LOST JEEPS :: View topic - McLiberty...SVO?

I was doing a search on a vegetable oil conversion kit, and this frybrid place kinda leaped out at me so I'd thought I'd share. It looks like a pretty complete system but I wouldn’t want it inside my jeep like that, I was thinking maybe the space opposite the muffler would be good for at least a 10-15 gal tank but you would also have to come up with a skid for the tank also and a way to fill it up, and at $1595 by my math it would pay for itself in 15k miles or so if you could find a steady source of free oil. So have any LOST members done a conversion? is it pretty easy to hook in? I also read on here about an upgraded fuel filter system, seems like that would be a good idea as well.

http://www.frybrid.com/liberty.htm

Well if it was a McLiberty, it would be WVO not SVO

I have a friend running WVO on his 96 Passat. I have heard that the common rail system doesn't lend itself well to VO and that you are better off converting it to BioD.
-c

ccattie wrote:

Well if it was a McLiberty, it would be WVO not SVO

I have a friend running WVO on his 96 Passat. I have heard that the common rail system doesn't lend itself well to VO and that you are better off converting it to BioD.
-c

I don't want to argue semantics. There is no "converting" to use bio-d. The oil itself has been converted to act more like #2 diesel and can be added to the main tank and run the engine as if it is on #2.

I have heard that the VW TDi's are finicky using wvo. What the issues are I don't know.

The general cause of problems using wvo come from starving the injector pump for fuel by trying to pump cold wvo through the system.

A 35lb. cubie of new soy oil [approx. 4.6 gallons] costs between $13-$16 at a place like Sam's club, B.J.'s or Costco. That's like $3/gallon! So that would be SVO. WVO is better because the cost is less and it is more environmentally friendly.

Before you do this, I suggest you look at this thread:

http://www.lostjeeps.com/forum/phpBB3/vie ... hp?t=19526

I would not risk running WVO, filtered or not, in my CRD.

I've been thinking of trying to find some local folks interested in brewing up some biodiesel. If a group of us split the cost, and closely monitor the quality, then what would the downside be to running homebrewed biodiesel? I gotta say, paying nearly $3 a gallon for diesel is silly when you can make your own for a fraction of that.

Author:	Universeman [ Fri Mar 23, 2007 4:58 pm ]
Post subject:	McLiberty...SVO?
I was doing a search on a vegetable oil conversion kit, and this frybrid place kinda leaped out at me so I'd thought I'd share. It looks like a pretty complete system but I wouldn’t want it inside my jeep like that, I was thinking maybe the space opposite the muffler would be good for at least a 10-15 gal tank but you would also have to come up with a skid for the tank also and a way to fill it up, and at $1595 by my math it would pay for itself in 15k miles or so if you could find a steady source of free oil. So have any LOST members done a conversion? is it pretty easy to hook in? I also read on here about an upgraded fuel filter system, seems like that would be a good idea as well. http://www.frybrid.com/liberty.htm

Author:	Pablo [ Fri Mar 23, 2007 5:07 pm ]
Post subject:
McLiberty... hahaha. That is pretty good. That system looks awesome. I would imagine few are going to do this until the warranty is over. I might go to 100% bio once the warranty is over. I don't think I will go veg oil as I don't want the hassle of an extra tank in my cargo area or under the vehicle. Nor do I want the hassle of trying to filter and treat the oil before using it in a 23,000 psi injector system.

Author:	BiodieselJeep.com [ Sat Mar 24, 2007 11:18 am ]
Post subject:
You know I've been thinking about this with many others. But I haven't personally heard or seen anything from anyone who has tried it on a Libby. Seen pics from several sites selling the stuff, but never heard from someone. Ad the LOST site gets most people in. How about asking them for references of actual Libby CRD owners who are running veg oil? Proof is in the pudding, and the TDI guys have tons to say pro and con from experience....so I'd definitely want to hear from the experienced. that was for you Hendrix fans...

Author:	offroadsubaru [ Sat Mar 24, 2007 2:22 pm ]
Post subject:
Frybrid is pretty local to me. Their conversions seem pretty popular among the 1970s & 1980s Mercedes veggie oil crowd. But on that nice dark red Liberty? The owner has cojones -- bye bye warranty!

Author:	prairiedog [ Sat Mar 24, 2007 2:29 pm ]
Post subject:
Theres a local guy i heard of that is burning waste vegetable oil in his brand new Dodge Sprinter van..Heard he pumps it directly from restraunt waste bins through a portable filtering device and into the van's tank...kinda slick. I bought this Liberty to burn home brewed biodesel but this maybe less of a hassle...but the conversion is really expensive in my opinion..i live in northern illinois..so the conversion is a requirement..I understand if you live in the south that you may not need the heated fuel tank at all.

