LOST JEEPS :: View topic - Durango and Ram 1500 Diesels

Impossible. Everyone knows those evil hippies in California with their silly clean air rules have made it impossible to build small diesels :wink:

Impossible. Everyone knows those evil hippies in California with their silly clean air rules have made it impossible to build small diesels :wink:

Yep, that's one reason I left CA.....the other was their attitude towards guns.

If I remember correctly, the engine devopment was a joint effort between Cummins and the DOE. Probably a significant funding grant to develop next generation diesel technology. This has been in the works for what....6 years???

The fact is...when these engines come out you won't be able to buy one for the first year. It'll be like the new Wrangler...demand far exceeded production capacity. These trucks are what we've been dreaming of for ten years. Finally, they are about to be available.

Sad thing is...you won't be able to touch one for less than $35K probably which means most people still won't be able to have them for a couple more years.

For me the diesel benifits outway the fuel costs. I am looking at a tow rig and the diesel performance over a gasser. The HEMI in my GC is great but when we move to a larger TT, then I have to go larger in the TV. A diesel Durango is my first choice but a RAM 1500 would be second. My price comparison will be the differance in cost between a Ram 1500 diesel and a Ram 2500 diesel.....plus I don't care for the empty ride of a 2500.

Finger are crossed they don't screw the pooch on this one.

Considering that 2500 trucks with the Cummins start at $40K stripped down in 4x4 trim, and upper 30s in 4x2 trim...I would say the 1500s will be considerably less. Like, probably $5K less at least. And, the 1500s are getting coils in the rear to replace the leafs, so the ride quality empty will smoke the 2500s.

Actually, since the GCVW is a fixed number, the added weight of the diesel drivetrain will reduce the hauling and towing capacity of the 1500 trucks. So I would expect the Cummins 1500 to have a smaller payload than a Hemi version, which will probably surprise a lot of folks who tow gooseneck style.

I've been hauling and towing with trucks since I was 16. Personally, I think the only time diesel is worth the extra thousands of dollars is if you work the truck to it's upper limit frequently. Somebody like me who just tows the Jeep or camper or ATVs to the campground once per month or so doesn't really need the diesel honestly. I mean, it was different 5 years ago. But now with diesel fuel being so expensive, and maintenance being so expensive on them...it's almost better to stick with the gas V8s and V10s of the world.

Author:	litton [ Sat Mar 29, 2008 7:43 pm ]
Post subject:	Durango and Ram 1500 Diesels
Yep, I know this is not a Liberty CRD topic but interesting non the less. I suppose the real diesel heads in the group have already seen this article but it's sure interesting seeing as how I'm thinking of replacing my Jeep GC with a Durango or Ram 1500. Lookd at the EGR technology being used and the location of the turbo. http://www.dieselpowermag.com/tech/dodge/0612dp_new_cummins_v6_and_v8/engine_performance.html

Author:	Threeweight [ Sun Mar 30, 2008 1:41 am ]
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Impossible. Everyone knows those evil hippies in California with their silly clean air rules have made it impossible to build small diesels

Author:	litton [ Sun Mar 30, 2008 9:51 am ]
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Threeweight wrote: Impossible. Everyone knows those evil hippies in California with their silly clean air rules have made it impossible to build small diesels Yep, that's one reason I left CA.....the other was their attitude towards guns. I really like the 500 ft/lbs of torque in a 1500 PU.....just what I need when I go to a larger TT. I hope they are still online for the 2009 model year.

Author:	Magnum [ Sun Mar 30, 2008 11:42 am ]
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interesting that the V-6 get about the same milage as the crd Liberty at least after the f37 flash and you will probably be able to get a manual transmission

Author:	retmil46 [ Sun Mar 30, 2008 12:27 pm ]
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Threeweight wrote: Impossible. Everyone knows those evil hippies in California with their silly clean air rules have made it impossible to build small diesels Yep, the idea that CARB can somehow force other countries to make their merchant ships comply with CA state emissions regulations, when they're in international waters 200 miles out in the Pacific Ocean, is pretty damned silly. I've watched Mary Nichols in a couple of televised interviews. If the dictionary had a definition for "one track mind", her picture would be right beside it.

