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Rear Brake time on the CRD
http://www.lostjeeps.com/forum/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=5&t=34327		 Page 1 of 3
Author:  jinstall [ Tue Jul 22, 2008 6:47 am ]
Post subject:  Rear Brake time on the CRD
OK I need new brakes on the rear, funny this is the first time for me that the rears went before the fronts. Maybe because of the ESC? Anyway I am looking for good brake rotors and pads for the rear. I wanted DBA's but they only come for the fronts. Brembo does not make the MAX's for the rear. I am still looking for Ferodo pads in DS2000 or DS2500. I would like directional slotted rotors for the rear. Does anyone else have any ideas? I really want to put the most aggressive pad in the rear I can find. I am not sure if Pagid makes any yellows for the rear. Oh an dpleas do not suggest EBC, I will never use their products again.
Author:  SBosco [ Tue Jul 22, 2008 2:22 pm ]
Post subject: 
It still doesn't make sense that the rears wore down before the fronts. Very atypical, regardless of ESC. I would check your brake bias, it may be off.

How many miles do you have on them?

My brother had a '99 Z28 Camaro which he autocrossed and drove pretty hard. He grew sick of his front EBC pads as well.

At the time I was working at an auto parts store and ordered him a set of Satisfied GranSport Carbon Ceramic pads (GS5). He loved them...said they were quieter, dusted less, bit harder, stopped better, and gave better pedal feel. He also liked that they didn't have to be heated up to perform well.

Unfortunately, Satisfied only makes the GranSport Carbon Ceramic pads for the fronts on the Liberty. I was impressed as a whole with Satisfied and would be willing to give their other lines a try. They do offer their Pro Performance and Pro Ceramic lines for the Liberty rears. The latter of which are supposed to be corrosion-free, provide increased friction, and low dust.

http://www.satisfiedbrakes.com/

Aside from that, I think you are going to have a difficult time finding true performance pads for the rears. Lets face it, we have Jeeps not Porsches.

In all probability, the difference you would feel would barely be noticeable by adding an aggressive pad to the rears. The fronts do most of the braking and are much more substantial for that very reason.

A good deal of the cars I have worked on have had the front pads replaced several times (2-3) before needing the rears done. Like I said before, I would have the brake bias checked.
Author:  SBosco [ Tue Jul 22, 2008 2:29 pm ]
Post subject: 
ATE makes both front and rear rotors in their PremiumOne line. It features their patented eliptical slotted design, and is supposed to be one of the better rotors available.

http://www.ate-na.com/generator/www/us/en/ate/ate/themes/20_ate_brake_products/1_rotors_us.html
Author:  jinstall [ Tue Jul 22, 2008 5:50 pm ]
Post subject: 
ATE is abundant here. It is the "norm" for replacement.

Well if you drive on th eedge like I do the ESC brake more the rear than the front to keep the rotation of the vehicle down. I auto-x the jeep again this weekend and you can feel/hear the ESC kick in with it turned off. Also if you drive off road witht eh esc on the it will grab the rear brakes when it reads slippage in the rear wheels. This is th ereason for the excessive wear on the rear with only 43,000 miles. Mind you I am also on my 3rd set of tires as well. I had EBC Reds on Brembo MAX rotors and they were metal to backing plate in 1500 miles.
Author:  Goglio704 [ Tue Jul 22, 2008 6:33 pm ]
Post subject: 
05 models without ESC exhibit fast rear brake wear also. To some extent, it is just the nature of the beast. I'm sure, ESC does make it worse though.
Author:  MOSFET [ Tue Jul 22, 2008 8:34 pm ]
Post subject: 
Just had the oil changed on my CRD (38,000 miles) and the front brakes were at 70% and the rears were at 30%.
Author:  SBosco [ Tue Jul 22, 2008 8:40 pm ]
Post subject: 
Wow, thats odd. But good to know..I should anticipate replacing the rear pads soon for mine as well.
Author:  onthehunt [ Wed Jul 23, 2008 2:33 am ]
Post subject: 
It's a normal occurance. Rear discs eat alot more road grime. Didn't GM go back to rear drum brakes on their new trucks?
Author:  Uffe [ Wed Jul 23, 2008 4:55 am ]
Post subject: 
onthehunt wrote:
It's a normal occurance. Rear discs eat alot more road grime. Didn't GM go back to rear drum brakes on their new trucks?


