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Trying to learn how Amsoil works
http://www.lostjeeps.com/forum/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=5&t=29813		 Page 1 of 10
Author:  crd liberty [ Sun Feb 24, 2008 5:34 pm ]
Post subject:  Trying to learn how Amsoil works
Amsoil is supposed to be a very good oil. I am looking at dealers
in the area. It looks like The Avon Lady. They all work out of the house.
I can order On-line or thru a local Forum member and have it shipped
to me.
My question I guess is? Why is this?
I was ready to order, and am thinking. Why is this, this way? People
should be shouting for this product.
I need diff fluids soon and wanted you'all imput on this.
Thanks
Steve
Author:  Endurance [ Sun Feb 24, 2008 5:47 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Trying to learn how Amsoil works
crd liberty wrote:
Amsoil is supposed to be a very good oil. I am looking at dealers
in the area. It looks like The Avon Lady. They all work out of the house.
I can order On-line or thru a local Forum member and have it shipped
to me.
My question I guess is? Why is this?
I was ready to order, and am thinking. Why is this, this way? People
should be shouting for this product.
I need diff fluids soon and wanted you'all imput on this.
Thanks
Steve


Haha Im from Northport, AL and got a ticket on the interstate in North Port, FL once.

As to your question, Im not exactly sure what you're asking.
Author:  widowmaker [ Sun Feb 24, 2008 6:08 pm ]
Post subject: 
I get his question
If amsoil is so great, why is it being sold like avon and not through reputable retailers. I think it's a great question.
Author:  crd liberty [ Sun Feb 24, 2008 6:14 pm ]
Post subject: 
Speed in Northport, Fl and they got U.
My ? was why cannot I buy Amsoil locally without ordering it
like you would do a Avon Lady Product?
Good product but not available without ordering it, is my ?
Notherwords is why are there no local dealers handle the
product, I think is what I am pondering.
Thanks
Steve
like your turbo emblem. I did one on the spare tire cover similar.
Author:  crd liberty [ Sun Feb 24, 2008 6:26 pm ]
Post subject: 
Don't pay any attention to me.
I am used to going and spending too much time lately here.
Price of fuel and lack of funds sends me up hill.
Haven't been on the road since Christmas and I think I am
starting to climb the walls.
Otherwise, yes, I do need to change the fluids in the libby
before I hook her back up as a Toad and go again.

Thanks again
Steve :lol:
Author:  tjkj2002 [ Sun Feb 24, 2008 6:59 pm ]
Post subject: 
I've seen Amsoil sold in many store before.Out in WA and JI Joe store sells it,most have a whole shelf of nothing but Amsoil.Seen CarQuest sell it also.Here in CO the only place that I have seen sell it is Layton Truck supply.The cost is the biggest factor,twice as much in most cases over the next expensive competitor.
Author:  JJsTJ [ Sun Feb 24, 2008 7:17 pm ]
Post subject: 
tjkj2002 wrote:
The cost is the biggest factor,twice as much in most cases over the next expensive competitor.


Cost is only a factor if you are not buying from me. :wink: :wink:

FWIW, All J Products is a retail account of mine and they sell it too when they do repairs or upgrades.

Amsoil products are sold through a product driven network marketing program similar to a multi level marketing program like Avon and others. w/ Amsoil is I get paid a commision on what I sell and not on recruiting others below me. I Can build a business of other dealers and earn off their product sales too but I am not in it for that. If anyone wants to be a Amsoil dealer I wholeheartedly recommend the business as a viable way to make some extra cash.