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Author:	Uffe [ Sun Mar 30, 2008 12:30 pm ]
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What? Aluminum head? I thought Cummins would still use the good old cast iron variety Oh how I would drool if I had a 4.2L V6 diesel in my KJ. I think I might end up drowning myself when trying to go to work

Author:	Threeweight [ Sun Mar 30, 2008 2:39 pm ]
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litton wrote: Yep, that's one reason I left CA.....the other was their attitude towards guns. The article says both these engines are designed to exceed the 2007 diesel emissions standards, meaning they should meet CA emissions rules. Amazing what can be done when engineers are given a chance to solve a problem, instead of lobbyists and politicians whining about it.

Author:	litton [ Sun Mar 30, 2008 3:05 pm ]
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If I remember correctly, the engine devopment was a joint effort between Cummins and the DOE. Probably a significant funding grant to develop next generation diesel technology. This has been in the works for what....6 years???

Author:	Sir Sam [ Sun Mar 30, 2008 3:15 pm ]
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litton wrote: If I remember correctly, the engine devopment was a joint effort between Cummins and the DOE. Probably a significant funding grant to develop next generation diesel technology. This has been in the works for what....6 years??? Man, I wonder how annoyed those poor engineers must have been after dealing with DOE for a few years. I don't know about that partnership, but at least the environmental cleanup side of DOE can be pretty dysfunctional.

Author:	dieselenthusiast [ Sun Mar 30, 2008 5:35 pm ]
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Chrysler/Dodge/Jeep have been trying to push diesels for the past several years. One of Chrysler’s new diesel plants has a soybean field around the facility to represent their future for biodiesel, which I thought was really cool. We’ll see what the future holds. I have read that Cummins technology is above the game and exceed all future EPA requirements. With the positive relationship that Cummins has with Dodge, I can only imagine the future. Ford and GM have been indecisive and unclear about their future for diesel, whereas Chrysler has never stopped pushing……………………

Author:	LibertyCRD [ Tue Apr 01, 2008 3:01 pm ]
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The fact is...when these engines come out you won't be able to buy one for the first year. It'll be like the new Wrangler...demand far exceeded production capacity. These trucks are what we've been dreaming of for ten years. Finally, they are about to be available. Sad thing is...you won't be able to touch one for less than $35K probably which means most people still won't be able to have them for a couple more years.

Author:	dieselenthusiast [ Tue Apr 01, 2008 5:02 pm ]
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LibertyCRD wrote: The fact is...when these engines come out you won't be able to buy one for the first year. It'll be like the new Wrangler...demand far exceeded production capacity. These trucks are what we've been dreaming of for ten years. Finally, they are about to be available. Sad thing is...you won't be able to touch one for less than $35K probably which means most people still won't be able to have them for a couple more years. I'm sure there will be plenty on the lot. But I agree, the preferred color and package might be hard to come by without some searching around. Depending on the direction of our economy, we might be able to pick one up at a 0% interest! In addition, if diesel prices stay high, I doubt there will be as many people jumping on the diesel bandwagon as we’d like to think.

Author:	LibertyCRD [ Wed Apr 02, 2008 7:45 am ]
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That is a very true point. Like I said before, when I did the math comparing the savings of my CRD Liberty vs. the wife's gas Liberty...I concluded that once diesel was .80 cents higher than gas, I would be breaking even and saving no money. (At that time it was .35 cents higher). Well...currently we are at that point around here. Diesel is .90 cents higher in some places. So, having a diesel Ram really won't save any cash at all at the moment. That is a good point.

Author:	litton [ Wed Apr 02, 2008 10:22 am ]
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For me the diesel benifits outway the fuel costs. I am looking at a tow rig and the diesel performance over a gasser. The HEMI in my GC is great but when we move to a larger TT, then I have to go larger in the TV. A diesel Durango is my first choice but a RAM 1500 would be second. My price comparison will be the differance in cost between a Ram 1500 diesel and a Ram 2500 diesel.....plus I don't care for the empty ride of a 2500. Finger are crossed they don't screw the pooch on this one.