That sounds like a step back from rear discs IMO...
Author:  DDom [ Wed Jul 23, 2008 7:50 am ]
Post subject: 
does size of pad and rotors have some relevance? and what about the bias or brake proportioning ratio? is there something up with all of this?
Author:  SBosco [ Wed Jul 23, 2008 8:15 am ]
Post subject: 
DDom wrote:
what about the bias or brake proportioning ratio? is there something up with all of this?


That's what I was trying to suggest before. Unless the ESC is kicking on that frequently, it still doesn't make sense that the rears should wear out that quickly. It seems like it's a widespread KJ issue. So maybe the brake bias (set from the factory) is either incorrectly favoring the rear, or just not favoring the front enough.
Author:  DDom [ Wed Jul 23, 2008 8:32 am ]
Post subject: 
what is the remedy?
Author:  jinstall [ Wed Jul 23, 2008 2:37 pm ]
Post subject: 
SBosco wrote:
DDom wrote:
what about the bias or brake proportioning ratio? is there something up with all of this?


That's what I was trying to suggest before. Unless the ESC is kicking on that frequently, it still doesn't make sense that the rears should wear out that quickly. It seems like it's a widespread KJ issue. So maybe the brake bias (set from the factory) is either incorrectly favoring the rear, or just not favoring the front enough.


My ESC comes on alot.
Author:  SBosco [ Wed Jul 23, 2008 2:54 pm ]
Post subject: 
jinstall wrote:
My ESC comes on alot.


LOL, I suppose it would if you're autocrossing the KJ and racing it on the Nürburgring. BTW, what was it like taking a CRD KJ on the Nürburgring? You do have the manual transmission, correct? I couldn't imagine taking my automatic CRD on any race circuit...not enough control.
Author:  dog_party [ Wed Jul 23, 2008 3:48 pm ]
Post subject: 
My rears were toast at 40k too. No ESP here. Fronts still have a little life left, but they'll be swapped in less than a month. Left rear wore faster than anything, that's for sure.

Can't help you on good performance replacements. I got Autozone warranties rotors and pads. Happy with them so far, but nothing above stock. Good luck on your hunt.
Author:  SBosco [ Wed Jul 23, 2008 4:26 pm ]
Post subject: 
Most of the vehicles I have worked on have been...how should I phrase it?...less off-road oriented. So maybe my experiences with what I am considering "traditional" brake bias and "normal" wear do not apply to vehicles built with off-road capability in mind.

Sure, on the pavement, the front tires will have plenty of traction to hold under moderate to heavy braking. This transfers the momentum to the front of the vehicle, compressing the front suspension and consequently increasing the contact area of the front tires. With more contact area on the front 2 wheels and less on the rear, the brake bias for road-going vehicles is modeled for this scenario (~70/30, front to rear).

However, on SUVs and off-road vehicles, the story is quite different. Off pavement there is much less friction, causing the front two wheels to either lock up and skid or the earth underneath them to deform. Under these conditions, it is impossible for that load to transfer as effectively to the front wheels and significantly increase the surface patch of the front tires. Therefore the brake bias is appropriately closer to 50/50 front to rear distribution.

Of course, this is all speculation and generalization. But it seems to make sense to me.
Author:  dog_party [ Wed Jul 23, 2008 4:51 pm ]
Post subject: 
Doesn't the parking brake on our KJs only activate the rear? Maybe that has something to do with the quicker wear out back. Improperly adjusted parking brake....maybe?
Author:  Threeweight [ Wed Jul 23, 2008 6:15 pm ]
Post subject: 
I think the rear calipers are more prone to sticking for some reason.
Author:  SBosco [ Thu Jul 24, 2008 4:40 am ]
Post subject: 
dog_party wrote:
Doesn't the parking brake on our KJs only activate the rear? Maybe that has something to do with the quicker wear out back. Improperly adjusted parking brake....maybe?


The parking brake on all automobiles is linked to the rear brakes only.
Author:  dog_party [ Thu Jul 24, 2008 11:35 am ]
Post subject: 
Well, there you have it (shrug). So much for that idea.
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