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Waiting for the bad news....
http://www.lostjeeps.com/forum/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=5&t=56958		 Page 1 of 13
Author:  jinstall [ Wed Nov 17, 2010 11:11 pm ]
Post subject:  Waiting for the bad news....
Tomorrow the CRD goes into a diesel shop to get scoped to see if the TB was installed correctly and the cam gears are infact in time with the crank. Yesterday morning when I got to work i hear this high pitch whine that soundslike the turbo has injested something and broken a small tab off of one of the vains and allows it to whistle a little. I want to change th eoil this weekend, maybe in the morning if I have an extra filter for it in the garage. I know GP#2 (3) is bad and there are none to be found. I still have the air leaking into the fue/water seperator since th edealer installed the new one. I am debating on trading it but I just got it where I wanted it and now this. It has not run correctly since the dealer had in in September. I want to go there this Saturday and request to see the actual certification of the mechanic that did the repairs and se if they are indeed a VM Moturi certified mechanic. If they are not I will speak to the dealer manager and if they will not do anything then I will get a lawyer and contact Chrysler again on this matter. If I sell it then I will go for the MB ML320 CDI since Jeep does not make anything in a CRD anymore.
Author:  Sir Sam [ Wed Nov 17, 2010 11:22 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: I think I am F*&#@!D
well, damm.
Author:  tjkj2002 [ Wed Nov 17, 2010 11:39 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: I think I am F*&#@!D
jinstall wrote:
Tomorrow the CRD goes into a diesel shop to get scoped to see if the TB was installed correctly and the cam gears are infact in time with the crank. Yesterday morning when I got to work i hear this high pitch whine that soundslike the turbo has injested something and broken a small tab off of one of the vains and allows it to whistle a little. I want to change th eoil this weekend, maybe in the morning if I have an extra filter for it in the garage. I know GP#2 (3) is bad and there are none to be found. I still have the air leaking into the fue/water seperator since th edealer installed the new one. I am debating on trading it but I just got it where I wanted it and now this. It has not run correctly since the dealer had in in September. I want to go there this Saturday and request to see the actual certification of the mechanic that did the repairs and se if they are indeed a VM Moturi certified mechanic. If they are not I will speak to the dealer manager and if they will not do anything then I will get a lawyer and contact Chrysler again on this matter. If I sell it then I will go for the MB ML320 CDI since Jeep does not make anything in a CRD anymore.

Yeah you probally could count the # of VM certified tech's on one hand that are in the US.
Author:  ATXKJ [ Thu Nov 18, 2010 9:00 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: I think I am F*&#@!D
uummmhhh - while you were in Europe with mechanics that understood diesels - Chrysler launched the CRD in the US with a 45 minute video of changes for the 05 model year - oh yeah and that included all of the 'required' training on the diesel.........

and it went downhill after they stopped production.......



the biggest problem from day one has been mechanics who understand diesels - best bet has always been find a dealership that services Cummins/ Sprinters.


and the certified Techs that Tj mentions are probably working on the boats that use VM Motori - I'd be really, really surprised if you find one at a Jeep/Chrysler dealership.

Good Luck
Author:  kccrd [ Thu Nov 18, 2010 9:10 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: I think I am F*&#@!D
I don't think you would make it out of your driveway if the TB was not correct. I just changed mine and if the paint marks that I put on the cp3 pump and the crank and the camshaft pulleys did not line up exactly after 2 hand cranking s of the engine you would have to start over. Is your high pitch whine have any grinding sound to it? Kind of like a very dry bearing.
Author:  jinstall [ Thu Nov 18, 2010 10:38 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: I think I am F*&#@!D
As I suspected the cams were not in sync with the crank. The dealer, without hesitation, refunded 100% of the labor for the work they did. Scott at United Diesel did the scope and will do the repair work for the CRD. He said he is not sure about the turbo yet but will check it when everythingis apart. He really seems to understand the CRD and so far I would recomend his shop. The appointment will be for 1 Dec and will need 3 days to make sure everything is done correctly, I can respect this. As for the dealer I am impressed how they stood up to their mistake adn handled it in a very professional way. Am I happy? Hell no but this could have turned out a lot worse. More to come later.

Right now I need to track down I think it is Green Engineering to rent the TB tools to have ready for the 1 Dec service date.
Author:  dkenny [ Sun Nov 21, 2010 7:20 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: I think I am F*&#@!D
I think that if the cams are 1 tooth off the crank you bend valve train parts..
the CP3 doesn't have timing..there are 3 piston pump inside the CP3..its not possible to time this with a 4 cylinder..the fuel pressure is there or its not..

do you know if they own the proper VM tools? if not...well...sue them..they should have them..they don't cost much..

its also possible to change the belt without the tools, but is a MAJOR PIA!!! don't ask how I know..I won't be doing again without the tools..if that tells you anything..

fyi there are no timing marks on the cam gears..it appears that there are..but they aren't.

-dkenny
Author:  MACKJ [ Sun Nov 21, 2010 10:01 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: I think I am F*&#@!D
dkenny wrote:
I think that if the cams are 1 tooth off the crank you bend valve train parts..
the CP3 doesn't have timing..there are 3 piston pump inside the CP3..its not possible to time this with a 4 cylinder..the fuel pressure is there or its not..

do you know if they own the proper VM tools? if not...well...sue them..they should have them..they don't cost much..

its also possible to change the belt without the tools, but is a MAJOR PIA!!! don't ask how I know..I won't be doing again without the tools..if that tells you anything..

fyi there are no timing marks on the cam gears..it appears that there are..but they aren't.

