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 Post subject: Re: Project MJ CRD is born:
PostPosted: Fri Feb 09, 2018 1:40 am 
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I opened up a tube of seam sealer, I had the option to buy brush on or caulk tube, so I went with the black caulk tube. I think I might order some of the brush on and see how it works, I'm nut sure the caulk gun method is always the best for what I need to do.

This image has black seam sealer on black por15, so its a little hard to make out, the short is there is a patch panel, por 15 over the area top and bottom, and then seam sealer over the weld area. The seam sealer came out in in long strands from the tube, so I spread it around evenly with a wood paddle to flatten and smooth. It seems to cover pretty well and the consistency and rubber pliability look good long term. Its a urethane product so it should hold up well long term.

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I dug the body harness out of the mess of stuff in the bed, I need to make some modifications in the rear section. The white plugs in the lower right of the image are usually behind the plastic which is under the spare tire carrier. These plug into the turn signals and factory wiring harness for trailer lights.

The MJ uses a different tail light setup than the XJ - its the same as what the XJ wagoneers had. This is more what trailer lights are like, or older vehicles. So the brake and turn are combined into one bulb.

I need to do some rewire work, including what I will do for trailer lights, and shorten the wiring to sit in the cab as those connectors are not weather rated. Right now I am planning to put them in the drivers rear void space behind where the stock rear speaker sits. Then I will tie that in with the factory plugs to the MJ rear harness that exits through a rubber grommet in the floor.

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 Post subject: Re: Project MJ CRD is born:
PostPosted: Fri Feb 09, 2018 12:57 pm 
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Use the urethane windshield adhesive after painting with POR 15. The windshield adhesive is a flexible urethane made to adhere to all painted surfaces. Being a moisture cure it should cure well within 3 days depending on humidity. Should be able to buy tubes at most auto stores. I use an MS Silane I got from my previous job for sealing applications. It functions the same as windshield adhesive.


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 Post subject: Re: Project MJ CRD is born:
PostPosted: Fri Feb 09, 2018 2:01 pm 
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Having used both, they are very nearly identical, and both are strong and pretty much weatherproof. They don't stick for crapp to normal silicone, though.

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 Post subject: Re: Project MJ CRD is born:
PostPosted: Fri Feb 09, 2018 9:13 pm 
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joelukex4 wrote:
Use the urethane windshield adhesive after painting with POR 15. The windshield adhesive is a flexible urethane made to adhere to all painted surfaces. Being a moisture cure it should cure well within 3 days depending on humidity. Should be able to buy tubes at most auto stores. I use an MS Silane I got from my previous job for sealing applications. It functions the same as windshield adhesive.


The price is comparable for a tube of urethane windshield adhesive vs seam sealer.

The difference I see is that windshield urethane sets to a firmer level, and its a little harder to dispense at room temp. The seam sealer is a little more flexible after cured.

And yes being a urethane they are both a moisture cure, its also very very very dry here in the winter, so its taking awhile.

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 Post subject: Re: Project MJ CRD is born:
PostPosted: Fri Feb 09, 2018 11:22 pm 
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Holly cow Sam, you are doing an awesome project! I was thinking some years ago to get am MJ to swap that Mercedes om617 I have into... I had then a Cherokee that I didn't want to touch but I ended up selling. I also have a Dana 44 from a Cherokee that I kept after I sold my Cherokee. I know you have your plans already but man, I would've mounted the leaf springs over the axle. A lifted MJ looks super cool. I get you have your own plans already and my rambling is just due to some emotion your project provoked... Lol.

Btw, what's the purpose of the build, you're looking just to do a restoration or some overlanding also? Have fun, I'll follow your progress.

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 Post subject: Re: Project MJ CRD is born:
PostPosted: Fri Feb 09, 2018 11:43 pm 
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Sam, I watched the YouTube video, why don't you remove the gas tank, leave the axle the way it is, and see how it drives, you can temporarily run from a canister once you have the engine installed, and you can place a custom tank in the bed? I also wonder how the Cherokee's 8 1/4 corporate axle look like? I never seen a Cherokee one, but neither Dana 35 or 44 have any vibration damper (monkey balls), so I doubt they are needed. I speculate now, I wonder if the damper is to soften harsh acceleration, since liberty has a softer coil suspension (so the jeep would not tilt).

I'd still give a thought at having the fuel tank in the bed, regardless of axle fitting. Depending obviously on your restoration purpose...

