LOST JEEPS :: View topic - Turbo backlash causing EGR to fail

A Diesel turbo charger does not have seals, like in a gasser (patooie!) turbo, because a Diesel does not develop vacuum in the intake - therefore there is no seal to wear out - Diesel shaft sealing is centrifugal\slinger and labyrinthine on the compressor end as Boost pressure is greater than oil pressure in the housing bore\full-floating bearing\shaft interface - on the turbine end is same labyrinthine\centrifugal, with addition of a piston-type ring in a ring-groove on the shaft, mainly to prevent hot exhaust gasses from entering the bearing area - thus, a Diesel turbo will also spool up quicker than the similar gasser (you know!) version - the main faliure resulting in oil leakage is bearing\shaft deterioration, usually from extended oil changes, sometimes from 'coking' - Diesel-rated oils are resistant to coking, where normal passenger car oils are not - soccer moms'n'dads are more likely to put Wally-world Equate oil in a Diesel, creating more incidence of failure - plus, if you've just reached the top of a 45* grade towing a trailer, immediately stopped and shut the engine down, you're likely to encourage intense coking in the bearing housing even with Diesel-rated oil, resulting in excessive oil leakage - one reason I like a mechanical EGT guage, direct TC connect: indicates cast-iron temperature long after the IGN is off

FYI: since the turbo is officially accepted as an exhaust muffler in most states, the term 'worn out muffler bearings' is no longer a laffing matter....................

Author:	Davesub [ Tue Jun 10, 2008 3:25 pm ]
Post subject:	Turbo backlash causing EGR to fail
So my wifes CRD at 24k miles had a new Turbo, EGR, intercooler, and boost sensor replaced. Nothing at that time did they say the Turbo had excessive backlash causing the EGR to plug up and fail. My CRD has 31k miles and I just got back from the dealer that said this: "Customer states check engine light is on. Verified concern. Tested and found codes P0299 and P0401. Inspected and found excessive oil in the intake system, turbo has excessive backlash causing EGR to get plugged with carbon also found boost sensor carboned up...Replaced turbo assy, throttle assy, EGR vavle assy, and boost sensor assy....Cleared codes....Test drove...No more light and all is working within specs at this time..." I had both Jeeps worked at the same dealer with the same "Tech" (I guess we dont call them mechanics anymore). When I brought mine in he just said we need to replace the EGR valve. I told him about my other Jeep and the service advisor pulled the paperwork and showed him all the stuff he replaced on my wifes jeep. I then said check all that same stuff on mine and then he said yeah lets just replace all of it. Im not sure if he actually knows what the hell he is doing or just throwing new parts at it in hope that the check engine light stays off. Either way i'll take a new turbo if your just gonna hand them out. While driving both jeeps there was no difference driving them with the CEL on. No hesitation or smoke, nothing. What concerns me is the excessive backlash causing EGR to get plugged up with carbon. With the SEGR installed can this still happen? Not sure if there actually was excessive backlash or he was just saying this to get chrysler to pay for it so they dont see my Jeep again for awhile. I just hope the SEGR will make this problem go away because its not if the EGR will fail its when the EGR fails. Seems like a class action lawsuit for lifetime warranty repair of this system because it is going to fail on you, just a matter of time.

Author:	crd liberty [ Tue Jun 10, 2008 4:04 pm ]
Post subject:
Dave The excessive oil is coming out of the CCV, which is dirtying up the Turbo, intercooler and hoses. The SEGR will not correct this problem. It will correct the EGR from opening but that is way back in the system. You need to redirect the oil from the CCV to the outside such as the EHM or the Provent type feature. It works, just try it Steve

Author:	BBB [ Tue Jun 10, 2008 7:47 pm ]
Post subject:
They replaced our turbo and CAC hoses under warranty also due to oil in the CAC (intercooler).... and who was I to complain EMH mod now in effect with no more nasty goop in the CAC and the hoses are not oil saturated. A simple 3/4" heater hose redirected downwards works great. At times you may notice some water vapor exiting the hose depending on the final exit area and a few drops of oil on the driveway if you don't have some sort of container at the end. Gravel driveways rule! We just don't take it to the dealer for the "free" state inspection anymore. I would always stress about putting all the mods back to factory specs including all of the heat blanket junk around they engine as they would inevitably coment about what was missing and write it up. Now it passes every time at the corner mechanic. Definitely worth the $$ to find a competant shop to do your non-warranty work.

Author:	nursecosmo [ Tue Jun 10, 2008 8:56 pm ]
Post subject:
That's a good one, excessive backlash. I guess that their customers finally caught on to "worn out muffler bearings"

Author:	CATCRD [ Wed Jun 11, 2008 12:03 am ]
Post subject:
nursecosmo wrote: That's a good one, excessive backlash. I guess that their customers finally caught on to "worn out muffler bearings" The dealer is probably talking about excessive turbo shaft endplay, which ruined a seal and let oil into the intake. It's not just the CCV on some of these Jeeps.