I sell at my cost plus fees from Paypal and a small percentage to cover variences in the various sales taxes, recycling fees, etc. that do not show up on my quotes when I make them. Truth is I rarely clear more than a buck or two on any sale after paypal fees, and final sale value lately I have even lost a few bucks on sales. I do earn my small commission and that goes into the bank which then gets consumed w/ event donations for raffles, donations to some charities and some sick kids I surprise w/ gifts & contributions. I recently used some of my "profit" to buy $30 of Girlscout cookies to be sent to our servicemen overseas from a LOST member and then did the same here locally.
blah blah blah.....I could go on but I guess I am straying......

anyhow, if you want more detailed info in Amsoil and the way they or I do business, PLMK via email or PM or I'll give you my number and you can call me. thanks, John
Author:  JJsTJ [ Sun Feb 24, 2008 7:19 pm ]
Post subject: 
Oh, and in some places it is available through different stores and quick lube shops. It is not available for mass retailers (those w/ over 12 stores or shops) to protect the dealers. I can sign up commercial, retail and quick lube accounts if I choose too. Most dealers are little operations like mine that exist in cyber land and my local sales and services of customers vehicles.
Author:  vtdog [ Sun Feb 24, 2008 8:28 pm ]
Post subject: 
I have been hearing about how wonderfull Amsoil is during the last 3 years I have owned my CRD . No one has succesfully explained to me why they do not submit their oil for testing by the API. If their stuff is so great, why not show it to a "neutral" body? My personal belief is that the stuff is no better than any quality oil and the only reason they will not submit to testing is for marketing purposes in developing a "mystique". Remember Marvel Mystery Oil, or how about the silliness regarding Coors beer being unique due to its water from the rocky mountains.

Anyway, that is my personal opinion for what its worth. I am neither a gear head, or grease monkey, but do have a good BS detector
Author:  BlackLibertyCRD [ Sun Feb 24, 2008 9:19 pm ]
Post subject: 
tjkj2002 wrote:
I've seen Amsoil sold in many store before.Out in WA and JI Joe store sells it,most have a whole shelf of nothing but Amsoil.Seen CarQuest sell it also.Here in CO the only place that I have seen sell it is Layton Truck supply.The cost is the biggest factor,twice as much in most cases over the next expensive competitor.


Yepp, CarQuest in Camano Island, WA carries Amsoil. Maybe CarQuest in other states carry it too.
Author:  Reflex [ Sun Feb 24, 2008 9:19 pm ]
Post subject: 
I don't trust MLM's, peroid. Most of their money is made from the distribution system, not from the product.
Author:  CATCRD [ Sun Feb 24, 2008 9:49 pm ]
Post subject: 
vtdog wrote:
I have been hearing about how wonderfull Amsoil is during the last 3 years I have owned my CRD . No one has succesfully explained to me why they do not submit their oil for testing by the API. If their stuff is so great, why not show it to a "neutral" body? My personal belief is that the stuff is no better than any quality oil and the only reason they will not submit to testing is for marketing purposes in developing a "mystique". Remember Marvel Mystery Oil, or how about the silliness regarding Coors beer being unique due to its water from the rocky mountains.

Anyway, that is my personal opinion for what its worth. I am neither a gear head, or grease monkey, but do have a good BS detector


My thoughts exactly. All the tests I've seen about how scamsoil is superior have been performed by amsoil themselves.
Author:  JJsTJ [ Sun Feb 24, 2008 10:07 pm ]
Post subject: 
CATCRD wrote:
vtdog wrote:
I have been hearing about how wonderfull Amsoil is during the last 3 years I have owned my CRD . No one has succesfully explained to me why they do not submit their oil for testing by the API. If their stuff is so great, why not show it to a "neutral" body? My personal belief is that the stuff is no better than any quality oil and the only reason they will not submit to testing is for marketing purposes in developing a "mystique". Remember Marvel Mystery Oil, or how about the silliness regarding Coors beer being unique due to its water from the rocky mountains.

Anyway, that is my personal opinion for what its worth. I am neither a gear head, or grease monkey, but do have a good BS detector


My thoughts exactly. All the tests I've seen about how scamsoil is superior have been performed by amsoil themselves.


Wrong. API testing only means an oil has met a minimum performance standard. Amsoil has been independantly tested over and over again and been show to be superior to other synthetic oils on the market. You don't have to like it but if you do some research you will find the same info. Amsoil consistently tests their products against API tested oils and beats them and then they mention names in that comparison testing and guess who isn't crying foul? The MFG's that they mention don't say a word about it because they know it is true. If their claims were false then they could be sued by the major oil companies who have teams of lawyers watching and waiting. Since 1972 when Amsoil was the first to create an API full synthetic oil it hasn't happened.