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 Post subject: Re: Project MJ CRD is born:
PostPosted: Sat Feb 10, 2018 12:07 am 
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thermorex wrote:
Sam, I watched the YouTube video, why don't you remove the gas tank, leave the axle the way it is, and see how it drives, you can temporarily run from a canister once you have the engine installed, and you can place a custom tank in the bed? I also wonder how the Cherokee's 8 1/4 corporate axle look like? I never seen a Cherokee one, but neither Dana 35 or 44 have any vibration damper (monkey balls), so I doubt they are needed. I speculate now, I wonder if the damper is to soften harsh acceleration, since liberty has a softer coil suspension (so the jeep would not tilt).

I'd still give a thought at having the fuel tank in the bed, regardless of axle fitting. Depending obviously on your restoration purpose...


Hey! Thanks for the sub!

I pulled the damper mass off and I have no clearance issue anymore, so no problem! I really don't think its needed in the leaf spring setup, maybe even not needed for the KJ, I would guess its just meant to smooth out driveline vibes or something or other.

That said I'm happy with where the tank is, the plan for this is a camping/overlanding rig so having it in the bed would be a nogo.

The XJ 8.25 has drum brakes, but the pumpkin is a little different, the casting changed in the KJ for the upper ball joint mount and the damper mass. That and the flange setup the KJ has are the majro differences.

KJ disk brakes make a great bolt on setup for XJ 8.25 owners. I really ought to have added them to my 00 XJ by now........but thats another project.

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 Post subject: Re: Project MJ CRD is born:
PostPosted: Sat Feb 10, 2018 7:44 am 
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Sir Sam wrote:
thermorex wrote:
Sam, I watched the YouTube video, why don't you remove the gas tank, leave the axle the way it is, and see how it drives, you can temporarily run from a canister once you have the engine installed, and you can place a custom tank in the bed? I also wonder how the Cherokee's 8 1/4 corporate axle look like? I never seen a Cherokee one, but neither Dana 35 or 44 have any vibration damper (monkey balls), so I doubt they are needed. I speculate now, I wonder if the damper is to soften harsh acceleration, since liberty has a softer coil suspension (so the jeep would not tilt).

I'd still give a thought at having the fuel tank in the bed, regardless of axle fitting. Depending obviously on your restoration purpose...


Hey! Thanks for the sub!

I pulled the damper mass off and I have no clearance issue anymore, so no problem! I really don't think its needed in the leaf spring setup, maybe even not needed for the KJ, I would guess its just meant to smooth out driveline vibes or something or other.

That said I'm happy with where the tank is, the plan for this is a camping/overlanding rig so having it in the bed would be a nogo.

The XJ 8.25 has drum brakes, but the pumpkin is a little different, the casting changed in the KJ for the upper ball joint mount and the damper mass. That and the flange setup the KJ has are the majro differences.

KJ disk brakes make a great bolt on setup for XJ 8.25 owners. I really ought to have added them to my 00 XJ by now........but thats another project.


The disk break kit is a great upgrade for cherokee if you buy it used, I remember trying to upgrade my old cherokee and with new liberty disk kit I was maybe few bucks less than getting a new ready to bolt kit. Anyways, if you manage to put the 2.8 crd engine in, and considering you didn't go and not planning to go overboard modifying this MJ for offroad (so you keep it light), you may get a very economical fuel mileage. What do you plan to do with the gauges, use the liberty ones or go full custom? This was one of the main concerns I had when thinking to swap...

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 Post subject: Re: Project MJ CRD is born:
PostPosted: Sat Feb 10, 2018 11:30 am 
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thermorex wrote:
Sir Sam wrote:
thermorex wrote:
Sam, I watched the YouTube video, why don't you remove the gas tank, leave the axle the way it is, and see how it drives, you can temporarily run from a canister once you have the engine installed, and you can place a custom tank in the bed? I also wonder how the Cherokee's 8 1/4 corporate axle look like? I never seen a Cherokee one, but neither Dana 35 or 44 have any vibration damper (monkey balls), so I doubt they are needed. I speculate now, I wonder if the damper is to soften harsh acceleration, since liberty has a softer coil suspension (so the jeep would not tilt).

I'd still give a thought at having the fuel tank in the bed, regardless of axle fitting. Depending obviously on your restoration purpose...


Hey! Thanks for the sub!

I pulled the damper mass off and I have no clearance issue anymore, so no problem! I really don't think its needed in the leaf spring setup, maybe even not needed for the KJ, I would guess its just meant to smooth out driveline vibes or something or other.

That said I'm happy with where the tank is, the plan for this is a camping/overlanding rig so having it in the bed would be a nogo.

