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My Ownership Experience --- One year later
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Author:  droptop [ Wed Jun 23, 2010 9:23 pm ]
Post subject:  My Ownership Experience --- One year later

Having grown up on a farm, I always liked diesels, the smell, the power, and as a child I particularly liked how the rain cap on my Uncles big Oliver tractor bounced. When Jeep announce the CRD back in ’04 I was in the market for a new vehicle and wanted one only to be told that it wasn’t available in New York because we had to live by the rules of the fruits and nuts of California, so I ended up with a ’04 gas Liberty to replace my Cherokee, which was OK but nothing special. A couple of years later I found a ’05 CRD on Ebay with only 12K miles which had to be mine. Over the two years that I owned the CRD I kept track of all of the fuel and the price of the diesel along with the price of gas at each fill up to be able to compare the cost of driving the CRD vs. a gas.

Over the span of 22919 miles I used 1037 gallons of diesel for a 22.09 mpg average. When I ran the $ numbers vs. a gas Liberty and I assumed 17 mpg for the gasser I ended up saving a meager $288 in two years due to the higher price of diesel.

The thing that drove me to get rid of the CRD was it was a little TOO unique. Since they weren’t originally sold in NY, none of the dealers had parts, the local parts depot didn’t have parts, so everything had to come from a regional depot. That meant if I took it in for service on a Monday, I wouldn’t get it back until Thursday, assuming that the problem was correctly diagnosed. I was lucky in that respect because my local C D J dealer sells a ton of Cummins Rams, so the CRD didn’t scare them, but it did get a test drive when I only took it in for them to shut off the auto locking doors (just to make sure that they didn’t lock :lol: ).

I only had a couple of problems under warranty, a MAP sensor and a turbo actuator. But having decided to sell it I put it on Craigslist where I sold it to a young girl from the mid west whose father had a diesel pump. I hope she likes it.

Replacing the CRD wasn’t as easy as I had originally thought. I fully expected to buy another Liberty. After looking at new ones, I thought they looked cheap and tacky. I wanted something made in the US and was surprised to find that the domestic content of the ’09 liberty was only 61%. I looked at the Wrangler, but decided it really didn’t fit my needs that well. Chevy Trailblazer- out of production, Ford Explorer – expensive and very few at dealers, Ford Escape – not much towing capacity and friends had problems with theirs. Finally a friend suggested a Nissan Xterra. Not really wanting a foreign made SUV I was hesitant, but went to the dealer to find that it was made in Tennessee, and the domestic content was only 1% less than the Liberty at 60%

After owning it for a year I really am happy with every aspect of the Xterra (but I still can't figure out what to use the roof storage compartment for) and average 18 mpg, and on long trips, regularly get over 21.5 mpg. With 260hp it’s a lot more sporting to drive and wish that I had not gone for the CRD experience. I definitely am not put off by diesel, only the CRD, in fact my next car will likely be a Jetta TDI (a diesel that isn't that rare) at 41mpg.

Being Unique is not necessarily a good thing, especially if you break down by the side of the road.

Thanks to all that contribute to this site for the great info on the CRD's and Best of luck to all that have CRD’s, but to those thinking about buying one, my advice is to ….. Think hard and long before taking the plunge.

Author:  racertracer [ Wed Jun 23, 2010 10:58 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: My Ownership Experience --- One year later

I believe that one must be called to own a Jeep Liberty CRD, 2.8 Liter Intercooled Turbo Diesel.

Author:  bugnout [ Wed Jun 23, 2010 11:38 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: My Ownership Experience --- One year later

racertracer wrote:
I believe that one must be called to own a Jeep Liberty CRD, 2.8 Liter Intercooled Turbo Diesel.


That explains the voices in my head :dizzy:

Author:  Silverdiesel [ Wed Jun 23, 2010 11:52 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: My Ownership Experience --- One year later

Good write up by the OP and I respect his opinions and findings but:

Smelley, Smokey, Oily, clanky, Slow, Heavy, wastefull using oil as a fuel......

Yeah that's a diesel and we all know modern light diesels are NOT that at all and I got bit by the bug and will never own another gasser!

100,000 miles on the Odo and 'got 200K to go!

Roland

Author:  CIMARRON13 [ Thu Jun 24, 2010 11:18 am ]
Post subject:  Re: My Ownership Experience --- One year later

droptop wrote:
(but I still can't figure out what to use the roof storage compartment for)

The only use I have heard from friends who own them is for wet towels and bathing suits.

Author:  flash7210 [ Thu Jun 24, 2010 12:12 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: My Ownership Experience --- One year later

The difficulties you mentioned although frustrating are not unique to NY.
My local dealer doesn't stock CRD parts either and I know they sold at least half a dozen CRDs.

Author:  droptop [ Thu Jun 24, 2010 7:36 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: My Ownership Experience --- One year later

CIMARRON13 wrote:
droptop wrote:
(but I still can't figure out what to use the roof storage compartment for)

The only use I have heard from friends who own them is for wet towels and bathing suits.