I find it funny that the MLM issue is brought up. You show me a product distribution system that isn't just like MLM. There is always someone up the chain making more money. Exxon/mobil sells their products to all kinds of different distributors who then sell it to stores who then sell it to the consumer. You tell me who is making the Multi Billions of dollars off their products....never mind, Exxon/Mobil made over 39 Billion last year. So how many opportunities did they give any of you to make a couple bucks?
Author:  gd5092 [ Sun Feb 24, 2008 10:26 pm ]
Post subject: 
Just use factory spec oil. no less.
Companies like Shell and Esso do more research on oil in a day than Amsoil does in a year, there's abosolutly nothing better about amsoil than what you can buy at the corner store. why bother wasting time (and diesel) looking for it.

-G
Author:  JJsTJ [ Sun Feb 24, 2008 11:00 pm ]
Post subject: 
gd5092 wrote:
Just use factory spec oil. no less.
Companies like Shell and Esso do more research on oil in a day than Amsoil does in a year, there's abosolutly nothing better about amsoil than what you can buy at the corner store. why bother wasting time (and diesel) looking for it.

-G


:lol: Care to back that up w/ any factual information? I guess that recycled oil I can buy that meets SPI ratings is good enough then so we should all just buy it since it is also the cheapest and hope for the best?
Author:  Reflex [ Sun Feb 24, 2008 11:07 pm ]
Post subject: 
JJsKJ - I don't think the big oil companies care much about some tiny little company making ridiculous claims. I don't know if Amsoil is or is not any better than the factory reccomended oil I use, however I am not going to take Amsoil's word for it. You say independant research proves it, well, lets see that research....

Quote:
I find it funny that the MLM issue is brought up. You show me a product distribution system that isn't just like MLM. There is always someone up the chain making more money. Exxon/mobil sells their products to all kinds of different distributors who then sell it to stores who then sell it to the consumer. You tell me who is making the Multi Billions of dollars off their products....never mind, Exxon/Mobil made over 39 Billion last year. So how many opportunities did they give any of you to make a couple bucks?

This is the typical emotional dodge of MLM organizations. I hear it from Amway reps, Mary Kay reps, etc etc. The truth is that anyone can resell anyone's product if they wish, if I want to go into business reselling Exxon/Mobil oil all I have to do is become a distributer, no fancy marketing program required, the markup is standard and the distribution system straightforward. The difference is that the company does not base its buiness model on making money off the distributers, they base it off of their product selling to customers.

BTW, a quick look online shows that there is a LOT of controvery regarding this company, for instance they apparantly do not allow automotive manufaccturers to test or certify their products, which is very suspicious to me, they have avoided basic API testing, does not participate in ACEA testing. Their marketing has used shills repeatedly as well, especially online.

I don't see a reason to trust them. There is nothing 'mysterious' about motor oil, and they don't have some magic forumla. The only reason I can see to refuse to allow testing is that there is nothing extraordinary about the product.
Author:  JJsTJ [ Sun Feb 24, 2008 11:33 pm ]
Post subject: 
Avoided basic API testing? Amsoil does have API certified oils and their premium line of oils isn't API tested because of phosphorous restrictions by the all knowing API.
Yeah, Exxon doesn't care about losing money to a little guy showing claims that their product is better than Mobil1 and losing sales to them. Ok, I'll buy that. That must be why they challenged Castrol in court, lost and went home to change their synthetic formulation to be less synthetic.
It is funny that people can't believe that a product that has been around since 1972, Before Mobil1 even got into the synthetic game, might be better.
Author:  Reflex [ Mon Feb 25, 2008 12:26 am ]
Post subject: 
JJsKJ wrote:
Avoided basic API testing? Amsoil does have API certified oils and their premium line of oils isn't API tested because of phosphorous restrictions by the all knowing API.
Yeah, Exxon doesn't care about losing money to a little guy showing claims that their product is better than Mobil1 and losing sales to them. Ok, I'll buy that. That must be why they challenged Castrol in court, lost and went home to change their synthetic formulation to be less synthetic.
It is funny that people can't believe that a product that has been around since 1972, Before Mobil1 even got into the synthetic game, might be better.

