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 Post subject: OIL PAN DRAIN PLUG STRIPPED!
PostPosted: Thu Apr 05, 2012 4:26 am 
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O.K. people, I won't bore you with the details, just the bare basic facts.

I took my 2006 Jeep Liberty CRD into the dealer to have the oil changed, and they stripped the threads in the drain hole of the oil pan. This has happened before on the other '06 Liberty CRD the family owns, and at that time it was clear that it was the dealer's fault, so they installed a new oil pan free of charge, (at considerable expense, I might add). This time it is unclear if the culprit was the dealer, or it was me, as I am normally the one who changes the oil on all of the family vehicles. In any event I am quite sure that the dealer will not be so generous this time, and it looks like I may be paying the repair bill.

The dealer says I have two choices; either purchase a new oil pan and have it installed, (about $1000.00 CDN for the pan alone, not including labour - ouch!), or have the technician install a helicoil threaded insert for about $150.00, which apparently only works about 50% of the time.

Is there another solution that I have overlooked? What about that Fomoto, (?), oil pan drain petcock I have read about on this website?

I need a solution soon, as it needs to be removed from the fast lube department to the regular service department to try and solve a recurring check engine light issue; the dreaded P2099 turbo underboost problem that plagues these vehicles.

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Edmonton, Alberta, Canada
T6J 1S5

Tel: 1-780-434-2324
Mobile: 1-780-844-0135
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 Post subject: Re: OIL PAN DRAIN PLUG STRIPPED!
PostPosted: Thu Apr 05, 2012 9:19 am 
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Location: Torrington, CT
you need the following:
41/64 drill bit
18x1.5mm tap
F104 Fumoto drain valve
The whole thing should be around $50 (US) total.
total labor time is no more than 10 minutes (if you're slow)


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 Post subject: Re: OIL PAN DRAIN PLUG STRIPPED!
PostPosted: Thu Apr 05, 2012 10:04 am 
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I went through this...on my first oil change it felt like the plug wouldn't tighten. I drilled larger hole and tapped new plug...total cost less than $10. I went to advanced auto with my original plug and found a plug that the inside of the threads was larger than the outside of the threads of the factory plug. I also got a fairly coarse thread since it was going into aluminum and made sure it had a large mating surface area so it would be hard to strip in the future. I cleaned the hole up with the proper drill size for the tap, tapped it using a shop vac while i tapped and drilled.

Of course there was the cost of gaskets & oil, but that's a given in this situation.

If you are extremely careful you can drill at a slow enough rate and watch the chips as they fall to ensure they all come off and fall down and you don't even have to pull the pan. I was just paranoid about it, but there were no chips in the pan so I did good. :D

Only down side of going largest available drain plug is what if the dealership strips it next time?!? lol I always did my own changes so I didn't have to worry about that.

I would recommend pulling the pan to drill/tap since you get this really paranoid feeling and do it anyway no matter how careful you are drilling/tapping. lol

- Mark

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 Post subject: Re: OIL PAN DRAIN PLUG STRIPPED!
PostPosted: Thu Apr 05, 2012 5:25 pm 
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I had the same thing happen last week at Walmart. I just dropped the jeep off at the local Dodge dealer and they are replacing the oil pan and plug to the tune of over $1000. Walmart is footing the bill and have me in a rental till my jeep gets fixed.

Chris L


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 Post subject: Re: OIL PAN DRAIN PLUG STRIPPED!
PostPosted: Thu Apr 05, 2012 7:16 pm 
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Location: ingalls, in
Same thing happened to me. I put a fumoto valve in with jb weld and hasnt leaked for over 3 years.

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 Post subject: Re: OIL PAN DRAIN PLUG STRIPPED!
PostPosted: Thu Apr 05, 2012 8:03 pm 
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Spark-plug repair kit with solid threaded collars - $29 for the kit which includes the tap and the collars. Get the M14x1.25 kit, which will then be your new drain plug size, you need a normal drain plug and an O-ring to make the seal against the shoulders of the bolt and the pan.

Anyone pulling or replacing the entire pan b/c of this bad design is just NUTS - Half the car has to be removed to pull that pan. Anything you drill will be stuck to the drill bit or the tap, OR will be sent directly into the filter where it will never leave. The oil pump isn't a fragile thing, it is designed to suck up the worst of whatever is in the pan normally and send it into the filter... A few small chips that I DOUBT would ever make it upwards against gravity won't bother it and won't hurt your engine.

