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Glow Plugs
http://www.lostjeeps.com/forum/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=5&t=65664		 Page 1 of 2
Author:  ChesterCRD [ Tue Mar 06, 2012 8:07 pm ]
Post subject:  Glow Plugs
Today I got the dreaded P1263, which indicates failed 1 and 4 glow plugs (from my reading). So I'm considering the 7v metal replacements. I live in FL, so I'm not too concerned with how well they function, but I would like my CEL off and don't want the ceramic GPs coming apart in my cylinders.

Some questions to those who have tackled this:

1. Level of difficulty? How long does it take a shade-tree mechanic to swap these out?
2. Do I need anything other than the GPs? Any washers or other odds and ends?
3. Has anybody had this done? What's the cost (Looks like about $170 shipped for the GPs).
4. Any trick to getting the old ones out whole? I'm pretty concerned about losing pieces into the engine and don't like the thought of removing the head.
Author:  warp2diesel [ Tue Mar 06, 2012 10:14 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Glow Plugs
Go with Etechno1, even if you need to order them from Europe and have to pay the VAT tax.
The 5V Mopar glow plugs will cost you a bunch with the dealer reflash (ECM r@pe) and glow plug controller that has the same Bosch pert number.
#3 is the hardest one to change and will require you loosen up the upper EGR pipe going to the EGR so you can nudge it enough out of the way. Be very carefull when you remove them so you don't break one off in the cylinder and have to pull the head. Use penetrating oil and work the glow plug back and forth. Never use impact tools unless you plan to pull the head.
Good luck.
Author:  papaindigo [ Wed Mar 07, 2012 9:38 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Glow Plugs
ChesterCRD - see viewtopic.php?f=5&t=56696&p=630729&hilit=glow+removal#p630729 for a good writeup on removal/install. Other than getting stuff out of the way it's not hard at all. Reports on both the Etecno1 7v and OEM 5v plugs suggest neither one is quite as good at fridged winter (think US/Canada border type winter) starts without using the block heater. That said I'll be installing the Etecno1's in my Jeep when I get a few minutes and if you are up this way we can do an install party in my driveway (FYI I've helped with one install). If you go the OEM route you will need an ECU reflash BEFORE you hook up the new glow plugs to the system. I've heard dealer reflash runs $100; if you have a GDE tune I believe the update runs $50 - costs that need to be added to the price of the OEM plugs and controller.

When you pull the old ceramics look for any broken tips. If you find one use wire cutter to snip the remaining portion of the tip off that plug and compare the old and new surface. A recent break, such as might occur during removal, will be shiny (IIRC) like the cut surface while an old break will be dull and sooty. If you have an old break and the vehicle runs fine chances are the broken tip long since exited the engine via the exhaust with no damage.

I'd also like to get a set of Etecno1 glow plugs for my son's CRD so email me if you have any interest in combining an order to save a bit on shipping. I might also be able to route the order thru my local mechanic in which case it looks like we could avoid the VAT tax.
Author:  LMWatBullRun [ Wed Mar 07, 2012 10:17 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Glow Plugs
if a recently missing GP tip is detected, has anyone used the vacuum/tubing down the GP hole trick?

I've also thought that a small fiber optic camera might come in handy, too, but I don't have one. Yet. 8)
Author:  dieseldoesit [ Wed Mar 07, 2012 11:12 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Glow Plugs
ChesterCRD wrote:
Some questions to those who have tackled this:
1. Level of difficulty? How long does it take a shade-tree mechanic to swap these out?
Replacing the glow plugs is about as difficult as replacing motor mounts. Not bad, but a lot of tight clearance bolts to remove.

ChesterCRD wrote:
2. Do I need anything other than the GPs? Any washers or other odds and ends?
If using 5volt plugs you need the new module and you need a new engine tune. (GDE tune update for 50 bucks)
ChesterCRD wrote:
3. Has anybody had this done? What's the cost (Looks like about $170 shipped for the GPs).
Nope, did it myself.
ChesterCRD wrote:
4. Any trick to getting the old ones out whole? I'm pretty concerned about losing pieces into the engine and don't like the thought of removing the head.
Take your time and remove all the stuff that is in the way so you have room to work. Use a long extension and ratchet to break them free, then use just the extension to finish taking them out. Mine weren't in there hard at all, just used a regular 3/8 ratchet. Torque setting is 100 in/lbs for the glow plugs (verify and check in referenced thread for actual specs), so that isn't too much.

Big thing is to go slow, take your time, and have fun. Oh, and I jacked my vehicle up as I was going to change my oil and filter and to also give me better access to some of the stuff that you get from the bottom. You might want to have a step ladder around..
Author:  ChesterCRD [ Wed Mar 07, 2012 3:11 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Glow Plugs
Thanks folks, your comments boost my confidence in tackling this a little. I plan to use the Etecno1 7v plugs. It looks to be about $180 for four coming from Europe.

Papaindigo -- I really appreciate the offer. I think I'll try to tackle it here (you're about 6 hrs away). If it's OK with you I'd like to be able to get in touch if I run into anything. Let me know if that's a possibility. The site I'm using to purchase is dieselglowplug.com and they include VAT in the price quoted above.

Dieseldoesit -- The motor mounts were a cinch...so hopefully this is as easy. :) I'm a little worried about breaking one on the way out, but I'll take my time and hopefully it goes as smooth as it sounds.

