th time in 6 months! The best diesels I have had were the 2 first gen Cummins (92 & 93) They were very trouble free and simple. However they do not come in a 4 door version. That is a very extensive list and I thank you for your time. This almost makes me want to go back to a gasser. You would think after spending $20,000+ on a vehicle you could drive it trouble free for a couple of years with only doing routine maintenance. My wife has 120,000 on a 1999 Chev Tracker and all I have done is oil and air filter changes,tires, front bakes a O2 sensor and spark plugs, that's it! and this is a throw away vehicle.