If you want to still spend that $1000... Send it to me for the lesson I just gave you. At least then you will know it went to supporting Jeep-centric research and longevity projects that will benefit your Jeep in the future! :mrgreen:

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 Post subject: Re: OIL PAN DRAIN PLUG STRIPPED!
PostPosted: Sat Apr 14, 2012 3:19 am 
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Thanks to all of you who sent replies; you all have been helpful.

The following is what has happened at the dealership since the oil pan drain plug hole had been "stripped".
The next day after dropping off my Liberty at the dealership for the oil change and diagnosis of the check engine light issue, manager of the quick lube department called me up to say that they were mistaken, and that the oil pan drain plug hole had NOT stripped it threads. This was a surprising revelation, as I myself had seen a couple of very thin shards of aluminum threading come off of the plug after the hole was declared stripped and the plug removed the day before.

Apparently, a technician came over from the service department ready to attempt to install a threaded insert into the hole, only to find out that the threads were still O.K. :? :?: :!: According to the technician, the reason the drain plug would not tighten up was that it was the wrong plug! :shock: The quick lube manager then said that he installed the correct plug and torqued it to specification. This is a very strange turn of events to me because I purchased this "wrong" plug from the very same dealership three or four years earlier.

The original plug was of a different style - a flush mount type that used an 8mm allen key as its driver. This original plug was starting to get sloppy in the 8mm hex hole from all of the oil changes I had performed, so I decided to go and get a new one. The new replacement plug is a standard style that utilizes a large 7/8" hex head. I recall being concerned by this new style when I picked it up, especially by the large hex head; large heads require large wrenches or sockets/ratchet handles/breaker bars that make it easy to over torque the drain plug. This can be very dicey when dealing with a steel plug in an aluminum hole. The cynic in me believes that this was done deliberately by Chrysler so that it would be easy to strip out the oil pan drain plug hole. From the replies I have received to this subject on this forum, it seems to me that the cynic in me is correct.

Now I am sure that I know what you are thinking at this point, and that would be to ask me what the big deal is - after all, I had already wrote that the technician had said that the drain plug was the wrong one. Read on...

I received a voice mail message 2 days ago from the service writer dealing with my other problems with the Liberty. He had been doing some checking into my concerns with the drain plug issue, and discovered that the drain plug I had purchased 3 - 4 years ago WAS the correct plug for the Liberty CRD engine. The parts department apparently looked up the history of my parts purchases, found the invoice for the time I purchased the replacement plug, and double checked the part number to see that it was the correct updated number. As far as they are concerned, I received the correct drain plug.

So, what gives here? I have a dealership technician on one hand stating I had the wrong drain plug installed in the Liberty CRD, and the parts department of the same dealership on the other hand stating I have the correct plug installed. The service writer also stated that my other Liberty CRD has the correct drain plug in it. He should know this due to the fact that this dealer had to install a new oil pan because the quick lube department stripped the oil pan drain plug hole when they changed the oil before selling the vehicle to me, (the drain plugs on both vehicles look exactly the same).

Has anyone else encountered this problem? It is frustrating to think that my own dealer can not get an agreement between departments regarding a simple part. Do I have the correct drain plugs installed in both of my CRDs? Who knows? Are the threads in the drain plug holes of both vehicles still in really good shape? Who knows? It is enough to drive me batty! :? :banghead:

So, here I am left wondering what to do when it comes to ordering fumoto drain plug valves, as I want to resolve this issue once and for all and not worry any more about stripping out drain plug holes. Should I order two valves threaded to mate correctly with a drain plug hole with O.E.M. threads, or should I simply say "piss on it" and order valves to fit a larger hole, and then drill out a larger drain plug hole in the oil pan and tap threads to fit?

Your replies are greatly appreciated.

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4J/1G Engineering
3727 - 117 Street N.W.
Edmonton, Alberta, Canada
T6J 1S5

Tel: 1-780-434-2324
Mobile: 1-780-844-0135
E-mail: INTCOMBUSTION2@hotmail.com


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 Post subject: Re: OIL PAN DRAIN PLUG STRIPPED!
PostPosted: Sat Apr 14, 2012 3:59 am 
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Pretty much confirms the general consensus regarding letting a dealership service the CRD, doesn't it?!

