DIESEL VS UNLEADED $.95 SPREAD ????????????????

B99 · **Posted:** Wed Nov 30, 2011 6:37 pm

Smiths unleaded $3.09/g diesel $4.05/g, Chevron $3.20, $4.15/g. Is this another of the EPA's plans to get rid of diesels? First plan to add a bunch of useless emissions crap to close the mileage gap of diesels and gassers fails so hey lets just charge a dollar more for diesel...maybe that will do it. It sure seems like they're trying hard to discourage diesels state side. I have to mix 50/50 through the winter to keep the bio from freezing. This doesnt help the economy much, everything we buy is trucked at some point.

tregrrr · **Joined:** Mon Oct 10, 2011 2:37 pm **Posts:** 59

B99 wrote:

:banghead: Is this another of the EPA's plans to get rid of diesels? First plan to add a bunch of useless emissions crap to close the mileage gap of diesels ... It sure seems like they're trying hard to discourage diesels state side.

You think?? I had to go overseas to meet the likes of my Liberty. While abroad, I realized that diesels are more fun to drive, and vastly more fuel efficient than gassers.

But Canada is following US lead... our CRD food is sitting at $5.40/ USGal (1.429/L) or about 15% Higher than gas in a market where diesel price is historically 10% less than gasoline Also we are a country who supplies other countries with oil, so why is ours higher than yours??

Yeah bro its irritating

100$ to fill up gets tiresome quickly; too bad there is nothing our society of sheep is capable of doing to tell the fatcats shilling up the prices to jump off bridges. NO-ONE is willing to make the sacrifice as an individual to NOT purchase fuel for 6 months or a year that would be required to get anyone's attention. All the boycott initiatives I have seen have failed because everyone knows that a "dont buy gas on ___day" results in spikes before and after that all average out.

The only way to make heard would be to get enough people to support a boycott of ONE company. Unfortunately we all know we don't have the will power to continue it beyond a week since every one would take the short term gain and instant gratification of saving 2$ per tank when the boycott victim drops their price by 10c with respect to local stations, effectively ending the boycott. Everyone thinks in the "oh its just me, I dont make a difference" way and **POOF** all of a sudden its actually an aggregate of 100,000 people with the same thought.

So, back to square one: we get to sit here and bemoan it on the internet since there is nothing we can actually do about fuel prices. Now that we have shown the fatcats that we are in fact willing to pay whatever they ask, they will continue to charge it.

Supply and demand my ass-- there is no market correction for supply surplus. Its a scam since they do not respond to any market stimuli, but claim at every media level to be a normal market.

Normal Humans have to work. The majority have to drive to get to work, thus humans need to consume fuel to provide food. How do people who are ill served by public transit choose not to buy fuel based upon high prices?? Well obviously there is still enough consumption at bare minimum sustenance levels to keep the oil companies happy... so where is the leverage to bring prices back in line??

ok [/rant] since its just getting my snot knotted tighter than it needs to be

*sigh*

Wobbly · **Posted:** Wed Nov 30, 2011 7:14 pm

Oil speculators are taking more of your dollars than EPA-mandated refinery costs:

http://thinkprogress.org/economy/2011/0 ... e-gouging/

and

http://wyden.senate.gov/imo/media/doc/s ... _sheet.pdf

B99 · **Posted:** Wed Nov 30, 2011 7:28 pm

I still feel hosed.

warp2diesel · **Posted:** Wed Nov 30, 2011 8:43 pm

Wobbly wrote:

Oil speculators are taking more of your dollars than EPA-mandated refinery costs:

http://thinkprogress.org/economy/2011/0 ... e-gouging/

and

http://wyden.senate.gov/imo/media/doc/s ... _sheet.pdf

One story I heard is the Oil speculators use a refinery problem that came up in Canada to jack the price.
Another excuse is with the economy soft, Gasoline is abundant and demand for diesel is steady due to OTR trucks and Harvest Season.

Where is the icon of the pitch fork and manure pile I can add on?

When more people go back to work and drive their gassers more, the oil speculators will jack up the price of gasoline and close the gap.
With Diesel Engines being ~30% - 40% more efficient than gassers, multiply the price of gas by 1.3 or 1.4 and see if it looks so bad.
With the Euro going into the Land Fill, the speculators may go into currency instead of oil, we will see.