The XJ 8.25 has drum brakes, but the pumpkin is a little different, the casting changed in the KJ for the upper ball joint mount and the damper mass. That and the flange setup the KJ has are the majro differences.

KJ disk brakes make a great bolt on setup for XJ 8.25 owners. I really ought to have added them to my 00 XJ by now........but thats another project.


The disk break kit is a great upgrade for cherokee if you buy it used, I remember trying to upgrade my old cherokee and with new liberty disk kit I was maybe few bucks less than getting a new ready to bolt kit. Anyways, if you manage to put the 2.8 crd engine in, and considering you didn't go and not planning to go overboard modifying this MJ for offroad (so you keep it light), you may get a very economical fuel mileage. What do you plan to do with the gauges, use the liberty ones or go full custom? This was one of the main concerns I had when thinking to swap...


I will be using a 2002-2006 Jeep TJ Gauge cluster, its physically the same dimensions as the XJ gauge cluster, but with the XJ discontinued in 2001 the TJ saw updates in 2002. Part of that was switching the vehicle from CCD bus to PCI bus. Since the TJ cluster uses PCI bus it will talk to the KJ computers.

Image
Image

I need to goto a pick n pull to get some plugs to use this TJ cluster, I haven't powered it up yet and I haven't verified my plan will work. I need 2 KJ cluster plugs and 2 WJ cluster plugs, then I need to remove some pins from one plug and install into the plugs I will use with the TJ. The TJ plugs are FULL with no empty pins, the KJ plug is about 2/3 fulls.

That said I have previously tested using KJ clusters in WJs(at the same time as the WJ cluster was running) and tested using WJ clusters in KJs. So I think this should work out fine.

But I'm not quite to that point in the project, its going to be a few weeks before I can goto the junkyard to get the plugs I need. I am also writing a list of other stuff I need to get at the pick n pulls, little things, screws, bolts, etc.

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 Post subject: Re: Project MJ CRD is born:
PostPosted: Sat Feb 10, 2018 6:46 pm 
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Sir Sam wrote:

I will be using a 2002-2006 Jeep TJ Gauge cluster, its physically the same dimensions as the XJ gauge cluster, but with the XJ discontinued in 2001 the TJ saw updates in 2002. Part of that was switching the vehicle from CCD bus to PCI bus. Since the TJ cluster uses PCI bus it will talk to the KJ computers.

Image
Image

I need to goto a pick n pull to get some plugs to use this TJ cluster, I haven't powered it up yet and I haven't verified my plan will work. I need 2 KJ cluster plugs and 2 WJ cluster plugs, then I need to remove some pins from one plug and install into the plugs I will use with the TJ. The TJ plugs are FULL with no empty pins, the KJ plug is about 2/3 fulls.

That said I have previously tested using KJ clusters in WJs(at the same time as the WJ cluster was running) and tested using WJ clusters in KJs. So I think this should work out fine.

But I'm not quite to that point in the project, its going to be a few weeks before I can goto the junkyard to get the plugs I need. I am also writing a list of other stuff I need to get at the pick n pulls, little things, screws, bolts, etc.


Interesting, thanks for sharing! It's great bc I think you may be able to adapt a new cherokee dashboard (which also looks a bit better than old ones) with the tj gauges. It's going to be an interesting project but I see you're very determined, which is the key to finish it successfully.

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 Post subject: Re: Project MJ CRD is born:
PostPosted: Sun Feb 11, 2018 11:54 am 
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thermorex wrote:
I know you have your plans already but man, I would've mounted the leaf springs over the axle.


Hey, missed that post.

The reason I went with SUA was do to the height, the springs I got are the metric ton springs and have about 1" of lift. If I had gone spring over it would have been about 6" of lift over the spring under.

I wouldn't mind if it were a little higher, but with the lift shackles and springs right now I'd say its about 3-4 inches over stock.

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 Post subject: Re: Project MJ CRD is born:
PostPosted: Wed Feb 14, 2018 11:50 pm 
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Sir Sam wrote:
thermorex wrote:
I know you have your plans already but man, I would've mounted the leaf springs over the axle.


Hey, missed that post.

The reason I went with SUA was do to the height, the springs I got are the metric ton springs and have about 1" of lift. If I had gone spring over it would have been about 6" of lift over the spring under.

I wouldn't mind if it were a little higher, but with the lift shackles and springs right now I'd say its about 3-4 inches over stock.


Got it and it makes sense, 6 inch of lift, plus taller tires, could be a bit too much for what you want.

