BIG Problems

JHCRASH · **Posted:** Fri May 02, 2008 7:37 pm

I hope someone can help me.

My CRD is completely dead in the water. I will start with the battery is good, the starter is good ,the alternator is good, the fuses are good,as far as the relays go they also test good,Now the problem It wont start, when you turn the key to the start position it kicks the breakers and all the power to everything is lost,it varies on how long it takes to get power back to anything,when you have power everything in the acc.position works fine even in the on position but when you try to start it everything goes dead. I have disconnected the starter and it still does it so I know it is not the starter. If I remove the relay under the hood thas says ASD #39 it will not do it anymore you just get nothing when you try to start it.

I think I have a direct short somewhere but I cant find it. the dealer wants $90 an hour to try and diagnose it that is outrageous so I really need to figure it out on my own if I can. does anyone have any ideas as to what this could be. what is the ASD relay for I dont have a service manual but I have a feeling it would not tell me anyway.

Please help if you can gmctd any ideas?

fastRob · **Posted:** Fri May 02, 2008 7:59 pm

Anyone touched the rig lately? Any work done, I would start there.

Do you have rodents? They chew wires.

Grab a multimeter and go from the battery out. Check the ground. How old is the battery, could it be dead? Keep it simple.

Uffe · **Posted:** Fri May 02, 2008 8:01 pm

Does the battery run the lights with no problems?

To me that seems to be a faulty battery. If the lights don't come on when you activate them (or if they are very dim) you can try jumpstarting with another car. DON'T JUMPSTART IF YOU GOT A SHORT SOMEWHERE!

Actually, just don't try to start it if you got a short. If you have a short your battery will blow itself up very fast, I think your battery is just at the end of its life.

Normally when this is the case, the battery voltage will seem to be fine when not running anything, but the voltage will drop to very low levels when a load is applied (starter motor). How is your preheat glow plugs coming on for you? They shouldn't be working either if the battery is dead.

Pablo · **Joined:** Thu Feb 02, 2006 10:06 pm **Posts:** 1201

Did the rats get your wires? If you park outside I would trace the wires if you have not.

dieseltoyz · **Joined:** Wed Oct 17, 2007 11:28 pm **Posts:** 64

it sounds to me like the negative battery terminal isn't tight

gmctd · **Posted:** Fri May 02, 2008 10:26 pm

Or the (+)

dieseltoyz · **Joined:** Wed Oct 17, 2007 11:28 pm **Posts:** 64

I would suggest that you remove each terminal, clean with a terminal cleaning tool, then apply some dielectric grease and tighten each terminal back up. This will rule out a possible bad connection. -Todd

JHCRASH · **Posted:** Fri May 02, 2008 10:44 pm

The battery is new. I stock optimas at work so i threw a new one in it. Grounds are good. no chewed wires. all the lights work fine my stereo is as loud as ever in the acc. position. it has something to do with the #39 relay under the hood.

I had the f 37 done in december but no one but me touches it outside of that.I pulled the starter to have it checked because it wont do anything but click when i jump across the posts which is strange because outside the jeep it tests fine.

And i found a bad thing.The cone on the starter has a bunch of aluminum in it and the adapter plate just above the starter has some of the cast broke so I will be having a wonderful conversation with the dealer over that tomorrow. You can see where they pryed on it and gouged the hell out of it for some reason.

So now I am wondering if the tranny or somne thing is froze up causing the problem.

Pablo · **Joined:** Thu Feb 02, 2006 10:06 pm **Posts:** 1201

Where is this relay under the hood? From the PCM?

F6 30 AMP fuse? R39 -> ASD Relay

[edited]

From poking around I think ASD == Auto Shut Down.

I will keep looking through all 3000+ pages and post anything else of relevance. I pmed you. I have relevant info if you send me email address I will send.

Sir Sam · **Posted:** Sat May 03, 2008 2:58 am

Pablo wrote:

Where is this relay under the hood? From the PCM?

F6 30 AMP fuse? R39 -> ASD Relay

From poking around I think ASD == Auto Shut Down.

