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Winch Bumper Progress
http://www.lostjeeps.com/forum/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=5&t=20215		 Page 1 of 2
Author:  CRDburnouts [ Sat Apr 28, 2007 9:36 pm ]
Post subject:  Winch Bumper Progress
There are basically three options for after-market winch bumpers and only two of them actually have a winch plate.; those two are way too over-priced for what you get. I designed this bumper to be functional and stylish as well as stouter than anything I have seen. I will be starting production of these bumpers in the next several weeks, the only thing not comleted yet is the marker mounts and gap covers. I will tentatively be selling these at the price of $850-$900

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The bumper is mostly completed and still needs sanding and painting, like I said, I will be filling in the open space where the marker light goes and creating an extention of the fender to make it look more factory.
Author:  BiodieselJeep.com [ Sun Apr 29, 2007 10:01 am ]
Post subject: 
Nice look!

Hey, before you paint, how about chrome?! :D
Author:  Cowcatcher [ Sun Apr 29, 2007 11:19 am ]
Post subject: 
Nice. Don't see a hugh price difference from the rest of the pack though.
Author:  CRDburnouts [ Sun Apr 29, 2007 2:17 pm ]
Post subject: 
I actually think I can produce these at first to be sold for around $750. Maybe cheaper in the future... The main difference between mine and ARB/TrailReady is price and strength, I am confident that this bumper will bend the frame before it bends the bumper. That being said the KJ frames are super cheesey 18 guage or something and there are reinforcment options. I have this bumper tied into the tow hook points and also to the side frame rail where a hitch would bolt up, 1/4" on all mounts. I am giving this bumper a 180lb deer rating @60mph :lol:

More to come, suggestions appreciated...
Author:  DarbyWalters [ Sun Apr 29, 2007 5:31 pm ]
Post subject: 
Just be careful making claims that you can't back up...not good business. Just sell yours on it's own merits :idea:
Author:  CRDburnouts [ Sun Apr 29, 2007 6:28 pm ]
Post subject: 
I am not making claims that I can't back up, I had an experience with an XJ that I built a bumper for out of 3/16" and 1/4". I was on a hunting trip in Kansas and hit a 180lb white tail going 50-60mph and it sent the thing flying off, we pulled over the deer got sent 60' in the air and landed in the ditch. The bumper did not move more than about an 1/8". The grill took some good damage sending the radiator into the fan.

Same situation with an ARB would yield different results. Warn builds all of their bumpers out of 3/16" or 1/4" and they have some of the beefiest and heavy-duty bumper on the market. Honestly I dont know what the rest of the manufacturers use but i think most are 10 or 12 guage on all the non structural parts, mine is all 3/16 or 1/4 on all possible points of impact, not sure if ARB can say the same. Anybody know the stats of other bumpers as far as thickness and weight?
Author:  DarbyWalters [ Sun Apr 29, 2007 7:38 pm ]
Post subject: 
OK, I will tell you that the TrailReady is made with the same guage materials that you are using. The Shackle mounts are beefier and go thru the bumper and are welded to both the front side, front inside and back inside. The winch mount is more recessed than your design so the overhang is much less...basically butts right up against the front grill with just a little space. The angles that TrailReady builds into the bumper makes it stonger at the points where they meet. Thier rear bumper is also a super strong unit...I know from experience.

As for "crash test" worthiness, you can't really make any claims without direct tests under controlled circumstances. Again, I will just say let your bumper speak for itself without making unfounded claims about other bumpers on the market. We appreciate all the makers of aftermarket items on this forum...yours included.
Author:  Fouros [ Sun Apr 29, 2007 7:48 pm ]
Post subject: 
mate have you looked at an ARB bar they are designed to withstand Roo strikes and you can total a vehical hitting a Kangaroo

also i would have a look at your aproach angles on that thing, its looks strong but it looks like a cover for the stock bumper to me

