Lift pump didn't save the original style fuel heater

Serendipity · **Joined:** Mon Nov 20, 2006 10:51 pm **Posts:** 45

Even with a lift pump, the original style fuel heater failed at the connector. This was my second OEM heater and never was powered until I put the lift pump in. I thought the lift pump might prevent such problems, but no such luck. :evil:

Hopefully the redesigned part will hold up. It should at least last until the warranty runs out. If it fails after that, I'll probably put in a Racor or other aftermarket.

Joe Romas · **Posted:** Thu Jul 23, 2009 6:21 pm

So I should start watching mine now :cry:

I agree with you totally about the warranty being worth anything :lol:

Serendipity · **Joined:** Mon Nov 20, 2006 10:51 pm **Posts:** 45

If I had it to do over, I'd pull the fuse until the weather gets freezing or below. Oh wait, I do have it to do over. :roll:

nursecosmo · **Posted:** Thu Jul 23, 2009 7:20 pm

Where do you live?

Serendipity · **Joined:** Mon Nov 20, 2006 10:51 pm **Posts:** 45

Specifics about location defeat the purpose of a pseudonym, so lets just say it snows here, but not often anymore. I assume you're trying to get an idea about how much use the heater gets?

warp2diesel · **Posted:** Thu Jul 23, 2009 10:00 pm

Only runs when it is cold out.

JL Rockies · **Posted:** Thu Jul 23, 2009 11:08 pm

That's lame.

CATCRD · **Posted:** Thu Jul 23, 2009 11:31 pm

Guys, I've said it before, but air in the heater puck is not what ruins the heater. It is a PTC (positive temperature coefficient) material heater coil, which means its own resistance increases in proportion to its own temperature. It does not care if the substance surrounding it is air or fuel! As it increases in temperature, the current flowing through it decreases and the coil's temperature levels off, no matter if you have it sitting on your workbench or submerged in fuel. Faulty manufacturing at the terminals is what causes overcurrent and burning.

nursecosmo · **Posted:** Fri Jul 24, 2009 1:58 am

CATCRD wrote:

Guys, I've said it before, but air in the heater puck is not what ruins the heater. It is a PTC (positive temperature coefficient) material heater coil, which means its own resistance increases in proportion to its own temperature. It does not care if the substance surrounding it is air or fuel! As it increases in temperature, the current flowing through it decreases and the coil's temperature levels off, no matter if you have it sitting on your workbench or submerged in fuel. Faulty manufacturing at the terminals is what causes overcurrent and burning.

A hot pin protruding into air will melt the plastic much sooner than one surrounded be fuel. As far as I know this is the first failure of a heater puck with a lift pump installed.

Does the new style heater have a different type of connection between the pins and heat sink? Goglio"s pic of his burnt puck shows heat originating at the pin/plate junction, not at the plug. Of course once the junction gets hot, the heat travels down the pin to the plastic body and melts it. http://img215.imageshack.us/i/1000330cp2.jpg/ This whole thread was pretty informative. http://www.lostjeeps.com/forum/phpBB3/vie ... r&start=20

Serendipity: could you possibly dissect the failed head and get some pics?

Serendipity · **Joined:** Mon Nov 20, 2006 10:51 pm **Posts:** 45

Yes, dissection is in this unit's future. I'll have to see about getting the picture hosted...

Joe Romas · **Posted:** Fri Jul 24, 2009 7:31 am

Serendipity wrote:

Yes, dissection is in this unit's future. I'll have to see about getting the picture hosted...