LOST JEEPS http://www.lostjeeps.com/forum/phpBB3/

Turbo backlash causing EGR to fail http://www.lostjeeps.com/forum/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=5&t=33184	Page 1 of 1

Author:	Diggerfreek [ Wed Jun 11, 2008 12:19 am ]
Post subject:
I like that....backlash.. CATCRD is correct, it was probably excessive shaft endplay

Author:	crdjon [ Sat Aug 23, 2008 1:07 am ]
Post subject:	Example of provent efficiency
crd liberty wrote: Dave The excessive oil is coming out of the CCV, which is dirtying up the Turbo, intercooler and hoses. The SEGR will not correct this problem. It will correct the EGR from opening but that is way back in the system. You need to redirect the oil from the CCV to the outside such as the EHM or the Provent type feature. It works, just try it Steve After a 2 week test with clear hoses, my provent now has a permanent home. (see pics) Gunked up hose from engine to provent, ungunked up hose returns to original inlet position. (Much Better)

Author:	gmctd [ Sat Aug 23, 2008 12:44 pm ]
Post subject:
A Diesel turbo charger does not have seals, like in a gasser (patooie!) turbo, because a Diesel does not develop vacuum in the intake - therefore there is no seal to wear out - Diesel shaft sealing is centrifugal\slinger and labyrinthine on the compressor end as Boost pressure is greater than oil pressure in the housing bore\full-floating bearing\shaft interface - on the turbine end is same labyrinthine\centrifugal, with addition of a piston-type ring in a ring-groove on the shaft, mainly to prevent hot exhaust gasses from entering the bearing area - thus, a Diesel turbo will also spool up quicker than the similar gasser (you know!) version - the main faliure resulting in oil leakage is bearing\shaft deterioration, usually from extended oil changes, sometimes from 'coking' - Diesel-rated oils are resistant to coking, where normal passenger car oils are not - soccer moms'n'dads are more likely to put Wally-world Equate oil in a Diesel, creating more incidence of failure - plus, if you've just reached the top of a 45* grade towing a trailer, immediately stopped and shut the engine down, you're likely to encourage intense coking in the bearing housing even with Diesel-rated oil, resulting in excessive oil leakage - one reason I like a mechanical EGT guage, direct TC connect: indicates cast-iron temperature long after the IGN is off FYI: since the turbo is officially accepted as an exhaust muffler in most states, the term 'worn out muffler bearings' is no longer a laffing matter....................

Author:	onthehunt [ Sun Aug 24, 2008 9:56 pm ]
Post subject:
Just be glad they didn't drill and tap a cleaning port in your turbo as they are doing for the new 6.7's to deal with the carbon and soot loading.

Author:	duelly [ Fri Sep 19, 2008 8:00 am ]
Post subject:
could all my egr failures be caused by partially plugged catylatic converter?

Author:	nursecosmo [ Sat Sep 20, 2008 1:40 am ]
Post subject:
duelly wrote: could all my egr failures be caused by partially plugged catylatic converter? No. If the cat is plugged to the point that it would affect the EGR, the turbo would not function either. Unless you drive no more than 1/4 mile each way on all your trips in the CRD, so that it never reaches operating temp, it is nearly impossible to plug.

Author:	nursecosmo [ Sun Sep 21, 2008 2:54 pm ]
Post subject:
gmctd wrote: A Diesel turbo charger does not have seals, like in a gasser (patooie!) turbo, because a Diesel does not develop vacuum in the intake - therefore there is no seal to wear out - Diesel shaft sealing is centrifugal\slinger and labyrinthine on the compressor end as Boost pressure is greater than oil pressure in the housing bore\full-floating bearing\shaft interface - on the turbine end is same labyrinthine\centrifugal, with addition of a piston-type ring in a ring-groove on the shaft, mainly to prevent hot exhaust gasses from entering the bearing area - thus, a Diesel turbo will also spool up quicker than the similar gasser (you know!) version - the main faliure resulting in oil leakage is bearing\shaft deterioration, usually from extended oil changes, sometimes from 'coking' - Diesel-rated oils are resistant to coking, where normal passenger car oils are not - soccer moms'n'dads are more likely to put Wally-world Equate oil in a Diesel, creating more incidence of failure - plus, if you've just reached the top of a 45* grade towing a trailer, immediately stopped and shut the engine down, you're likely to encourage intense coking in the bearing housing even with Diesel-rated oil, resulting in excessive oil leakage - one reason I like a mechanical EGT guage, direct TC connect: indicates cast-iron temperature long after the IGN is off FYI: since the turbo is officially accepted as an exhaust muffler in most states, the term 'worn out muffler bearings' is no longer a laffing matter.................... GM: I have not been able to get any data on whether our Garret M53 turbo is the ball bearing type like most of their small displacement units have, Or if it has the journal type bearings like the big boys. Do you have any input?

Author:	CATCRD [ Mon Sep 22, 2008 12:00 am ]
Post subject:
A little bit off topic, but I found this on ebay http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayI ... 0259840487 Only thought it was interesting because the seller claims to have replaced his turbo with a larger one.

Author:	Turbo Tim [ Mon Sep 22, 2008 10:44 am ]
Post subject:
Holy CRAP! $150.00 for shipping and handling PLUS the cost of the turbo? I can ship a full size tranny on a pallet for $50.00 across the US, but a little turbo for $150.00? Kiss my $^&……. He can keep it.

Author:	danoid [ Wed Sep 24, 2008 2:00 pm ]
Post subject:
Turbo backlash! That's good. Too many people are hip to 'muffler bearings' and 'blinker fluid' is too obvious. Lately I've been using the term 'friction thrusters' at work to see if anyone blinks...

Page 1 of 1	All times are UTC - 5 hours [ DST ]
Powered by phpBB © 2000, 2002, 2005, 2007 phpBB Group http://www.phpbb.com/

Author:	CATCRD [ Mon Sep 22, 2008 6:44 pm ]
Post subject:
Turbo Tim wrote: Holy CRAP! $150.00 for shipping and handling PLUS the cost of the turbo? I can ship a full size tranny on a pallet for $50.00 across the US, but a little turbo for $150.00? Kiss my $^&……. He can keep it. No kidding. No wonder why it didn't sell the first time it was listed.