:ROTFL: or, maybe, :banghead:

Not a confidence inspiring experience, at any rate. Sorry Bro.

I pulled the flat-headed plug you mentioned and went with the Fumoto a long time ago - love it, no problems and wouldn't go back.

Mark

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 Post subject: Re: OIL PAN DRAIN PLUG STRIPPED!
PostPosted: Sat Apr 14, 2012 3:08 pm 
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Both plugs are correct. Chrysler released the large hex head one a few years ago because so many of the allen sockets were getting stripped out. There are a couple threads here on the subject.

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 Post subject: Re: OIL PAN DRAIN PLUG STRIPPED!
PostPosted: Sat Apr 14, 2012 4:56 pm 
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I am not willing to concede that the dealership - in this case at least - are dummies. There has to be some miscommunication somewhere, and I suspect it is between the technician who installed the new plug and the manager of the quick lube department. I'll get to the bottom of the situation once I have the time to go back to Edmonton to take care of personal matters and arrange for a new windshield for one of the CRDs - the wife came home yesterday with a cracked windshield because some idiot spun his tires after a long wait at a level train crossing.

In the meantime, I have to decide, (guess, actually), if the threads are good enough to install a standard replacement Fumoto, (F102?), or if I should simply drill out the drain plug hole, tap it and install a Fumoto F104.
Any thoughts on this, Folks?

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4J/1G Engineering
3727 - 117 Street N.W.
Edmonton, Alberta, Canada
T6J 1S5

Tel: 1-780-434-2324
Mobile: 1-780-844-0135
E-mail: INTCOMBUSTION2@hotmail.com


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 Post subject: Re: OIL PAN DRAIN PLUG STRIPPED!
PostPosted: Sat Apr 14, 2012 5:14 pm 
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As much fun as we have at their expense, it would be unfair to say that all dealers are dummies per se; so I agree with your sentiment. I think a more reasonable and supportable position would be that their error rate rises with unfamiliarity - and that for a variety of reasons they're often not very familiar with the diesel-unique features of the Liberty. This then leads to the substance behind our frequent snarkiness... ; ' ) After all, the errors typically cost us time and money, as we then have to figure things out for ourselves; essentially, we have to become most familiar with our rigs in order to service them well. Unless we're the rare and extremely fortunate ones to have an experienced CRD mechanic at a reputable dealership - and the funds to support them. I imagine they're folks just like us trying to make a living... :ALONE:

As for the Fumoto - If it were me I'd decide after putting a very bright light on the threads and inspecting them myself. Since the previous post mentioned that they would take and hold the proper torque, I'd lean towards 'good enough' but probably use a high-temp silicone to seal the Fumoto when I installed it; added insurance.

This would avoid the added risk/effort/expense of either pulling the pan or attempting to re-tap the pan with greased dies hoping to keep all the metal shavings out of the inside of the engine.

So, it is the potential for failure one way or another that is being judged when examining the existing threads and making that decision!

? Mark

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 Post subject: Re: OIL PAN DRAIN PLUG STRIPPED!
PostPosted: Sat Apr 14, 2012 5:57 pm 
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Get a self-tapping drain plug in the correct size for your hole, cost $10.00 maybe 15 minutes install. They make them for just your problem. :JEEPIN:

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 Post subject: Re: OIL PAN DRAIN PLUG STRIPPED!
PostPosted: Sat Apr 14, 2012 8:58 pm 
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I did that on my daughter's Dodge Intrepid (3.2L w/AL oil pan) - it lasted one oil change, tho YMMV. It was the standard oversize'd one from NAPA. After that, I pulled the pan and used a time-sert kit to drill, tap, and replace with a 14mm steel collar. Then, added the Fumoto and .. viola. No more worries.. or drips.

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 Post subject: Re: OIL PAN DRAIN PLUG STRIPPED!
PostPosted: Sat Apr 14, 2012 11:50 pm 
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Drill it while in place - The oil will be CONSTANTLY dripping onto the bit, and you don't need to worry about anything ever getting anywhere close to your engine... The FILTER is in the way!

I drilled mine after the "oversized" plug didn't work. The problem is that the factory threads are like 400-threads-per-inch or something stupid like that, so there isn't any DEPTH to those threads. I put in a collar from a spark plug repair kit, and the new size I wound up with is M14x1.25, I was able to EASILY source a plug in that size and now I have nice THICK threads in a solid collar that keeps my plug in place. Happy all around.