Amway's been around for decades too, I guess their products are better too, right? Seriously? That seems to be your argument. I have a better one: Suckers have existed since 1972.

Whatever excuses you invent the problem is simple: They do not allow third parties to do neutral and fair tests of their products. I was suprised to read that auto manufacturers are not allowed to test them and certify them for their vehicles. Whatever the excuses, if Amsoil wants to be taken seriously then they need to not behave like they are selling magic and start behaving like they are selling a product.

And btw, whats the Castrol story have to do with anything? What did they challenge them over? How does that relate to the Amsoil products in any way? Or is it just a random anecdote meant lump your product in with one with a better brand credibility?
Author:  bhysjulien [ Mon Feb 25, 2008 2:55 am ]
Post subject: 
The back and fourth on this is kind of silly. If you don't like Amsoil I doubt there will be anything anyone can say to change your mind. The same goes for if you do like Amsoil. So lets agree to disagree and try to answer the original question. Applying my limited amount of common sense I would surmise that you don't see Amsoil in retail stores very much is because of cost and the prevailing wisdom on oil changes. Cost is self explanatory so I'll try to tackle the second part of my statement. For years we've been told to run oil for 3,000 miles and change it. I know several people that swear by this and have anxiety attacks (I'm exaggerating a little) if they go over 3,000. If you have a populace trained to perform oil changes like this why would you carry a product that states that you can wait a year or 25,000 miles to change your oil. Which guy are you going to make more money on? And isn't that the point of evil capitalist corporations, God love them?

Disclaimer:
I use Amsoil. I don't care if you use it or not. I've never had a problem using it and never talked to anyone who has. To be fair I've never talked to anyone who made the claim their oil caused paint oxidation, tire baldness, or their taxes to be audited. Now go fourth and buy what you want.
Author:  Reflex [ Mon Feb 25, 2008 3:21 am ]
Post subject: 
In other words, in your mind its a conspiracy theory. Bull!S&!. There is no oil that can magically go 25,000 miles, at least not at the consumer level. Perhaps 6000, although for the price your paying there would be no reason to avoid selling it if your a dealer, the markup more than makes up for the lesser oil changes. The real issue though is that as I understand it, Amsoil itself is set up as a MLM, not as a retail operation, so the reason its not carried in stores is because that is not their chosen distribution method, not because there is some conspiracy to suppress a superior product.

Until today I'd not heard about Amsoil. But much like the K&N thread, just reading this and the nature of the testimonies set off alarm bells, and after some research online I realized just what a scam this stuff is. Every review I can find is put up by someone out to promote the product, there are dozens of website with scare tactics to get people to use it(good example here: http://www.lessforeignoil.com/content.php?content.4 ), tons of purportedly independent 'reviews' that are on websites clearly designed to look independant but when I read them its obviously marketing, major disputes on their Wikipedia entry from people who are upset that Amsoil or their dealers have turned thier entry into a commercial, and lots of talks of conspiracies, wierd references to the Mobil1 vs. Castrol court case(which near as I could tell had absolutely nothing to do with Amsoil) as though it somehow legitimizes it, and people making plainly ludicrous claims about what it does for their engine.

Seriously, even if the stuff is pure gold and will give me 50mpg and an oil change every million miles I don't think I could bring myself to support this kind of behaviour with my hard earned money. Might as well toss it out to Scientology, Amway or whatever other scams are out there. Which, btw, is interesting since apparantly Amsoil has branched out into nutritional supplements, another disreptuable MLM heavy money maker.

Thanks, but no thanks. I have some sense of morals and ethics, and am not nearly this easily scammed.
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