I realized after the post, when I saw some of your YouTube videos, that your leaf springs are visibly taller than the old ones. I also realize you need to compromise some offroad capabilities for street handling and fuel mileage. Still, 3-4 inch lift plus probably 31-32, maybe even 33 inch tires is not bad at all for overlanding, I'd say it's quite good. Way better than the 30-ish inch tires liberty can get with a safe lift (excluding sfa mod).

I can barely wait to see the end result!

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 Post subject: Re: Project MJ CRD is born:
PostPosted: Thu Feb 15, 2018 9:28 pm 
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thermorex wrote:
Sir Sam wrote:
thermorex wrote:
I know you have your plans already but man, I would've mounted the leaf springs over the axle.


Hey, missed that post.

The reason I went with SUA was do to the height, the springs I got are the metric ton springs and have about 1" of lift. If I had gone spring over it would have been about 6" of lift over the spring under.

I wouldn't mind if it were a little higher, but with the lift shackles and springs right now I'd say its about 3-4 inches over stock.


Got it and it makes sense, 6 inch of lift, plus taller tires, could be a bit too much for what you want.

I realized after the post, when I saw some of your YouTube videos, that your leaf springs are visibly taller than the old ones. I also realize you need to compromise some offroad capabilities for street handling and fuel mileage. Still, 3-4 inch lift plus probably 31-32, maybe even 33 inch tires is not bad at all for overlanding, I'd say it's quite good. Way better than the 30-ish inch tires liberty can get with a safe lift (excluding sfa mod).

I can barely wait to see the end result!


I could have gone for a stock replacement spring that would have been about 1" lower, which with a spring over would still have put me about 4" over where it is now.

The 245/75/16s I will be running will have plenty of flex without rubbing with my setup. The same size in a liberty rubs a little when flex and at full lock.

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 Post subject: Re: Project MJ CRD is born:
PostPosted: Thu Feb 15, 2018 9:36 pm 
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Freerider came over and helped me burn on the seat brackets. Note the copper weld through primer I put down. It's a conductive primer so that you don't leave something as bare steel once you weld over it.

Image
Image

After that I cleaned the floor with Acetone and got to work with the POR15:

Image
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 Post subject: Re: Project MJ CRD is born:
PostPosted: Sun Feb 18, 2018 11:22 am 
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Got the fuse box in place today and started laying out the interior harness's, The dash harness's and engine bay are easy enough to deal with since they pretty much sit in the same place for the MJ as the XJ. However the body harness is a little different, today I placed it in the cab as is and didn't like how it was working out since the harness was meant to work with the 4 door XJ.

I stripped out the rear door wiring for the courtesy light and power windows, as well as the rear overhead light wiring. I still need to pull out the speaker wiring, rear wiper, and defrost wiring. I also then need to figure out how to arrange the remainder of the rear light wiring. the plugs used at the back of the XJ behind the spare tire will reach part way, but are not weatherproof connectors so they really shouldn't be used under the bed as-is.

I stripped the harness wrap bare so I could move some things around, but I am attempting to avoid a million splices in the harness.

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 Post subject: Re: Project MJ CRD is born:
PostPosted: Sun Feb 18, 2018 11:26 am 
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Short video showing the interior harness work:


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L1IF-AF5pLQ

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 Post subject: Re: Project MJ CRD is born:
PostPosted: Mon Feb 26, 2018 9:29 pm 
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Longer video showing the engine bay harness work that needs to occur:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RX91ttWpfXQ

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 Post subject: Re: Project MJ CRD is born:
PostPosted: Mon Feb 26, 2018 9:29 pm 
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Tested the TJ gauge cluster finally!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xpO4isRTThs

However I thought the KJ plugs were the style I needed but it turned out they have more pins than the TJ, so I need to find the same connector type but with fewer pins to fit the TJ cluster.

Grrr, back to the junkyards to raid 15 year old Chryslers.

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 Post subject: Re: Project MJ CRD is born:
PostPosted: Tue Feb 27, 2018 2:23 pm 
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Sir Sam wrote:
Tested the TJ gauge cluster finally!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xpO4isRTThs

However I thought the KJ plugs were the style I needed but it turned out they have more pins than the TJ, so I need to find the same connector type but with fewer pins to fit the TJ cluster.

Grrr, back to the junkyards to raid 15 year old Chryslers.

Very good progress!!! :wink:

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 Post subject: Re: Project MJ CRD is born:
PostPosted: Wed Feb 28, 2018 8:44 pm 
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I made some progress on the TJ gauge cluster, I cannot seem to program less than 1000 miles, I suppose thats close enough to zero? I was just really looking forward to seeing it run up from zero. I might keep playing with it, I also want to figure out to reprogram the VIN.

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