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Author:	LibertyCRD [ Wed Apr 02, 2008 10:29 am ]
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Considering that 2500 trucks with the Cummins start at $40K stripped down in 4x4 trim, and upper 30s in 4x2 trim...I would say the 1500s will be considerably less. Like, probably $5K less at least. And, the 1500s are getting coils in the rear to replace the leafs, so the ride quality empty will smoke the 2500s.

Author:	Threeweight [ Wed Apr 02, 2008 1:54 pm ]
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litton wrote: For me the diesel benifits outway the fuel costs. I am looking at a tow rig and the diesel performance over a gasser. The HEMI in my GC is great but when we move to a larger TT, then I have to go larger in the TV. A diesel Durango is my first choice but a RAM 1500 would be second. My price comparison will be the differance in cost between a Ram 1500 diesel and a Ram 2500 diesel.....plus I don't care for the empty ride of a 2500. Finger are crossed they don't screw the pooch on this one. Remember that the Ram 1500 and Durango do not have the brakes or the suspension for towing the kinds of loads that the bigger Rams do. These rigs will probably be rated to tow about the same as their Hemi counterparts, just with better fuel economy and longer lifespan.

Author:	LibertyCRD [ Wed Apr 02, 2008 2:01 pm ]
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Actually, since the GCVW is a fixed number, the added weight of the diesel drivetrain will reduce the hauling and towing capacity of the 1500 trucks. So I would expect the Cummins 1500 to have a smaller payload than a Hemi version, which will probably surprise a lot of folks who tow gooseneck style. I've been hauling and towing with trucks since I was 16. Personally, I think the only time diesel is worth the extra thousands of dollars is if you work the truck to it's upper limit frequently. Somebody like me who just tows the Jeep or camper or ATVs to the campground once per month or so doesn't really need the diesel honestly. I mean, it was different 5 years ago. But now with diesel fuel being so expensive, and maintenance being so expensive on them...it's almost better to stick with the gas V8s and V10s of the world.

Author:	dieselenthusiast [ Wed Apr 02, 2008 6:44 pm ]
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LibertyCRD wrote: Considering that 2500 trucks with the Cummins start at $40K stripped down in 4x4 trim, and upper 30s in 4x2 trim...I would say the 1500s will be considerably less. Like, probably $5K less at least. And, the 1500s are getting coils in the rear to replace the leafs, so the ride quality empty will smoke the 2500s. I have a buddy in Washington who says that a NEW Dodge Cummins is pretty affordable. I forget which, I think he said either the Seattle or Portland area has one of the largest dealerships in the Nation in which you can buy a Dodge Cummins loaded, 2500, 4X4 for $37,000. I bought my truck in New Mexico, and at that time, dealerships didn't post the price for diesel trucks. Do we know for certain that a diesel Durango or the 1500 are coming out in 2009?

Author:	LibertyCRD [ Thu Apr 03, 2008 8:15 am ]
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From what I've heard, the 1/2 ton Dodges (Ram/Durango) with diesel engines will be 2010 models.

Author:	kcfoxie [ Thu Apr 03, 2008 9:18 am ]
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LibertyCRD wrote: Actually, since the GCVW is a fixed number, the added weight of the diesel drivetrain will reduce the hauling and towing capacity of the 1500 trucks. So I would expect the Cummins 1500 to have a smaller payload than a Hemi version, which will probably surprise a lot of folks who tow gooseneck style. I've been hauling and towing with trucks since I was 16. Personally, I think the only time diesel is worth the extra thousands of dollars is if you work the truck to it's upper limit frequently. Somebody like me who just tows the Jeep or camper or ATVs to the campground once per month or so doesn't really need the diesel honestly. I mean, it was different 5 years ago. But now with diesel fuel being so expensive, and maintenance being so expensive on them...it's almost better to stick with the gas V8s and V10s of the world. ...so the avg 3-4MPG increase in a diesel V8 over a gas V8 makes nothing in the long haul? We should just ditch these CRD's for V6 models!