Everyone says the same things "Wet towels and bathing suits or muddy shoes" but how often do YOU have the need to use any of these? I wanted to put a lock on storage lid so I could put my tow strap up there, but couldn't find a replacement latch.

Author:  AZKJ [ Fri Jun 25, 2010 9:34 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: My Ownership Experience --- One year later

Silverdiesel wrote:
Good write up by the OP and I respect his opinions and findings but:

Smelley, Smokey, Oily, clanky, Slow, Heavy, wastefull using oil as a fuel......

Yeah that's a diesel and we all know modern light diesels are NOT that at all and I got bit by the bug and will never own another gasser!

100,000 miles on the Odo and 'got 200K to go!

Roland

What about the OP's comment on fuel savings, which wasn't all that much?? Then toss in the little quirks and problems associated with the CRD AND the expense of the timing belt change at 100K. Do you really think the CRD is worth the aggravation?? I don't.

Author:  stoutdog [ Fri Jun 25, 2010 9:46 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: My Ownership Experience --- One year later

AZKJ wrote:
Silverdiesel wrote:
Good write up by the OP and I respect his opinions and findings but:

Smelley, Smokey, Oily, clanky, Slow, Heavy, wastefull using oil as a fuel......

Yeah that's a diesel and we all know modern light diesels are NOT that at all and I got bit by the bug and will never own another gasser!

100,000 miles on the Odo and 'got 200K to go!

Roland

What about the OP's comment on fuel savings, which wasn't all that much?? Then toss in the little quirks and problems associated with the CRD AND the expense of the timing belt change at 100K. Do you really think the CRD is worth the aggravation?? I don't.


If you figure 17mpg for a gasser, like the OP does, then I'm getting an average of 12mpg more with my CRD. I get nearly 240 more miles per tank at that rate (580 vs. 340), for a savings of $35-40 per fill up (figuring a fillup of 20 gallons). That is 172 fillups every 100k miles, for a savings of just over $6k. That more than makes up for changing the timing belt, which I plan to do myself for cheap.

Even figuring a generous 22mpg for a gasser, my savings are still significant.

Author:  tjkj2002 [ Fri Jun 25, 2010 10:53 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: My Ownership Experience --- One year later

stoutdog wrote:
AZKJ wrote:
Silverdiesel wrote:
Good write up by the OP and I respect his opinions and findings but:

Smelley, Smokey, Oily, clanky, Slow, Heavy, wastefull using oil as a fuel......

Yeah that's a diesel and we all know modern light diesels are NOT that at all and I got bit by the bug and will never own another gasser!

100,000 miles on the Odo and 'got 200K to go!

Roland

What about the OP's comment on fuel savings, which wasn't all that much?? Then toss in the little quirks and problems associated with the CRD AND the expense of the timing belt change at 100K. Do you really think the CRD is worth the aggravation?? I don't.


If you figure 17mpg for a gasser, like the OP does, then I'm getting an average of 12mpg more with my CRD. I get nearly 240 more miles per tank at that rate (580 vs. 340), for a savings of $35-40 per fill up (figuring a fillup of 20 gallons). That is 172 fillups every 100k miles, for a savings of just over $6k. That more than makes up for changing the timing belt, which I plan to do myself for cheap.

Even figuring a generous 22mpg for a gasser, my savings are still significant.

All that only applies to stock vs stock,and a stock 3.7 get's far better then 17mpg,my SFA KJ get's 17mpg and is a whole lot more fun then your CRD.

Look at all the mods you needed to do just to get it not to self destruct,don't hide it I'm reading them in your sigs.No MAP sensor to clean,no EGR to fail,no turbo to explode,no boost hoses failing,no alt coupler to fail,no timing belt to change ever(my timing chains are rated for 300k of normal service),my trans does not shudder(same trans as you but no 2nd OD) but yeah I got to spend $12 a year for new spark plugs that take 30mins to change(I change mine every year regardless of miles).

Author:  stoutdog [ Fri Jun 25, 2010 11:46 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: My Ownership Experience --- One year later

tjkj2002 wrote:
Look at all the mods you needed to do just to get it not to self destruct,don't hide it I'm reading them in your sigs.No MAP sensor to clean,no EGR to fail,no turbo to explode,no boost hoses failing,no alt coupler to fail,no timing belt to change ever(my timing chains are rated for 300k of normal service),my trans does not shudder(same trans as you but no 2nd OD) but yeah I got to spend $12 a year for new spark plugs that take 30mins to change(I change mine every year regardless of miles).

Fair enough, I'm not hiding a thing :SOMBRERO: . Cleaning the MAP was free and easy, and I have none of the other issues that you mentioned, except the timing belt. Even the preventative stuff totals up to around $700 (Samcos, fuel head, GDE), the rest is pure fun... and, pre-tune, I was getting 29 hwy/24 city. In more than a year of ownership, the only thing I've ever "had" to do is replace one of my window regulators with the Steiger part.

