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HELP! 2.5 CRD Still Stalling!!!
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Author:  tangov8 [ Fri Apr 08, 2011 3:55 pm ]
Post subject:  HELP! 2.5 CRD Still Stalling!!!
Hi Again
My 2002 2.5 CRD is still stalling,just taken it out & it must have done it 7 times!! replaced the fuel,oil & air filters & cleaned the MAP/MAF sensor (which was just a blob of gunk) & the car is just the same! drive the Jeep at speed (in 4th or 5th) and the engine cuts out completly,it's instant,wont restart if you back off or use it's speed to try & bump it.When you bing it to a stop,turn the ignition off & then back on it restarts? performance seem's poor & it's had a ECU re-map to try & cure this to little avail!! Does the car have a lift pump? if I follow the fuel pipe from the filter head it goe's out of sight under the alternator area.May take the tank off 2 mos. Any idea's please.Had the turbo inlet hose off,seems ok (but date stamp is 2001,MAP sensor is early type too) :banghead:
Almost forgot,rev the car not moving & the revs & engine will not stall,even upto red line (& passed!!!)? But that's not under load???
Author:  papaindigo [ Fri Apr 08, 2011 4:55 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: HELP! 2.5 CRD Still Stalling!!!
Have you tried a drive with the fuel cap off or loose. If the stall goes away then you need to look at bad venting of the tank which could pull a vacuum and stop adequate fuel delivery. I don't know how the tank vents though. Are there any sections of "rubber" as opposed to "hard" fuel lines. Years ago a friends pickup had similar symptoms that we traced to a small section of rubber hose above the fuel tank that was sufficiently weak that it would "collapse" under high fuel demand.
Author:  tangov8 [ Sat Apr 09, 2011 2:45 am ]
Post subject:  Re: HELP! 2.5 CRD Still Stalling!!!
papaindigo wrote:
Have you tried a drive with the fuel cap off or loose. If the stall goes away then you need to look at bad venting of the tank which could pull a vacuum and stop adequate fuel delivery. I don't know how the tank vents though. Are there any sections of "rubber" as opposed to "hard" fuel lines. Years ago a friends pickup had similar symptoms that we traced to a small section of rubber hose above the fuel tank that was sufficiently weak that it would "collapse" under high fuel demand.


Yes, I thought of that & have tried running it with no cap but it just does the same thing. I'm starting to think that it could be more electical? Dont know if some sort of sensor as shutting the engine down,seems to only do it in 4th & 5th,nothing on the gearbox is there?
Author:  Billwill [ Sat Apr 09, 2011 6:28 am ]
Post subject:  Re: HELP! 2.5 CRD Still Stalling!!!
I am sure you must have some OBDII codes stored in your ECU!
Your 2002 CRD should have the lift pump installed as standard....check with tonycrd here on this forum>
Please try and extract some codes and then we should be able to help!
I had several electrical problems on my 2002 CRD which would cause the engine to die...pulled over to the side and re-start OK.
In my case what actually caused the failure was not speed related but a case of either:
1: Turning on the front wipers....even momentarily.
2: Turning on the aircon....even momentarily.
3: A cheap Italian performance box that I had plugged onto the fuel rail...to fool the ECU about fuel rail pressure, suddenly gave up the ghost with a "POP" :banghead: . I removed this cheap box and threw it away but the point is that something like a failing fuel rail sensor can cause you to grind to a halt....here an OBDII code should help!

The first two problems caused the alternator to up the charge on the battery to around 17 volts...the ECU picked up the overvoltage and powered the whole lot down! :?

I think you may have something similar whereby the ECU is picking up some problem and shutting down all systems....that is why you need to extract some error codes. :roll:

If you have a voltmeter, plug it into your cigar lighter up front and keep an eye on it as you speed up...I am interested to know if there is any sudden surge in voltage just before your engine dies!
Author:  tangov8 [ Sat Apr 09, 2011 11:23 am ]
Post subject:  Re: HELP! 2.5 CRD Still Stalling!!!
Billwill wrote:
I am sure you must have some OBDII codes stored in your ECU!
Your 2002 CRD should have the lift pump installed as standard....check with tonycrd here on this forum>
Please try and extract some codes and then we should be able to help!
I had several electrical problems on my 2002 CRD which would cause the engine to die...pulled over to the side and re-start OK.
In my case what actually caused the failure was not speed related but a case of either:
1: Turning on the front wipers....even momentarily.
2: Turning on the aircon....even momentarily.
3: A cheap Italian performance box that I had plugged onto the fuel rail...to fool the ECU about fuel rail pressure, suddenly gave up the ghost with a "POP" :banghead: . I removed this cheap box and threw it away but the point is that something like a failing fuel rail sensor can cause you to grind to a halt....here an OBDII code should help!

The first two problems caused the alternator to up the charge on the battery to around 17 volts...the ECU picked up the overvoltage and powered the whole lot down! :?

I think you may have something similar whereby the ECU is picking up some problem and shutting down all systems....that is why you need to extract some error codes. :roll:

If you have a voltmeter, plug it into your cigar lighter up front and keep an eye on it as you speed up...I am interested to know if there is any sudden surge in voltage just before your engine dies!