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Author:	ccattie [ Wed Mar 28, 2007 9:09 am ]
Post subject:
Well if it was a McLiberty, it would be WVO not SVO I have a friend running WVO on his 96 Passat. I have heard that the common rail system doesn't lend itself well to VO and that you are better off converting it to BioD. -c

Author:	DadsDiesel [ Thu Mar 29, 2007 1:40 am ]
Post subject:	Re: McLiberty...SVO?
Universeman wrote: I was doing a search on a vegetable oil conversion kit, and this frybrid place kinda leaped out at me so I'd thought I'd share. It looks like a pretty complete system but I wouldn’t want it inside my jeep like that, I was thinking maybe the space opposite the muffler would be good for at least a 10-15 gal tank but you would also have to come up with a skid for the tank also and a way to fill it up, and at $1595 by my math it would pay for itself in 15k miles or so if you could find a steady source of free oil. So have any LOST members done a conversion? is it pretty easy to hook in? I also read on here about an upgraded fuel filter system, seems like that would be a good idea as well. http://www.frybrid.com/liberty.htm I just put my Libby up on ramps yesterday. Do you really think you could get a 10-15 gallon tank opposite the muffler? I calculated a 4X12X24 inch tank that would yield about a 5 gallon tank. Then you have to think about a filler neck of some kind. If you have measured more closely maybe I should look again? I have been tossing around the idea of swapping the stock fuel tank for two smaller tanks. One for #2 diesel and one for wvo. I will convert the Libby. That's why I bought the dang thing. Bio-D is OK to brew and isn't too difficult, but, it does cost more per gallon than dry, filtered wvo. You can do one of two things, modify the oil [bio-d] or modify the fuel delivery [two tank wvo]. Under no circumstances would I run a single tank wvo system on the CRD. Some have gotten away with a single tank, in very warm climates in old bullet proof 5 cyl. mechanical IP Benzes... I have been following the Frybrid forum for over a year now and Chris Goodwin [the owner of Frybrid] will not sell a conversion on a vehicle he hasn't done. As far as I know, he has only done one for a guy in Montana who bought the Libby, sent it to Chris in Washington for him to play with and convert. Those are the pictures of the Libby in the link. If you are looking to convert to using a bio-fuel, either wvo or bio-d and are expecting a ROI to justify the cost of conversion, and to provide "cheap fuel" I would recommend that you not do it. While many have run these fuels successfully, it is still somewhat experimental and you could loose an injector pump, coke the injectors or cylinders or worse. Like the good 'ol boy says down home, " 'ya-gotta-wanna-do-it, real bad." I am at a place in my life where I don't have to turn a wrench unless I want to. The conversion takes an average to above average shade tree mechanic skills. The mechanics here would argue that it takes less skill. If you can do your own brakes - successfully, you can do the conversion. Even if you have a mechanic install the kit, I would be close at hand. there are always bugs to work out. Dad .

Author:	DadsDiesel [ Thu Mar 29, 2007 1:54 am ]
Post subject:
ccattie wrote: Well if it was a McLiberty, it would be WVO not SVO I have a friend running WVO on his 96 Passat. I have heard that the common rail system doesn't lend itself well to VO and that you are better off converting it to BioD. -c I don't want to argue semantics. There is no "converting" to use bio-d. The oil itself has been converted to act more like #2 diesel and can be added to the main tank and run the engine as if it is on #2. I have heard that the VW TDi's are finicky using wvo. What the issues are I don't know. The general cause of problems using wvo come from starving the injector pump for fuel by trying to pump cold wvo through the system. A 35lb. cubie of new soy oil [approx. 4.6 gallons] costs between $13-$16 at a place like Sam's club, B.J.'s or Costco. That's like $3/gallon! So that would be SVO. WVO is better because the cost is less and it is more environmentally friendly.