Different for different folks... I know there are plenty of CRD owners on here who have had a host of problems; others are running basically stock with no issues. I also know multiple gasser owners in my area who, upon learning of my CRD, wished they had known about it before because of the better mileage that I get. To each his own though: for me, fun is the torque that I can produce, the ability to tow as I move around the country, and the ability to carry my gear to the lake/trailhead, all while getting better mileage than nearly any other SUV on the road. Heavy off-roading isn't my thing... but again, to each his own. :)

Author:  jeep4life7 [ Sat Jun 26, 2010 12:19 am ]
Post subject:  Re: My Ownership Experience --- One year later

if your saying that you save money on gas that sucks cuz im my town riverton wy desel is cheaper. but i have a gasser darn haha

Author:  droptop [ Sun Jun 27, 2010 11:22 am ]
Post subject:  Re: My Ownership Experience --- One year later

If I had been getting 29 MPG, I'd probably kept the CRD, but for me the savings just weren't enough to justify the extra attention that the CRD requires. The 17MPG used in my calculations was what I had been getting on my previous gas Liberty. My daily commute is about 20 mi of open country road that I set the cc at 63 where I ignore the Troopers and Sheriffs, and they ignore me. I still only got 22mpg

Author:  JL Rockies [ Sun Jun 27, 2010 11:28 am ]
Post subject:  Re: My Ownership Experience --- One year later

I have more fun with my CRD than anyone I know with a gasser and it being diesel automatically makes it cool even without SFA.

Author:  fastRob [ Sun Jun 27, 2010 12:41 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: My Ownership Experience --- One year later

In this case 2 years later.
I wanted a JK Unlimited with a Cummings diesel.
Ended up with a KJ with an Italian diesel.
Actually, being a bit of a doom and gloomer (Time to Invest In Stocks to Get Rich, NOT!!!) I just wanted to have a second fuel vehicle that does about 25 mpg. Kerosene will store for 10 years with treatment. Waste veggie oil can be processed into fuel. #2 fuel oil can be used in a pinch, now I know that is illegal and would never use it.
But, if Obammy manages to shut down those oil fields in the gulf, 30% of domestic supply, we are screwed.
We are screwed anyway being on the fast track to a fourth world country.
We have a few hundred gallons of fuel right handy in the oil tank if the poop hit the rotating blades.
But why not an American diesel in an American vehicle?

Author:  dieseldoesit [ Sun Jun 27, 2010 1:32 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: My Ownership Experience --- One year later

fastRob wrote:
But, if Obammy manages to shut down those oil fields in the gulf, 30% of domestic supply, we are screwed.

30%??? How would we get screwed? Oil price depends upon the global market price of oil... Domestic and imports a like.

Author:  LibertyCRD [ Sun Jun 27, 2010 2:32 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: My Ownership Experience --- One year later

16-17 MPG is all our gas KJ would average BONE STOCK.

Almost all CRDs are averaging 24. That's a big difference.

But yes...upkeep is WAY more on these and it kills any savings a the pump. Why do we drive them? Because my CRD laughs at a 7,000 lb trailer. And that same trailer would have killed our gas KJ.

Gas KJ is way more fun? :ROTFL: Not by a long shot.

Author:  fastRob [ Sun Jun 27, 2010 6:28 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: My Ownership Experience --- One year later

dieseldoesit wrote:
fastRob wrote:
But, if Obammy manages to shut down those oil fields in the gulf, 30% of domestic supply, we are screwed.

30%??? How would we get screwed? Oil price depends upon the global market price of oil... Domestic and imports a like.

Do you think that the amount of fuel in the often mentioned fuel inventories does not reflect on prices?
Fuel supply up, prices down, Fuel inventory down, prices up.
Remember Katrina? Storm wrecked production, fuel supplies way down, prices went way up.

Author:  dieseldoesit [ Sun Jun 27, 2010 6:39 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: My Ownership Experience --- One year later

fastRob wrote:
dieseldoesit wrote:
fastRob wrote:
But, if Obammy manages to shut down those oil fields in the gulf, 30% of domestic supply, we are screwed.

30%??? How would we get screwed? Oil price depends upon the global market price of oil... Domestic and imports a like.

Do you think that the amount of fuel in the often mentioned fuel inventories does not reflect on prices?
Fuel supply up, prices down, Fuel inventory down, prices up.
Remember Katrina? Storm wrecked production, fuel supplies way down, prices went way up.

It didn't do much to the overall supply of oil. It did do a lot to the refineries and production of gasoline from the oil. That is my take on it anyways.

Author:  black dog [ Wed Jun 30, 2010 11:35 am ]
Post subject:  Re: My Ownership Experience --- One year later

Tjkj, if you think your gasser is superior to the crd, then why are you planning an engine swap? How many of us diesel boys are planning a swap? Your statement of us needing to mod is no different than the tj or jk crowd making fun of us for needing to modify for wheeling, Wouldn't you agree Mr sfa? Don't get twisted, I like your jeep but if I were to buy a gasser it wouldn't be a kj. I await your booty chewing. :-)r

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