Thanks for that,will look into it, I took off some sort of split charge system today do do with the tow bar,wires linked to the battery! It needed to come off anyway as had to remove the tow bar to take the tank off,cleaned out & modified the pick up a little.
While the tank was off I noticed that my rear diff has a speed? sensor on,so have taken it out cleaned & replaced,also done the rear diff oil & LSD! so cleaned the pick up wheel too as it's easy when the tanks off!! Let,s see if it ever run's again! still in bit's :juggle:
Author:  tangov8 [ Sat Apr 09, 2011 2:17 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: HELP! 2.5 CRD Still Stalling!!!
Well that didn't work!!
Will have to get it plugged in to check fault code's,the dealer quoted £106!
No fuel pump in tank,no lift pump (apart from primer on top of filter housing) only has the serpintine belt driven pump? :furious:
Author:  Billwill [ Sat Apr 09, 2011 2:54 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: HELP! 2.5 CRD Still Stalling!!!
tangov8 wrote:
Well that didn't work!!
Will have to get it plugged in to check fault code's,the dealer quoted £106!
No fuel pump in tank,no lift pump (apart from primer on top of filter housing) only has the serpintine belt driven pump? :furious:

Try the following method to get codes out...it definitely works on the 2002 but sometimes needs a few attempts to get it right! :?

Turn the ignition ON but do not start!
Rapidly turn OFF!
Rapidly turn ON again!
Repeat the above until you have turned ON FOUR (sometimes FIVE) times and leave it ON

The Odometer display will cycle through the error codes, starting from the oldest(which may be totally irrelevent now) going through to the newest. Repeat the procedure until you are sure you have the last few codes!
This does not erase the codes...need a Dealer to do that but that is not important.

The sensor on the rear diff is the speed sensor to drive the speedometer. If you run with it disconnected, after a few miles you get a "PING" and the speedometer displays a constant mileage of about 20 mph no matter what speed you drive at.
Reconnect the sensor and it will still give the same effect as above until you have traveled a certain distance or been through a certain amount of start/stop cycles then it will all come right. I doubt your problem lies here but I do believe that the speed sensor data is analysed by the BCM and anything is possible! :(
Author:  tangov8 [ Sun Apr 10, 2011 4:38 am ]
Post subject:  Re: HELP! 2.5 CRD Still Stalling!!!
Billwill wrote:
tangov8 wrote:
Well that didn't work!!
Will have to get it plugged in to check fault code's,the dealer quoted £106!
No fuel pump in tank,no lift pump (apart from primer on top of filter housing) only has the serpintine belt driven pump? :furious:

Try the following method to get codes out...it definitely works on the 2002 but sometimes needs a few attempts to get it right! :?

Turn the ignition ON but do not start!
Rapidly turn OFF!
Rapidly turn ON again!
Repeat the above until you have turned ON FOUR (sometimes FIVE) times and leave it ON

The Odometer display will cycle through the error codes, starting from the oldest(which may be totally irrelevent now) going through to the newest. Repeat the procedure until you are sure you have the last few codes!
This does not erase the codes...need a Dealer to do that but that is not important.

The sensor on the rear diff is the speed sensor to drive the speedometer. If you run with it disconnected, after a few miles you get a "PING" and the speedometer displays a constant mileage of about 20 mph no matter what speed you drive at.
Reconnect the sensor and it will still give the same effect as above until you have traveled a certain distance or been through a certain amount of start/stop cycles then it will all come right. I doubt your problem lies here but I do believe that the speed sensor data is analysed by the BCM and anything is possible! :(


I will try that thanks,need to sort it out,it's driving me mad & making the car un useable (it still seems to drive ok round town,but under hard driving to fails,will still do 70+ if you drive steady)
Author:  tonycrd [ Mon Apr 11, 2011 11:12 am ]
Post subject:  Re: HELP! 2.5 CRD Still Stalling!!!
Are you sure you do not have a leaky fuel filter head? When you pump fuel manually build up some pressure to see if it leaks out somewhere.

I replaced mine a while ago because the big white nylon plug in front of the manual pump cracked all by itself.

Image

The FSM tells us we have a lift pump, but it could be wrong.

Do you have a BOSCH service nearby? Have them check your injectors.
Author:  tangov8 [ Wed Apr 13, 2011 5:02 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: HELP! 2.5 CRD Still Stalling!!!
tonycrd wrote:
Are you sure you do not have a leaky fuel filter head? When you pump fuel manually build up some pressure to see if it leaks out somewhere.

I replaced mine a while ago because the big white nylon plug in front of the manual pump cracked all by itself.

Image

The FSM tells us we have a lift pump, but it could be wrong.

Do you have a BOSCH service nearby? Have them check your injectors.

Your filter housing is the same as mine,what symptons did you have,& do you bleed yours with the nylon plug or that brass 13mm outlet & could you see the leak? Was going to put a new filter head on mine just in case but a local garage who has had a vm engined jeep in with the same fault thinks its a injector fault,failing under load & returning the fuel back to the tank,so as your advise am having them tested when the wife can spare the Jeep! Thanks for your input,will wait & see :juggle:
Author:  tonycrd [ Fri Apr 15, 2011 11:44 am ]
Post subject:  Re: HELP! 2.5 CRD Still Stalling!!!
Bleed throught the brass bolt, do not touch the nylon plug.
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