Author:	ccattie [ Tue Apr 17, 2007 1:15 pm ]
Post subject:
That is exactly what I said - you're better off converting the VO to BioD. -c DadsDiesel wrote: ccattie wrote: Well if it was a McLiberty, it would be WVO not SVO I have a friend running WVO on his 96 Passat. I have heard that the common rail system doesn't lend itself well to VO and that you are better off converting it to BioD. -c I don't want to argue semantics. There is no "converting" to use bio-d. The oil itself has been converted to act more like #2 diesel and can be added to the main tank and run the engine as if it is on #2. I have heard that the VW TDi's are finicky using wvo. What the issues are I don't know. The general cause of problems using wvo come from starving the injector pump for fuel by trying to pump cold wvo through the system. A 35lb. cubie of new soy oil [approx. 4.6 gallons] costs between $13-$16 at a place like Sam's club, B.J.'s or Costco. That's like $3/gallon! So that would be SVO. WVO is better because the cost is less and it is more environmentally friendly.

Author:	greiswig [ Tue Apr 17, 2007 2:37 pm ]
Post subject:
Before you do this, I suggest you look at this thread: http://www.lostjeeps.com/forum/phpBB3/vie ... hp?t=19526 I would not risk running WVO, filtered or not, in my CRD.

Author:	skywarn [ Thu Apr 19, 2007 10:26 am ]
Post subject:
I am now pushing close to 50k on my libby and been running home made Bio-D (B-100) for over a year now. in the last 30k miles she has only seen less than 50 gal of petro (due to road trips) so far i have had no problems. However, just like whats stated above, IF something does happen i know what i might be in for, and i did it to myself. but in the mean time, im not spending $400 a month on fuel either. and $200 of that is going in the 'oops" can! WVO i feel is a good opt in trucks or large SUV's. But i bought a Jeep to get L.O.S.T. off rode, and the last thing i want to worry about is another fuel tank to spring a leak or take up room in the back where my camping gear should be. Boi-D is the way to go, or look into some other types of alt fuel. the two tank works as well but i have yet to hear from anybody running SVO/WSVO in the libby. Im always on the look out for one.

Author:	UFO [ Thu Apr 19, 2007 12:10 pm ]
Post subject:
greiswig wrote: Before you do this, I suggest you look at this thread: http://www.lostjeeps.com/forum/phpBB3/vie ... hp?t=19526 I would not risk running WVO, filtered or not, in my CRD. Especially this kit frrom "Golden Fuel" formerly known as Greasel. They are notorious for not adequately heating the oil, and that is absolutely critical in a common rail injection/direct injection engine. In the thread quoted above, I posted the link to the eBay ad for the owner of Golden Fuel selling his personal Jeep CRD. He has already replaced the engine after learning the hard way about WVO in a newer type diesel, but apparently not learning the right lessons, because it still has the WVO kit in it, and he's put 1500 more miles on it using WVO. Not the best representative of the biofuel movement, IMHO.

Author:	BiodieselJeep.com [ Thu Apr 19, 2007 4:15 pm ]
Post subject:
There is the European company Elsbett, which has over 30 years of SVO engine experience. They even built engines that just run on SVO (Straight Veg Oil, not Waste). They have a hugely expensive kit for the TDI's, but it is one tank! They even modify the injectors. There is a guy in my town with one in his 98 TDI and he's running waste VO in it for over 80k miles. Unfortuneately, the Liberty version is a two tank. Still, think about elsbett.com before finalizing. Or buy a real old diesel passenger car and have fun with it. Get some experience on a mercedes, then you won't cry if you kill it.

Author:	chadhargis [ Thu Apr 19, 2007 4:43 pm ]
Post subject:
I've been thinking of trying to find some local folks interested in brewing up some biodiesel. If a group of us split the cost, and closely monitor the quality, then what would the downside be to running homebrewed biodiesel? I gotta say, paying nearly $3 a gallon for diesel is silly when you can make your own for a fraction of that.

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Author:	greiswig [ Thu Apr 19, 2007 5:17 pm ]
Post subject:
chadhargis wrote: I've been thinking of trying to find some local folks interested in brewing up some biodiesel. If a group of us split the cost, and closely monitor the quality, then what would the downside be to running homebrewed biodiesel? I gotta say, paying nearly $3 a gallon for diesel is silly when you can make your own for a fraction of that. Read what I wrote in the link I provided above for the downsides that I'm aware of. Splitting cost won't help you out much after the initial investment of equipment, as the cost of materials and so forth doesn't change with scale. You might check to see if there is already a coop in your area that you could join.

Author:	UFO [ Thu Apr 19, 2007 5:33 pm ]
Post subject:
I already home-brew biodiesel for my Mercedes at less than $1.00 per gallon. I bought a used water heater for $50, and have invested an additional $300 in plumbing, pumps and filters. The initial investment was paid off in 6 months. MORE than cost effective, and I intend to evalute my current fuel quality, make adjustments if necessary, and run B100 in a CRD, when I get one.