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| Author: | techTim [ Thu May 24, 2007 1:23 pm ] |
| Post subject: | fuel head fix |
Dgeist posted this link and I can't find it now, what are the thoughts out there on the series 445 with the heater, wif sensor, etc as a replacement? http://www.maesco.com/products/racor/r_ ... oduct.html |
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| Author: | Stan Wright [ Thu May 24, 2007 2:16 pm ] |
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It's under the 'Engine Code Problem' thread. What kind of gph flow rate would we need? |
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| Author: | techTim [ Thu May 24, 2007 5:40 pm ] |
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click on the picture of the unit for specs, the small one (445) is a 45 gph, the 460 is 60 gph, etc.... how much go peddle does it take to burn 45 gph in a CRD? 
maybe this is the end all fix for the fuel filter, air in the fuel problem? I got a price for the 445 unit from the guy at the 800 number on the maesco site of $164.29. Not bad, I just got my CAT filter though,  maybe I'll run that first....
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| Author: | dgeist [ Thu May 24, 2007 5:48 pm ] |
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techTim wrote: I got a price for the 445 unit from the guy at the 800 number on the maesco site of $164.29. Not bad, I just got my CAT filter though, maybe I'll run that first....That's less than the factory filter head from a dealer(although I think that contains two of the sensors). Now the question is what other purchases are necessary; how much are replacment 2um filters; how to mate the WIF/heater/fuel temp sensor with the factory computer and what units to use. I like the idea of a complete replacement, too, but I also just got a CAT, so I'll have to either have a really nasty leak or other motivator to change at this point 
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| Author: | techTim [ Thu May 24, 2007 6:02 pm ] |
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all valid questions, but I'm sure that this topic will be picked up by others who will want to try sooner than later. again, love this web site, thanks to all those who participate! 
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| Author: | Stan Wright [ Thu May 24, 2007 6:04 pm ] |
| Post subject: | |
I noticed they have a 200 series that flow 15-45 gph and has a primer and optional heater. Is there any reason a 400 series would be better for us? Just thinking the 200 series might be less expensive. |
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| Author: | dieseldawg [ Thu May 24, 2007 10:11 pm ] |
| Post subject: | |
Its funny that this topic came up....I was justing thinking about a replacement filter head option that could help solve some of these problems. As far as the WIF sensor, thats not too big a deal. It's contacts and a light. For the heater, we need to determine some wattages to compare as we don't want to overload the wires that are there and create a fire hazard. Hopefully as long as there is some current flow to the heater, the computer should be happy and not show us the check engine light. For the temperature sensor, could we do something as simple as find an aftermarket sensor and plumb that into a fitting after the fuel leaves the filter headed to the engine. This should still let the computer try and heat the fuel and use the readings it needs to sense to give us proper fuel amounts to run the engine right. Any thoughts?? |
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| Author: | doug allen [ Fri May 25, 2007 3:57 pm ] |
| Post subject: | |
I have had filter head problems and have looked at the Racor filter units as the replacement alternative. I can see how the WIF and the heater process would work on this replacement but can't quite picture how the temp probe could be set up. I have a diesel boat that needs a filter and I would be willing to buy a unit and try it on the Liberty and if it didn't work, just take it off and put it on the boat. Any ideas on the temp probe? Doug |
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| Author: | Stan Wright [ Fri May 25, 2007 5:41 pm ] |
| Post subject: | |
I haven't looked lately, but can the temperature sensor be removed or is it cast into the housing? If it is threaded maybe it could be tee'd into the fuel line after the filter? |
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| Author: | Ranger1 [ Fri May 25, 2007 6:14 pm ] |
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Stan Wright wrote: I haven't looked lately, but can the temperature sensor be removed or is it cast into the housing? If it is threaded maybe it could be tee'd into the fuel line after the filter?
Neither - it's part of the nylon-glass plastic spin-on fuel heater puck. Both the fuel temp sensor and the fuel heater are inside of this piece of plastic. Both the sensor and heater element are inside the puck, and the leads exit through a passage in the outer plastic shell. There is some kind of adhesive seal on the metal pins on both sockets. You may be able to call Racor and ask for assistance. Since the PCM is a Bosch design, and it accepts the temp sensor input from the spin-on heater unit. Bosch may have used this same PCM design on other diesel engines. Racor may have a fuel heater-temp sensor unit designed to work with the Bosch PCM. |
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| Author: | Joe Romas [ Sat May 26, 2007 7:06 am ] |
| Post subject: | |
Ranger1 wrote: Stan Wright wrote: I haven't looked lately, but can the temperature sensor be removed or is it cast into the housing? If it is threaded maybe it could be tee'd into the fuel line after the filter? Neither - it's part of the nylon-glass plastic spin-on fuel heater puck. Both the fuel temp sensor and the fuel heater are inside of this piece of plastic. Both the sensor and heater element are inside the puck, and the leads exit through a passage in the outer plastic shell. There is some kind of adhesive seal on the metal pins on both sockets. You may be able to call Racor and ask for assistance. Since the PCM is a Bosch design, and it accepts the temp sensor input from the spin-on heater unit. Bosch may have used this same PCM design on other diesel engines. Racor may have a fuel heater-temp sensor unit designed to work with the Bosch PCM. My local import parts place has verified from BOSCH that the OEM filter is a BOSCH oem filter. RFCRD has stated the filter head/heater is a stock off the shelf BOSCH unit. So that may make it easier to find a replacement since most all parts of the fuel system are BOSCH. |
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| Author: | Ranger1 [ Sun May 27, 2007 7:00 pm ] |
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I can see a real market for a replacement fuel head on the CRD - something with dual filters, a lift pump, heater plug and temp sensor plug for the pcm. |
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| Author: | RFCRD [ Sun May 27, 2007 9:36 pm ] |
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Ranger1 wrote: I can see a real market for a replacement fuel head on the CRD - something with dual filters, a lift pump, heater plug and temp sensor plug for the pcm.