-dkenny

X2 on all of the above. And get the proper tools.
Author:  MrMopar64 [ Sun Nov 21, 2010 11:35 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: I think I am F*&#@!D
The pump does have 3 pistons, but there is also an associated timing of it as well. Otherwise, you get a different pressure wave inside the rail which can sometimes have a disturbance on the quality of the injection and the rail pressure control. It's important to get it in the right place, since there is also a power loss to be realized by having the pump timing incorrect.

I have seen one engine re-assembled by a dealer that was off by roughly a tooth and was still running, albeit with slightly more smoke and less power due to decreased airflow. It could be possible to be in the same situation...
Author:  kccrd [ Mon Nov 22, 2010 12:02 am ]
Post subject:  Re: I think I am F*&#@!D
Yes and if I remember correctly the timing mark on the cover and the mark on the injector pump sprocket is at the nine o'clock or a little before. I marked mine with some white touch up paint and I also marked the crankshaft hub which is at three O'clock position. The notches on the camshaft pulleys do not mean anything. I just marked the intake cam drivers side at the three O'clock position and the exhaust cam at the nine O'clock position, although when in perfect time the camshaft locking pins will screw in just right if you turn the crank just a fraction of an inch they will not go in at all. After the belt is reinstalled and you turn the engine over two revolutions clockwise the marks will line up again and the camshaft locking pins can be reinstalled just to make sure of proper timing.
Author:  jinstall [ Fri Nov 26, 2010 5:59 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: I think I am F*&#@!D
Ok now I am completely hosed the turbo is now plowing it's bearings so now I need a new turbo any help on finding one would be great. Sorry this is on my iPhone since I am camping 550 miles from home
Author:  racertracer [ Fri Nov 26, 2010 6:51 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: I think I am F*&#@!D
Try this website http://www.usedturbos.net. Phone number = 760 207 5392 Jessy is the owner.

They sell new, used and rebuilt turbos, I have never dealt with them but I did speak to Jessy the owner about his company and I've heard that they know their stuff and do good work.

If you decide to go with a new turbo, then consider using GDE (Green Diesel Engineering) as a source, Keith offers a new revised and more powerful solution.

I hope you're going to be recompensed by the dealer for your troubles, parts and repairs.


RacerTracer
Author:  striperman36 [ Fri Nov 26, 2010 7:56 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: I think I am F*&#@!D
Do we have TB thread, mechanic's and shops that have done this? I have another year then I need to get it replaced.

Either I do it myself with the GDE tools or find a mechanic or another individual with VM knowledge that can do it.
Author:  dkenny [ Fri Nov 26, 2010 11:02 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: I think I am F*&#@!D
um..

if yall stop and work a little math..
3 piston and 4 cylinders only line every common multiple of 3 and 4..or 12..so pressure wave even if initially set perfect will be wrong most of the time. with the engine at TDC on cyliner 1 will make the next 2 firings of cylinder 1 wrong..so 1 of 3 or right..

according to the FSM the pump and crank run at 1:1..

so forget the timing mark on the pump pulley..

on a 6 cylinder engine..its a whole different game.

sorry I cannot help about the turbo...also GDE has a great write up on changing the timing belt.

-dkenny
Author:  MrMopar64 [ Sat Nov 27, 2010 11:09 am ]
Post subject:  Re: I think I am F*&#@!D
The service manual is wrong: the high pressure pump spins at 2/3 the speed of the crankshaft (the pulley of the CP3 is bigger than the crankshaft)

I have seen an engine with "correct" timing have 2% improved power over an engine with the "wrong" timing.

The alignment mark is there for a reason...
Author:  jinstall [ Sat Nov 27, 2010 2:40 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Stranded west of morganton nc
Stranded west of morganton NC on i40 jeep is dead turbo pukedthe oil out and I heard it and rolled to a stop at an exit around 100 I think any help if someone could 571 292 7078
Author:  Sir Sam [ Sat Nov 27, 2010 2:55 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Stranded west of morganton nc
jinstall wrote:
Stranded west of morganton NC on i40 jeep is dead turbo pukedthe oil out and I heard it and rolled to a stop at an exit around 100 I think any help if someone could 571 292 7078


Looking at the CRD rescue squad geordi is the person closest to you and he is 5.5 hours and 320 miles away.

I'm sorry that I don't have more for ya. Bad time (holiday weekend) to be trying to get help as well. Good luck. if theres anything I can do to help call me at 720..........
Author:  racertracer [ Sat Nov 27, 2010 3:53 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Stranded west of morganton nc
Oh brother.

Wishing you a good outcome.
Author:  dgeist [ Sat Nov 27, 2010 4:17 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Stranded west of morganton nc
google maps says I'm about 4 hours away, but all I'd be able to do is tow you back to Atlanta with a tow dolly (sort of the wrong direction for ya...)

Dan
Author:  Joe Romas [ Sat Nov 27, 2010 5:57 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Stranded west of morganton nc
I just spoke with him.

He's at a Jeep dealership now and said his turbo blew oil out and he just got to an exit and the engine started knocking and quit.

So now he'll need to wait till monday so they can find a Jeep dealer to repair it.

Joe
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