With the ignition on. Battery voltage greater than 10.4 volts and the ASD sense switch is on.
• Set Condition:
Actual Fuel Pump Relay state is not equal to desired state. One Trip Fault. Three good trips to turn off the MIL.
Possible Causes
(F1) FUSED IGNITION SWITCH OUTPUT CIRCUIT
INTERNAL FUSED B+ CIRCUIT
(K31) FUEL PUMP RELAY CONTROL CIRCUIT
(K31) FUEL PUMP RELAY CONTROL CIRCUIT SHORTED TO GROUND
FUEL PUMP RELAY
PCM

I will keep looking through all 3000+ pages and post anything else of relevance.

Yes, ASD is auto shut down .

Joe Romas · **Posted:** Sat May 03, 2008 7:06 am

Based on the pry marks you found around the starter and the starter working off the car I suspect they left something loose when they did your F37. Can you rotate the engine over by hand from underneath the car? Check the bolts that hold the torque converter to the flex plate.

Magnum · **Posted:** Sat May 03, 2008 11:30 pm

while you are checking the under hood fuses check F8 40 amp IGN/Start

warp2diesel · **Posted:** Sun May 04, 2008 12:23 am

Battery cables that get hot from over loading will have the insulation shrink over the copper, just like heat shrink tubing. Check for mechanical jams as well.

JHCRASH · **Posted:** Sun May 04, 2008 12:53 am

Part of the problem I have decided is the battery may have one dead cell it load tests ok works the lights and other features just not the starter. I used a jump pack with the battery disconected and it no longer kicks any of the breakers but it still wont start. So i am thinking maybe I do have a mechanical problem with the flywheel that may be the starting problem now but it is a strange coincidence that they would both happen at the same time. So I am going to try another new battery and see if I get the same results as the jump pack. and then pull the starter again and see what I find there.

Thanks for your help guys.

tjkj2002 · **Posted:** Sun May 04, 2008 9:32 am

I'm not sure what they all do for that F37,but it seems like they pull the tranny,am I right?

Well I would check the TC bolts,if they didn't torque them properly they may have backed out causing your mechanical jam,all your electronics will work fine but it won't crank because a TC bolt is jammed in the bellhousing somewhere.Could be worth looking at,see if you can turn the engine over by hand.

trac95ker · **Joined:** Tue May 23, 2006 3:02 pm **Posts:** 116

charge your batt ovenight and measure the volts, if its under 12v you have a bad cell or get it load tested. If the starter is out, turn the flywheel with a screwdriver. Not sure but there ight be an access hole.

BlackLibertyCRD · **Posted:** Sun May 04, 2008 12:35 pm

You have to remove the engine to transmission collar to access the converter bolts, page 21 - 698 of the service manual. Looks like 8 bolts on the lower front of the transmission. Don't driver with this collar off because it looks structure to me.

JHCRASH · **Posted:** Sun May 04, 2008 10:02 pm

All good advice guys I will let you all know what it is when I find out for sure.

Milner · **Posted:** Mon May 05, 2008 11:07 am

IIRC
F37 is just a ecm/pcm flash....should not have to remove the tranny or anything else....dealer did ours in 10 minutes....

I would say make sure everything rotates freely in the motor/trans. Also check all the ground straps. I have seen cases where the ground makes a good enough connection to run everything, but when you try to pull high amps starting, there is not a good enough connection to allow the flow through.
Optima's will measure ok voltage wise, but not with a load, to see if it is bad, it needs a good load tester....most of the parts store ones are only 600cca testers, so it will test good....

Joe Romas · **Posted:** Mon May 05, 2008 7:03 pm

Milner wrote:

IIRC
F37 is just a ecm/pcm flash....should not have to remove the tranny or anything else....dealer did ours in 10 minutes.....

Very wrong :shock:

Those who got the official F-37 recall notice (Before November 05 manufacture date) got a torque converter and if they could hear a noise they also got a new pump and cover along with a new transmission fluid/AC condensor unit. Now the 06 models made after that date didn't get a official recall but when they are in for service they got the works :cry:

And they modified the TCM and ECM and it took over a hour :oops:

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