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Diesel Dual Fuel, with anhydrous ammonia!!!
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Author:  Ripple [ Fri Oct 17, 2008 9:12 pm ]
Post subject:  Diesel Dual Fuel, with anhydrous ammonia!!!
a guy showed me an article in the most recent motor trend on using ammonia as a motor fuel in a spark ignition engine. so i did a search and found this AWSOME idea. they simply had something as simple ball vale meter ammonia vapor into the engine, post turbo (since ammonia will vaporize in the tank and travel as a vapor to the engine at ~150PSI) and were able to replace up to 90% of the diesel while maintaining torque. cuts back on C02 output since "NH3" has no "C "in it.

a few problem with the idea though, if you buy a lot of anhydrous ammonia at the farmer's coop (if they will even sell it to you), the sherrif will think your making drugs in a mobile lab (the jeep). anhydrous ammonia is toxic, lethal in certain doses (say a leak in a confined garage) and pretty nasty smelling stuff. it attacks zinc and copper alloys so you cannot put it in "regular" DOT approved propane tanks with brass valves.

I could not find out how much it costs per gallon, but if its less than ~$3.00/gallon it could pay for itself in a few years, hold me over untill the Chevy volt comes out.

http://pubs.acs.org/cgi-bin/abstract.cg ... 0140f.html

I looked at this article at work and I could read it, but at home I could not. its weird website they must have checked my IP to see if my company was a paid member of the website. for a mortal it cost $25 to read the 9 pages, I have it downloaded to my work laptop.
Author:  danoid [ Fri Oct 17, 2008 10:09 pm ]
Post subject: 
Not worth the police attention in my opinion. We just had the National Propane Board e-mail bounced around at work. Effin meth! I can't even buy sudafed without state intervention. (or is it effin government?)
Author:  tulsa [ Fri Oct 17, 2008 10:28 pm ]
Post subject: 
danoid wrote:
Not worth the police attention in my opinion. We just had the National Propane Board e-mail bounced around at work. Effin meth! I can't even buy sudafed without state intervention. (or is it effin government?)


It is effin drug dealers.
Author:  nursecosmo [ Fri Oct 17, 2008 10:52 pm ]
Post subject: 
Using amonia releases copius amounts of CO2 at the manufacturing plant where it is made from natural gas.
Author:  MNKK [ Fri Oct 17, 2008 10:56 pm ]
Post subject: 
tulsa wrote:
danoid wrote:
Not worth the police attention in my opinion. We just had the National Propane Board e-mail bounced around at work. Effin meth! I can't even buy sudafed without state intervention. (or is it effin government?)


It is effin drug dealers.


Not the dealers, the makers.
Author:  kdlewis1975 [ Sat Oct 18, 2008 12:10 am ]
Post subject: 
...I'd also suspect that the ammonia would be corrosive to our other metal parts and such. Not to mention that even tiny leaks would do a number on electrical contacts and computer systems. Though I just read a blurb about this, and while they state that N2 and H2O are the only byproducts, I suspect that NOx results from this too. The process for making ammonia is quite energy intensive. One of the "holy grails" in chemistry is to find a high yield alternative to the Haber process for converting N2 to ammonia...there are professors who build their careers around either finding catalysts that can do this...and well, they're still using the Haber process. It's a compelling idea, but it seems that it would introduce more problems than it solves.
Author:  warp2diesel [ Sat Oct 18, 2008 8:00 am ]
Post subject:  Rather than convert natural gass to amonia....
...just burn it direct. Many stationary Diesel engines run on dual fuel where the diesel is the ignition source and the natural gas is the secondary fuel source.
First lets look at the bottom line: 1 therm = 100,000 BTU factor in the cost of compressing the natural gas down to a liquid form so it can be transported and where you are going to put the tank.
Now calculate your cost and compare to the cost of Diesel fuel that produces 136,000 to 140,000 BTUs per gallon.
Getting back to anhydrous ammonia, Farmers put it on the land because the grain buyers want volume more than nutrition. Putting anhydrous ammonia produces a lot of empty calories that produce more bushels per acre. The extra bushels can have feed supplements added and fed to livestock to produce meat cheaper than putting the minerals into the soil and having more nutritious grains produced. Putting on anhydrous ammonia even though it takes a lot of energy to make it is cheaper than using other means to get more yield.
Do the dead tree huggers blame this for the CO2, no they blame our SUVs.
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