No Start problem

cmpbiker · **Joined:** Mon Mar 29, 2010 1:26 pm **Posts:** 62

I have had problems with my serpentine tension-er, tried to fix it but kept losing the belt. I ordered up a new tension-er today after noticing the belt was once again shifting off the pulleys. Walked out of the office and it will not start. It cranks and starts to rumble but I only get a sporadic ignition then it just cranks. Sounds like a flooded gasser. The only different thing I have done is run it with out the plastic cover over the top. What could I have knocked loose or beat up in the process of loosening up the tension and sliding the belt back on the pulley? The fuel system pumps up in 2 pumps.

Kind of reaching that limit that we hear of.......

tonycrd · **Posted:** Fri Apr 27, 2012 4:38 pm

First, you don't need a new tensioner. The wheel on the tensioner is held with a bolt. The wheel is the exact same as other ones on the engine, which are much cheaper then a complete tensioner. See this: http://www.ifsjeepers.com/phpBB3/viewto ... f=24&t=123

Now, for the no start, removing the cover shouldn't mess up anything. Unless you broke the connector on the rail pressure sensor..

geordi · **Posted:** Fri Apr 27, 2012 4:53 pm

One of the pulleys has to be out of alignment for the belt to continue wandering. Check all of them, and see which one feels the loosest. Also check on the 3 alternator bolts, I actually had one of mine sheared off and a second one almost halfway gone. How they got that way, I have no idea.

papaindigo · **Posted:** Sat Apr 28, 2012 9:14 am

Lets back up slightly. 1st symptom appears to be "losing" the belt which I presume means the belt came off its track not that the belt came appart and 2n and newest symptom is no start.

The serp belt tensioner has a pulley with a bearing which, as tonycrd notes, can be replaced independently from the whole tensioner assembly. If that bearing failed then it could cause an alignment problem that would cause the belt to come off track. However, it is possible for the tensioner itself to fail and IIRC "lean" into or toward the adjacent power steering pulley, I presume the lean is most visible without the belt installed but I do not know that for sure. In the later case the belt could also come off and the whole tensioner needs to be replaced.

geordi is correct with respect to something being out of alignment (bolts included) and it's certainly worth pulling the belt and checking all of the checkable bearings (idlers, alternator, etc) for any more than just the slightest bit of play. In addition look for bearings that are weeping grease. However, before doing that with the serp belt installed and the plastic cover removed crank the engine up or at least spin it over and while it's spinning look down the serp belt from the driver's side and see if the serp tensioner is hopping all around or essentially rock steady. If it's hopping all around the most common cause, which can destroy the tensioner and throw a belt, is a bad alternator pulley clutch which is about an $80 item and can be replaced apart from a complete alternator replacement. It's also possible that you have a similar problem with the clutch AC or viscous heater bearing. If the AC clutch/bearing is bad you will need a new AC compressor. If the viscous one is bad you can replace the bearing for about $10 but the viscous heater clutch cannot be fixed so you will have to run without the viscous providing extra cabin heat on cold starts, harmless from a vehicle durability standpoint but if you want/need that extra boost a new viscous heater assembly is like $300 IIRC.

I suspect your no start relates to the serp belt problem which would lead to poor battery charging and heavily computerized modern vehicles are well know for poor start ability if the battery is dicey and won't "tell" the electronics that it's ok to start. Based on the no start 2n symptom I'd take a real close look at the alternator pulley, maybe bolts too, and the condition including age of your battery.

cmpbiker · **Joined:** Mon Mar 29, 2010 1:26 pm **Posts:** 62

Thanks all for the advice but missing the mark a bit. The tensioner is bad not because of the pulley but because it is actually separating at the pivot. You can look down and see the gap between the halves and the tension arm at an angle. I lost an alternator clutch about a year and half ago and it could have started with getting jerked around.

The no start issue is the big concern because it came out of nowhere. It has plenty of cranking power and will get an initial combustion and fell like it is starting but doesnt, almost as if it stops the fuel after the initial squirt. It ran fine and I parked it at my office so it is as if the problem is part of the starting circuit.

Budke · **Posted:** Mon Apr 30, 2012 11:56 am

Simple things first. Does the battery have enough juice to start it? I've had that happen to me before. Sounded like it was going to start but the battery just didn't quite have it in it to start it up completely.

Sent using the force

cmpbiker · **Joined:** Mon Mar 29, 2010 1:26 pm **Posts:** 62

Yes I have good cranking speed, relatively new red top battery.

cmpbiker · **Joined:** Mon Mar 29, 2010 1:26 pm **Posts:** 62

Looking through all of the info on this site can get you exhausted. I found a thread similar to mine that pointed to a jumped timing belt but this involved a catastrophic event where the serpentine belt jammed up the pulleys. I never had that and it was drivable with no negative symptoms until I stopped it so I am hoping this is not the cause but the symptoms do sound like a fuel pump out of time.....

msilbernagel · **Posted:** Tue May 01, 2012 12:50 am

cmpbiker - how many miles on your CRD?

Perhaps the misbehaving accessory drive has affected the timing belt, or it could simply be a coincidence. Sometimes when the belt is nearing end of life it doesn't go catastrophically but instead loses a few cogs so that one pulley can become out of time with the others by a tooth or two.

Without removing the timing belt cover - I believe you could use the cam alignment pins, and the 90 ATDC alignment pin on the flex plate, to quickly confirm that the engine is still timed and rule timing belt issues in or out. If they all go in together your timing belt is still Ok... well, aligned at least.

cmpbiker · **Joined:** Mon Mar 29, 2010 1:26 pm **Posts:** 62

Sitting at 89k so the belt is getting old. I have it at the shop right now having decided I am out of my element.

dkenny · **Posted:** Tue May 01, 2012 9:42 pm

so..
ANY codes?
maybe an p0093? I hope not..

-dkenny

cmpbiker · **Joined:** Mon Mar 29, 2010 1:26 pm **Posts:** 62

My Mechanic seems to think it is the computer because it will start and run if you move the computer around. He did pull some codes put didn't share them with me. I asked about the potential for a slipped timing belt and he said that when it fired up everything was normal which was a relief.

What is a p0093 error?

msilbernagel · **Posted:** Wed May 02, 2012 2:51 pm

cmpbiker wrote:

My Mechanic seems to think it is the computer because it will start and run if you move the computer around. He did pull some codes put didn't share them with me. I asked about the potential for a slipped timing belt and he said that when it fired up everything was normal which was a relief.

What is a p0093 error?

Large leak - fuel system.

Basically, air is getting in.. change the filter recently? If not, the additional vacuum required to pull fuel through a nearly clogged filter could do it..

Or... perhaps it was changed recently and the old o-ring stuck up under the head, out of sight, and now you have two...
Or... perhaps the fuel heater in the fuel head has a failing electrical connector and air is being pulled in there..

You get the idea.

Mark

BobFarley · **Posted:** Wed May 02, 2012 3:46 pm

Why won't the mechanic share the engine codes with you? You're paying for his services!!!

It could be something much simpler like a crank position sensor. Get the codes and share them or look them up yourself...without them your just pi$$ing in the wind in my opinion.

cmpbiker · **Joined:** Mon Mar 29, 2010 1:26 pm **Posts:** 62

I never asked for the codes so its not like he is screwing me, used this guy for years so no worries.

No Start problem

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