Thanks again...I was getting a little down about this last night and am starting to feel a little better about diving back into this engine bay (TB was only 2K miles ago).
Author:  dieseldoesit [ Wed Mar 07, 2012 3:27 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Glow Plugs
I guess the last word of advice would be to remove as much as possible before you try taking the glow plugs out so you are not fighting for access.

I removed the battery and the wiring that goes to the fuse panel next to the battery. Unplugging the wires from the alternator allowed for the whole wiring harness to be pulled back and stored by the vacuum booster. Also, I ended up removing the fuel head bracket from the firewall to give me even more clearance too.

Oh, another part you might want to have handy is a fuel filter.. while you are there, might as well change the thing..

Good luck!
Author:  galatron [ Wed Mar 07, 2012 5:43 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Glow Plugs
there are some available in the old style on ebay for pretty cheap,, just get one of those? I did... then you only have to replace one,,,, and no reflash... etc.
Author:  ChesterCRD [ Wed Mar 07, 2012 9:59 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Glow Plugs
galatron wrote:
there are some available in the old style on ebay for pretty cheap,, just get one of those? I did... then you only have to replace one,,,, and no reflash... etc.


I thought about it, but have wanted to switch to the metal plugs anyway. The Etechno1 plugs operate at 7V and don't require a reflash. I figure it's worthwhile to go in there once and get them all taken care of. I may rethink that if I drop part of one into the cylinder.

The price ended up being $160 US with shipping (includes VAT). They gave me 10% off for buying four.
Author:  TJ2 [ Fri Mar 09, 2012 12:16 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Glow Plugs
Any idea how long they will take to get over here using regular mail? I just order four. The idea of a ceramic glow plug has always caused me some concern. We'll see how it goes when it comes to getting them out. :)
Author:  maxwellp [ Fri Mar 09, 2012 9:51 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Glow Plugs
Sense you have some time on your hands start soaking the glow-plugs to help get them out. I have started this on my CRD and TDI, with doing this and the heat cycle from use they should come out easier. :pepper:

TJ2 wrote:
Any idea how long they will take to get over here using regular mail? I just order four. The idea of a ceramic glow plug has always caused me some concern. We'll see how it goes when it comes to getting them out. :)
Author:  ChesterCRD [ Fri Mar 09, 2012 12:41 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Glow Plugs
TJ2 wrote:
Any idea how long they will take to get over here using regular mail? I just order four. The idea of a ceramic glow plug has always caused me some concern. We'll see how it goes when it comes to getting them out. :)


They shipped within a day of ordering, but there is no tracking as they are coming in the mail. I'll let you know when I see them.
Author:  ChesterCRD [ Sun Mar 18, 2012 4:04 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Glow Plugs
I received the new plugs from Italy yesterday, so they took about a week and half to get here via mail. They have an expedited shipping method available for more money, but a week and half was acceptable to me.

Unfortunately in the interim I've damaged my shoulder and wrist. I'm thinking about paying a diesel shop in the area to change them. I've been looking for something to try them on. I'd feel a little better about this vehicle if I had a professional mechanic familiar with it to handle things I don't want to or don't have time to deal with.

Then again, I miss out on the fun...I'm torn in more ways than one.
Author:  LMWatBullRun [ Thu Mar 22, 2012 9:46 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Glow Plugs
does anybody know why the Etechno1 box says "Not for use in diesel engines"?

This seems odd to me.
Author:  ChesterCRD [ Thu Mar 22, 2012 11:57 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Glow Plugs
I didn't notice that on my box, but I'll look more carefully tomorrow. I just finished installing them and my CEL now stays off. :BANANA:

I had a rough time with parts of it but was largely due to my damaged shoulder and wrist. I took out the alternator to provide more clearance for cylinder 1 GP access and getting that belt on with a bum arm is impossible. I had to grit through it and I'm sure I'll be feeling it a lot tomorrow. I also managed to lose one of the bolts for the intake elbow. I borrowed one from a bracket that retains some tubing just to the rear of the intake elbow. I'll have to buy a replacement.

Thanks for all your help folks. BlackLibertyCRD's write up was great.
Author:  ChesterCRD [ Fri Mar 23, 2012 7:29 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Glow Plugs
The box my glow plugs came in doesn't say anything about not being for diesel use.
Author:  TJ2 [ Sat Mar 24, 2012 4:01 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Glow Plugs
ChesterCRD wrote:
The box my glow plugs came in doesn't say anything about not being for diesel use.


Just got mine and the Italian declaration of contents on the outside of the package states "4 X diesel glowplugs." They'll be in the engine sometime before next winter. :)
Author:  LMWatBullRun [ Sat Mar 24, 2012 10:20 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Glow Plugs
MIne says NOT for diesel use. I shall open inquiries.
Author:  obthomas [ Mon Mar 26, 2012 9:39 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Glow Plugs
Got my Italian glow plugs by mail in about two weeks. Installed them yesterday. Started at 9 am finished at noon. Anyone need three good ceramic plugs, send me the postage.
Author:  warp2diesel [ Tue Mar 27, 2012 6:57 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Glow Plugs
Congrats :)
You bypassed all the crap many TDI owners went through with the 5V glow plugs that did not work.

Bet you did not use an impact wrench on the glow plugs.
Am I right?
Lots of ceramic glow plugs that failed on VW TDIs were due to rough handling by technicians, some who used impact wrenches. When I ran my shop years ago I got a little warm when I caught a tech using an impact wrench on glow plugs or spark plugs. About as stupid as massaging your sweet heart with a Pneumatic Jack Hammer.
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