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2005 CRD Mods:
Ventilation violently installed in two different blocks.
Just remember: Bad noises = REALLY bad things.

It may be that the purpose of my CRD is to serve as a warning to others...


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 Post subject: Re: OIL PAN DRAIN PLUG STRIPPED!
PostPosted: Sun Apr 15, 2012 12:35 am 
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Quote:
I took my 2006 Jeep Liberty CRD into the dealer to have the oil changed, and they stripped the threads in the drain hole of the oil pan


I think your problem ends here!!

enough said!..?THEY STRIPPED THE THREADS!! its now their problem not yours!! STOP MAKING IT YOURS!

MAKE IT THEIRS! they broke it!!! period! how or why..doesn't matter..

if the 'commercical' places cannot change the oil in a jeep then they should go out of business..
we got my wife jeep, on '06, with 36kish miles...its now got almost 75k miles...hum I've not replace the pan because of stripped thread yet!! yes I have done all the work on it post warranty..ALL!! including a CP3 and a timing belt!

-dkenny

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 Post subject: OIL PAN DRAIN PLUG STRIPPED!
PostPosted: Sun Apr 15, 2012 7:32 pm 
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What he said its the dealers problem to fix it. Tell them you want a new pan and install a fumoto valve at that time and no more issues.

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 Post subject: Re: OIL PAN DRAIN PLUG STRIPPED!
PostPosted: Tue Apr 17, 2012 4:11 pm 
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There is also another type of "thread restore" kit. Loctite makes it (its called "Forma-a-thread") we use it alot at work. I work in a steelmill and there is an unbelievable amount of thermal cycling in the mill stands and very abusive too. It is a putty, similar idea a pipe dope, but obviously different compostion. Of course others on here have also posted correct ideas, so you can choose to do what you want.

Check this website out http://www.rshughes.com/products/079340_28654.html

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 Post subject: Re: OIL PAN DRAIN PLUG STRIPPED!
PostPosted: Fri Jul 27, 2012 5:47 pm 
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O.K. people; it is getting close to the time to change oil again in one of my CRD Liberty's. Those of you who have replied to this topic earlier this year know what kind of crap I have had to deal with regarding the oil drain plugs on CRD Liberty's.

I want to purchase two of these Fumoto oil valves. If the oil drain plug holes are O.K. which valve do I purchase? What valves do I purchase if the oil drain plug holes need to be drilled and tapped? I am sure that I can find this out myself, but I would also appreciate some feedback from the experts on this forum.

Best regards,

Jeff Bauer :mrgreen:

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Jeff A. Bauer
4J/1G Engineering
3727 - 117 Street N.W.
Edmonton, Alberta, Canada
T6J 1S5

Tel: 1-780-434-2324
Mobile: 1-780-844-0135
E-mail: INTCOMBUSTION2@hotmail.com


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 Post subject: Re: OIL PAN DRAIN PLUG STRIPPED!
PostPosted: Fri Jul 27, 2012 6:12 pm 
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Lots of right ways to fix it that will work.
When you drill it out, pack the drill flutes with grease to catch the chips.
When you tap it, pack the flutes with grease to catch the chips.
The flutes are the grooves the chips flow through as you do the deed.
Good luck.

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 Post subject: Re: OIL PAN DRAIN PLUG STRIPPED!
PostPosted: Thu Feb 07, 2013 2:59 am 
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Sorry for taking so long to get back to you all...

It turns out that all of my concerns about a stripped oil pan drain plug hole were overblown. In both cases a Fumoto oil drain valve was installed with a generous application of teflon pipe tape, and so far there has been no leaking of engine oil from either of the drain holes on the CRD Libertys that my Mother and Wife drive, (and the 2011 Chevy Silverado I use, for that matter). I am sure that the gasket provided with the valves would have been enough to do the job, but I wound some teflon tape around the threads just for some extra assurance as the threads in one of the drain holes did appear to be damaged a little.

So far there has been absolutely no leaking -- I am keeping my fingers crossed for the next oil change in the next few days on the CRD with the slightly damaged threads.

Jeff

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Jeff A. Bauer
4J/1G Engineering
3727 - 117 Street N.W.
Edmonton, Alberta, Canada
T6J 1S5

Tel: 1-780-434-2324
Mobile: 1-780-844-0135
E-mail: INTCOMBUSTION2@hotmail.com


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