the ARB, TJM, Rock Lizard and Trail Ready bars INCREASE our approach angles ( A VERY GOOD THING )

having a winch is great but if you cant use it besause its buried in the mud, rock whats the point,
Author:  CRDburnouts [ Sun Apr 29, 2007 9:08 pm ]
Post subject: 
[quote="DarbyWalters"]OK, I will tell you that the TrailReady is made with the same guage materials that you are using. The Shackle mounts are beefier and go thru the bumper and are welded to both the front side, front inside and back inside. The winch mount is more recessed than your design so the overhang is much less...basically butts right up against the front grill with just a little space. The angles that TrailReady builds into the bumper makes it stonger at the points where they meet. Thier rear bumper is also a super strong unit...I know from experience.

quote]

My d-ring mounts are welded on both sides of the tube. Trail ready is $1400-$1800 and a waste of money in my opinion. As far as winch overhang i beleive it is about the same as TJM and obviously worse than TR but I dont want my winch in front of my grill. TR uses a 3/16" subframe, not 1/4" for the winch or mounts. They use 1/8 which is strong but not strong enough, I dont know why but 3/16" is just beefy. My bumper is strong but I will not be testing its "crash rating" on my jeep.

As to fouros' comments, ARB will bend on a rock where as mine wont, its because they also use thinner outer steel for their styling. I can accomplish a simmilar look while maintaining rock crushing capabilities. Your comment about approach angles only applies to Trail Ready and Rock Lizard's with the multi mount off, its about the same as mine with a multi-mount on. The approach angles are almost the same and I will look into improving on the next bumper but I really like having my winch under my grill line. Here's one for ya...

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Author:  DarbyWalters [ Sun Apr 29, 2007 10:44 pm ]
Post subject: 
I had both the front and rear TrailReady bumpers custom powedercoated and shipped for a grand total of $2150.00. The location of the Winch was excellent and the approach angle was superb. The Shackle mounts were oversized and the push bar was handy. As for the strength of yours, I am sure it is indestructible...but I would rather bend my bumper than damage the Uniframe. I also don't want to carry more weight than needed so I don't strap a railroad tie to the front of my KJ. The point is you are building a bumper yourself and that is to be applauded. You also have the advantage of being able to modify it down the road ... or ... redesign a new one after you test out this prototype. That being said, bad mouthing other products out there that have proven thier worth will not be tolerated. We want more than one choice when it comes to modding our KJs and welcome all quality products from any source.

Keep this post constructive, pun intended. Remember you asked for comments and suggestions from others and that is what you are getting. I am sure everyone would want to see this bumper in its final configuration.

Two questions, 1) Why wouldn't you want the winch to sit up higher and out of the way? I can tell you that the winch never caused my 3.7L to overheat even in 100+ temps in San Antonio, Texas. 2 ) What is the estimate of the weight of your bumper?
Author:  CRDburnouts [ Sun Apr 29, 2007 10:56 pm ]
Post subject: 
I'm not bad mouthing any companies I just would never spend $1400 on a front bumper no matter how cool it looks. My opinion has valid reasoning. I like having the entire grill open like stock, ARB and Trail Ready cover the factory holes on the grill which restricts fresh air into the engine compartment.

Having your winch in front of the grill also restricts airflow but as you noted not enough to cause over-heating issues. My main concern would be head in impact with a tree/rock/deer and sending my winch through my grill into my radiator and on into my engine. If I hit something straight on my winch would either not move or slam into the bumper itself.

Weight is not determined but I will weigh tomorrow after i get some light tabs. I would guess around 90lbs or so.
Author:  JJsTJ [ Mon Apr 30, 2007 7:56 am ]
Post subject: 
I think it would look better if it was a narrower piece of tube, perhaps 2x6. It just looks too thick from top to bottom and using 2x6 and pushing the winch up a couple inches to keep it from hanging too low would look better IMHO. I like the basic design and it certainly will be stout enough. I am sure the final outcome will be cool.
Here is a pic of my All J bumpers:
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That one is 2x4 construction and I have thought about making a new version w/ 2x6 to bring the steel down to cover the open section in the front and building the winch into the face of the bumper but up higher only blocking the lower half of the grille area.