Greasey Bob · **Joined:** Tue Dec 14, 2010 3:34 am **Posts:** 228

170 miles is the distance I travel for every gallon of diesel fuel I purchase. And diesel was $1.39 a gallon when I started using WVO. Now it is $3.94. I used my father-in-laws truck today and it used more paid for fuel in one day then I use in a month.

xtriggerman · **Posted:** Wed Nov 30, 2011 11:20 pm

Up here in the Socialist NY, the spead is 45-55 cents difference. I place alot of the blame on the US based oil companies for the fact they simply will not refine a stronger up curve in Diesel fuel production. They convinced the manufacturers NOT to get into the passenger car Diesel market since that will sky rocket Diesel fuel prices. The past GM chairman said as much in a speach I once saw. Back in the bubble days, US refineries were buying refined diesel from Europe and other over seas refineries. Speculators eat those type of import munbers up.... We get soaked. Just wait n see diesel shoot up if the economy comes back around.
All the while the auto manufacturers are still in a car/van/truck HP output race with a "new" effort to MPG numbers that my 10 year old VW TDI's can beat. The shear idiocy of it all is mind bogling

Bio diesel cant happen fast enough!

RAF 3829 · **Posted:** Thu Dec 01, 2011 7:55 am

Boils down to greed. There's always a refinery problem somewhere in this country. And diesel is basically a byproduct of making gasoline, no reason it shouldn't be cheaper.

The lie that the winter causes prices to go up is BS. If that's true, then it should go down substantionally in the summer. It all boils down to greed.

fastring · **Posted:** Thu Dec 01, 2011 9:52 pm

In SoCal, diesel has been around the same as premium or a little over for several years, but I remember when diesel was cheaper. The recent (few years) jump where diesel is so much more than regular, I've heard, has been associated with the ULSD? Could make sense if its harder to refine? In baja, where the Pemex stations are all govt run, diesel is less than premium but more than regular (magna). When I travel south in my Ford F350 (38 gal tank), I dont fill up until I've crossed the border and I top off before heading back.

I must admit that the cost is frustrating, my wife just got the 2012 Prius V and its not just that it gets better mpg (it should, its a car, 2wd, cant tow, etc) but the cost in the gas vs diesel really adds up. I swtiched from a 2008 Prius to the CRD and didnt think high 40s vs high 20s/low 30s (I drive like a Prius driver) would be a big deal, but the diesel cost is.

ATXKJ · **Posted:** Thu Dec 01, 2011 10:14 pm

Diesel is a byproduct of Gasoline manufacturing - the ratio is pretty fixed with the quality of the crude oil (you can crack the molecules down - but it's energy expensive)
They do blame low sulfur as causing more processing.

the main price differences tend to be because they ship all the diesel overseas Europe and China...

B99 · **Posted:** Fri Dec 02, 2011 3:23 pm

Two weeks ago the difference was only $.40-$.50. Gas has been steadily falling while diesel has gone up $.15-$.20/gal over the last couple of weeks. I have yet to hear any reasons, theres not a shortage.

geordi · **Posted:** Fri Dec 02, 2011 5:04 pm

B99 wrote:

Two weeks ago the difference was only $.40-$.50. Gas has been steadily falling while diesel has gone up $.15-$.20/gal over the last couple of weeks. I have yet to hear any reasons, theres not a shortage.

"Because they can."

nursecosmo · **Posted:** Fri Dec 02, 2011 6:51 pm

geordi wrote:

"Because they can."

No more need be said.

striperman36 · **Posted:** Fri Dec 02, 2011 8:43 pm

Diesel and heating oil are the same thing. there is always a winter runup

in MA regular - 3.37 - Diesel 3.79

Granahan378 · **Posted:** Sat Dec 03, 2011 2:36 am

4.09 in Grand Junction........Oilfield still going strong passing on the buck :CAMPING:

doughboyea · **Posted:** Mon Dec 05, 2011 9:03 pm

Here in CT, regular is $3.41, diesel is at $3.99.

I've been looking for a work vehicle and would really like to get the Liberty CRD, but when the price of regular keeps falling and diesel stays the same or goes up, I am forced to second guess my "need" for a diesel.

Roostre · **Joined:** Sun Oct 24, 2010 3:57 pm **Posts:** 195

Also, since the inception of ULSD the refineries will weigh the cost of extra processing vs. exporting the oil to counties where unrefined diesel is A-OK to burn- guess what choice they have been making???