One thing that would be interesting to add to this system is a fuel warming loop from the cooling system like what I have seen these on straight WVO systems. This is essentially a metal fuel line run through a heater line pipe (hot water jacket). The concept is warm fuel burns more completely giving better performance, emissions, and mileage. This would also lessen the amount of time the electric heater is burning. |
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| Author: | Ranger1 [ Sun May 27, 2007 10:07 pm ] |
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RFCRD wrote: Ranger1 wrote: I can see a real market for a replacement fuel head on the CRD - something with dual filters, a lift pump, heater plug and temp sensor plug for the pcm. One thing that would be interesting to add to this system is a fuel warming loop from the cooling system like what I have seen these on straight WVO systems. This is essentially a metal fuel line run through a heater line pipe (hot water jacket). The concept is warm fuel burns more completely giving better performance, emissions, and mileage. This would also lessen the amount of time the electric heater is burning. I've seen some Racors that have both electric and engine coolant warming features. In fact, they have everything I mentioned earlier except dual filters, lift pump and a temp sensor. If suitable temp sensor could be fitted, it might be the optimal solution. I will say that since putting the dielectric paste on my Bosch fuel socket pins, I have not had a single occurrence of overheating fuel socket or a hot running filter, which was a frequent problem before. |
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| Author: | Stan Wright [ Thu May 31, 2007 11:09 am ] |
| Post subject: | |
Here is some more information on the Racor fuel filter systems: 200 series: http://www.go2marine.com/product.do?no=52204F 400 series: http://www.go2marine.com/product.do?no=83545F Heater elements: http://www.go2marine.com/product.do?no=114581F For a comparison, the 45 gph 200 series is $126 and the 400 series is $191. Both come with primer pumps. Is there a feature of the 400 series that makes it more desirable? The optional heater element is around $125.
Edit: Found some more specs under 'Section 1': http://www.a-filter.se/files/racor_products.pdf It looks like the 200 series will bolt to the factory mounting studs. |
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| Author: | BLake [ Fri Jun 01, 2007 8:19 am ] |
| Post subject: | |
I looked at a 200 series filter while at West Marine one day. It has everything you need. There are several In/Out locations. You will need to figure out a clean and neat way to route the hoses. The primer plunger is pretty small, looks like it would take awhile to prime the filter. I didn't measure the mounting holes but they look real close, probably the same. Raycor has drawings that will confirm. If I still had my CRD, I would install this filter and dump the factory setup. |
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| Author: | Stan Wright [ Fri Jun 01, 2007 10:20 am ] |
| Post subject: | |
I'm looking very seriously at the 245 version. I'm monitoring my factory setup for air leakage and P0093 codes. I'm gonna check the fuel line for potential leak points. I'm still looking around at different sources for the Racor filter assemblies. I'd like to buy the whole unit with the heater. If you buy the heated bowl separately it costs as much as the filter unit itself.
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| Author: | LanduytG [ Fri Jun 01, 2007 11:53 am ] |
| Post subject: | |
I have access to all Racor products and sell the bigger R60 series. The 245R12 with a 2, 10 or 30 micron is $165.00 and that includes heating element. Not knowing for sure how the OEM water sensor works it is very possible that the Racor prob can be used as well. That would add about another $40 or so to the price. I checked the bolt pattern of the OEM and the 245 that I have here and it should bolt up. But the Racor is a bit larger in diameter but from what I remember on ON CRD it would fit. Greg |
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| Author: | Stan Wright [ Fri Jun 01, 2007 1:50 pm ] |
| Post subject: | |
LanduytG wrote: I have access to all Racor products and sell the bigger R60 series. The 245R12 with a 2, 10 or 30 micron is $165.00 and that includes heating element. Not knowing for sure how the OEM water sensor works it is very possible that the Racor prob can be used as well. That would add about another $40 or so to the price. I checked the bolt pattern of the OEM and the 245 that I have here and it should bolt up. But the Racor is a bit larger in diameter but from what I remember on ON CRD it would fit.
Greg Does that include the clear fuel bowl? That's the best price I've seen so far. Can we find this setup on your site? If I continue to have air problems related to the fuel filter setup I'll replace it with the Racor. |
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| Author: | LanduytG [ Fri Jun 01, 2007 2:25 pm ] |
| Post subject: | |
Stan The heater is in the bowl. I don't have it on my site. I do have a unit here that I bought and never used but it does not have the heater. Greg |
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