Good luck w/ it, looking forward to seeing the finished product.
Author:  DarbyWalters [ Mon Apr 30, 2007 8:25 am ]
Post subject: 
CRDburnouts wrote:
I'm not bad mouthing any companies I just would never spend $1400 on a front bumper no matter how cool it looks. My opinion has valid reasoning. I like having the entire grill open like stock, ARB and Trail Ready cover the factory holes on the grill which restricts fresh air into the engine compartment.


The other bumpers DO NOT cover the grill openings. Only when a winch is added does anything sit in front of the grill openings. Infact both the ARB and TrailReady build vent openings on the underside of thier bumpers to get air in under the bumper.

I have more to say but it seems like you are stuck on being right so I will hold off for now. :?
Author:  riptricket [ Mon Apr 30, 2007 11:57 am ]
Post subject: 
i wish that there would be some bumper made for the RENEGADE models!!!
Darby got any pics of your TR bumpers?
Author:  DarbyWalters [ Mon Apr 30, 2007 12:54 pm ]
Post subject: 
http://suvworld.tenmagazines.com/ew/myg ... sp?id=3514

This site has a few
Author:  CRDburnouts [ Mon Apr 30, 2007 4:10 pm ]
Post subject: 
DarbyWalters wrote:
CRDburnouts wrote:
I'm not bad mouthing any companies I just would never spend $1400 on a front bumper no matter how cool it looks. My opinion has valid reasoning. I like having the entire grill open like stock, ARB and Trail Ready cover the factory holes on the grill which restricts fresh air into the engine compartment.


The other bumpers DO NOT cover the grill openings. Only when a winch is added does anything sit in front of the grill openings. Infact both the ARB and TrailReady build vent openings on the underside of thier bumpers to get air in under the bumper.

I have more to say but it seems like you are stuck on being right so I will hold off for now. :?


I was refering to the two holes under the headlights for fog lights or in my case fresh air. Dont hold back, I can take it. I'm sure you invested after careful consideration and I'm not saying ANY of the other KJ bumpers have flaws I just think they are pricey for the strength but thats just me. I have the challenge of taking what I have and making it better, I appreciate your insight and will consider how to gain more aproach clearance.

I think I might make one out of 2x6 but I like the coverage of the 2x8. I decided that I am going to move the winch plate up a few inches on the next one or just angle the plate up more with the feet-foward design. I'm putting the winch on today as well as light tabs.
Author:  CRDburnouts [ Tue May 01, 2007 7:32 pm ]
Post subject: 
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Author:  oz_crd [ Wed May 02, 2007 7:56 am ]
Post subject: 
Do you have any idea if the design of your bumper will affect the function of the airbags? At least ARB can say they have tested that. Also, how do you plan to fill in the space between the bumper and fender flares. The wires and junk visible in the photos in that space kinda detracts from the simple lines of the bumper.
Author:  DarbyWalters [ Wed May 02, 2007 8:38 am ]
Post subject: 
Earlier he said he had plans to weld on a piece that will fill out that area. As for airbags, I believe that they would on some kind of G-Force sensor so bumpers whould not affect the deployment.

I will say building one for personal use is a job that should be applauded. Building more than one for production is another matter all together.
Author:  CRDburnouts [ Wed May 02, 2007 11:04 am ]
Post subject: 
It is indeed, I will be doing a lot of fine tuning in the next few weeks but I am going to build about 10 in the next couple months, economies of scale my friend. As for weight, my niche will be people who are willing to sacrifice on weight for strength.

I might have to bite the bullet and invest in a mold to make plastic covers for the gap, I cut my plastic bumper up so I can start fitting it. More to come
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