An example: http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/2813576/posts
"In the week ended September 16th, the US exported more refined products than it imported. Year-over-year, the US is now exporting 714,000 barrels/day more refined products than it is importing. The largest portion of these exports is diesel fuel. Combined with the wide price spread between US WTI crude and North Sea Brent, the demand for diesel fuel is propping up pump prices for gasoline in the US even as crude prices continue to fall.

The situation we’re seeing in the energy markets now is similar to the situation almost exactly three years ago. According to the US Energy Information Administration, gasoline pump prices last week were $3.56/gallon. Other than earlier this year, the last time gasoline was near that price was September 2008. Diesel fuel cost $3.83/gallon last week, comparable to its price in March 2008. WTI crude cost almost $87/barrel last week and Brent crude cost over $114. In early October 2008, WTI cost $86.50/barrel, while Brent sold for $81.65/barrel.

What was going on then appears to be happening now, only this time prices for gasoline could remain higher indefinitely as US refiners continue to produce more diesel fuel and other distillates rather than the cheaper gasoline. Diesel fuel prices will rise, too, as demand increases or refineries hit their maximum capacity for making distillates.

Of US refiners, Valero Energy Corp. (NYSE: VLO) is probably the best equipped to handle the cheaper, lower grades of crude oil that can more profitably be refined into distillates. Marathon Petroleum Corp. (NYSE: MRC) is upgrading its refinery near Detroit to accommodate the synthetic fuels coming from the Canadian oil sands.

In Europe, where demand for diesel fuel is highest, existing refineries are optimized to produce gasoline. That’s why US diesel fetches such a nice premium when exported. US refiners face the same limitation on diesel production, but US demand for diesel is lower and the refineries can crank up diesel production enough to take advantage of the higher export prices.

Caveat: I don't know much about "Freerepublic", but there are many similiar new stories from major press if you search.

geordi · **Posted:** Tue Dec 06, 2011 11:35 am

"Oh, you members of the public MUST allow us to drill and destroy MORE of the precious wilderness... That is the ONLY WAY to lower your fuel prices!"

(Never you mind that there is an abundance of supply, and we will just EXPORT THE STUFF to the highest paying location, and piss in the face of the stupid American public with our lies)

"There is a refinery capacity shortage b/c not enough refineries have been ALLOWED to be built"
"It's caused by the Chinese Economy driving up demand"
"There is a lack of stable DOMESTIC supply - We should Drill Baby Drill!"
"Seasonal demand changes that we couldn't foresee months ago"
"Boutique blends (stuff we don't want to make b/c it takes more effort) drive up the pump prices"

"Because we can."

How do you know Tom Kloza of the Oil Price (fixing) Information Service is lying? His lips are moving. Just search Google News on his name to read all the FUD that he produces, trying to deflect public opinion from changing the status quo.

Oil is a FUNGIBLE COMMODITY. If you don't know or understand what that means, look it up. Pouring a cup of water into the ocean - THAT is fungible. You can't get YOUR cup back from the whole. The USA has for many years allowed OPEC to be the complete arbiter of crude oil pricing, ALL the oil that is produced (No matter WHERE IT COMES FROM) is then sold on the open market to refineries as part of that whole. The refineries (surprise surprise) are owned by a chain of holding companies and subsidiaries... Of Big Oil anyway. What do they do with their refined product? Take it to the market with the highest PROFIT MARGIN of course! Until shipping the stuff across the ocean ceases to be profitable for them, we will NEVER see prices lower than $3 for diesel again.

tjkj2002 · **Posted:** Tue Dec 06, 2011 12:34 pm

Man you guys are whinny little *****'s.We still pay some of the lowest fuel prices in the world and all you do is complain.Go over the pond and you'll be paying $9+ for a gallon of diesel.

Roostre · **Joined:** Sun Oct 24, 2010 3:57 pm **Posts:** 195

tjkj2002 wrote:

Man you guys are whinny little *****'s.We still pay some of the lowest fuel prices in the world and all you do is complain.Go over the pond and you'll be paying $9+ for a gallon of diesel.

Or go down to Caracas and fill up for 3/4 of a cent per liter, or Saudi Arabia at 12 cents per liter. Whats your point?

We used to have over 100 oil companies competing. We have how many now? 4 or 5 major players? Its not whining to talk about the political realities and the unintended consequences of legislation associated with those realities.

DIESEL VS UNLEADED $.95 SPREAD ????????????????

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