Photobucket is free and I find it easy to use. Also Micro Soft has a "power tool" that will resize your pictures but it DOES NOT work if your using VISTA :lol:

http://photobucket.com/

gmctd · **Posted:** Fri Jul 24, 2009 1:40 pm

FYI, the fuel heater is solid-state so the foregoing argument is null - consists of two lead-in wires crimped to two aluminum plates immersed (hopefully) in Diesel fuel - between the plates and held by simple dimensional tension are three solid-state 'coins', with specific coefficient of temperature properties, which heat when dc current is passed thru the coins via the wire\plate junctions - high-resistance when warm, low-resistance when cold, the coins not heat above ~45deg - the failure is in the two joints where the aluminum is crimped around the heat-proof wire - deterioration results in a resistive area(s) prior to the designed temperature-coefficient resistance heater coins between the plates, a resistance(s) which has no temperature coefficient, therefore proceeds to merrily toast the thermo-plastic surround, compromising the hermetic seal - if the designed plate-to-coin contact tension fails due to aluminum warpage, another non-tc resistive junction(s) develops, resulting in even more heat thru the aluminum plates to the aluminum-crimped lead-in wires - failure appears to be a design function......................

nursecosmo · **Posted:** Fri Jul 24, 2009 1:47 pm

gmctd wrote:

FYI, the fuel heater is solid-state so the foregoing argument is null - consists of two lead-in wires crimped to two aluminum plates immersed (hopefully) in Diesel fuel - between the plates and held by simple dimensional tension are three solid-state 'coins', with specific coefficient of temperature properties, which heat when dc current is passed thru the coins via the wire\plate junctions - high-resistance when warm, low-resistance when cold, the coins not heat above ~45deg - the failure is in the two joints where the aluminum is crimped around the heat-proof wire - deterioration results in a resistive area(s) prior to the designed temperature-coefficient resistance heater coins between the plates, a resistance(s) which has no temperature coefficient, therefore proceeds to merrily toast the thermo-plastic surround, compromising the hermetic seal - if the designed plate-to-coin contact tension fails due to aluminum warpage, another non-tc resistive junction(s) develops, resulting in even more heat thru the aluminum plates to the aluminum-crimped lead-in wires - failure appears to be a design function......................

That was already established a long time ago by your show and tell thread here. http://www.lostjeeps.com/forum/phpBB3/vie ... r&start=20
My question was regarding the new, redesigned head. Does it have an improved pin/plate junction. or does it just have a beefed up plastic connector area?

gmctd · **Posted:** Sat Jul 25, 2009 2:41 am

True, but catcrd musta missed it.................

CATCRD · **Posted:** Sat Jul 25, 2009 3:43 pm

gmctd wrote:

True, but catcrd musta missed it.................

Nooo, I actually posted in that thread.

gmctd · **Posted:** Sat Jul 25, 2009 6:52 pm

No prob, then, just a refresher to positively negate probability of any heater coils in the fuel manager heater..................

vegiH · **Posted:** Mon Jul 27, 2009 12:46 pm

Got the air in filter head issue,heres how it happened.Truck shop swapped out fuel filter when doing all the work(2 micron),three weeks later(100 miles use on #2 ) she failed to start,pop the hood fuel all around top of filter,seems to be leaking at union of heater puck and where the filter screws in.With this vacuum set-up could this have been so restrictive that it is sucking air around seal causing fuel leak?I have since put the napa filter back on and it starts without prime 2 out of 5 tries.Should I replace with a racor 245 without a lift pump or new oem with kennedy lift pump? Weren't these units recalled because they are prone to leaks ?I also have a 55-60 MPH stumble now

CATCRD · **Posted:** Mon Jul 27, 2009 3:02 pm

Check that the bleed screw is tight and heater plug is not leaking either. Leaks at either place will accumulate at the filter rim.

nursecosmo · **Posted:** Mon Jul 27, 2009 6:44 pm

LP it. It is the single most important mod you can make to your Jeep.

vegiH · **Posted:** Tue Jul 28, 2009 11:36 pm

I only run #2 to start and warm-up,then switched to seperate pump for WVO.I never get hiccups on WVO,so I know that it helps.But don't want two fuel pumps run off timer cards or key-on cofiguration.I was thinking one of the big fused TT style with illumunation.Any thought on cycling issues or shortened life of pump?Or your own set-ups...................................H

Lift pump didn't save the original style fuel heater

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