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 Post subject: DTC P0401 & P0299 2005 liberty 2.8 diesel CRD
PostPosted: Sun Apr 08, 2012 4:54 pm 
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Location: central coast of Oregon
Hi, all! I'm hoping someone can offer additional information on my problem. Symptoms are. After short warm up, dies under load. Restarts normal right off. Then starts losing power, lucky to make it to 50mph without dieing again and slows to 20 mph on hills to keep it from dieing. Above codes always set but occasionally I get a P0093 for major fuel leak, but have none. Have replace or checked and cleaned the Fuel Filter, MAF, MAP, both CAC hoses and FCV flap with no visible problems. MAP was very dirty so cleaned and reinstalled. Fuel Pump pulls 25 in of vacume and holds. Then I re routed the EGH and test drove....with same problem and same to codes. I cleared codes and unpluged MAF sensor and FCV. Test drove and condition still exists, but new codes were P0102 for the MAF and P1140 for the FCV. At one point I installed an electric fuel pump before the filter, but no change, before, during or after the removal of the pump.

Any suggestions on what to try next short of removing the EGR itself. would a defective EGR still cause a problem if it has been deactived. Would the MAP sensor cause these conditions if it were actually defective.

Thanks for any help.


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 Post subject: Re: DTC P0401 & P0299 2005 liberty 2.8 diesel CRD
PostPosted: Sun Apr 08, 2012 5:06 pm 
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Location: central coast of Oregon
anyone know it this model has a waste gate that could be failing or adding to this type of problem?


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 Post subject: Re: DTC P0401 & P0299 2005 liberty 2.8 diesel CRD
PostPosted: Sun Apr 08, 2012 9:42 pm 
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We do not have a wastegate. The code for fuel leak is your key - it means "Air in fuel" and you need to focus on that.

You say you "cleaned" the fuel filter. Is this true? You can't actually "clean" it as I understand these, it can only be completely replaced. NAPA sells the filter for $30, I have also gotten them at O'Reilly's for the same price.

When changing the filter, a lot of problems have happened b/c there is a small 1" diameter rubber o-ring type seal in the center of the filter that will often get stuck to the fuel head. Since the fuel head is below your line of sight, you won't really notice that it stuck there unless you pull the fuel manager head off and tilt it. That little rubber seal being there, with the second rubber gasket from the new filter - Will NEVER tighten properly and WILL ALWAYS leak air into the system.

How did you measure the vacuum pull? The fuel pump won't be happy if you try and connect it to just a gauge, it isn't designed to work that way, and the gear pump is VERY strong.

The other thing to be aware of - Your CRD may not run perfectly for a day or two after changing the filter no matter what - You have gotten air into the system, and it will take a bit of driving to purge that out of the high pressure side of the pump and the fuel rail. I changed my filter recently and my CRD ran rough for a good 2 days after, but it does smooth out.

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 Post subject: Re: DTC P0401 & P0299 2005 liberty 2.8 diesel CRD
PostPosted: Mon Apr 09, 2012 1:09 pm 
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And even if you had changed the fuel filter once, if you got a bad tank of fuel, it could easily clog the new filter within a day or two.

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 Post subject: Re: DTC P0401 & P0299 2005 liberty 2.8 diesel CRD
PostPosted: Mon Apr 09, 2012 7:43 pm 
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Location: central coast of Oregon
Thanks, Yes the filter is a non cleanable part so it was replaced as indicated. There is no detectable air leak, at least at the filter, as the center o-ring seal has been checked and double checked. An electric fuel pump was installed for a short time inline prior to the fuel filter so there was no low pressure area at the filter during that time to cause a air leak. No other fuel leaks were detected either as would have been the case with 70-80 of fuel pressure from the electric pump. A clear fuel hose has been placed on the outlet end of the filter housing to monitor both for fuel quantity and air bubbles. Immediately after power failure fuel line was checked...No air bubbles and full of fuel. I have pulled the tank twice in the recent past to check for obstructions in the pickup area. And the fuel filter was changed twice within a two week period. This is in addition to the cleaning of parts listed above.

Can anyone tell me how common a true MAP sensor failure is? Other than being dirty and a good cleaning won't cure? While I have not gotten a MAP sensor code, I have heard that it can cause both the 401 and 299 codes I do have. Additionally, I did buy a code reader, Digital OBD II car reader. While pulling the codes and determining what the codes mean is not difficult, it is supposed to run diagnostics from the cars computer, but I have not figured out how to do that. I guess I will have to call the Manufacture, but any tips there would be helpful and appreciated! Thanks all. I feel like :5SHOTS: about now


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 Post subject: Re: DTC P0401 & P0299 2005 liberty 2.8 diesel CRD
PostPosted: Tue Apr 10, 2012 2:04 am 
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Wait - You put a fuel pump on it that was supplying EIGHTY PSI of pressure into the injection pump?????

I think you caused your own problem - This is a LOW PRESSURE system only, 4-6 psi is ALL that it needs or can handle!

If this is correct... I hate to say it, but I think that your injection pump will need to come out and be rebuilt by a Bosch diesel shop. The internal seals past the gear pump were NEVER designed to handle that kind of incoming pressure, and there is not a bypass for excess.

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Provider of high quality timing belt jobs anywhere on the I-95 corridor. Need help? Just ask! I've probably taken it apart more than most.

2005 CRD Mods:
Ventilation violently installed in two different blocks.
Just remember: Bad noises = REALLY bad things.

It may be that the purpose of my CRD is to serve as a warning to others...


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 Post subject: Re: DTC P0401 & P0299 2005 liberty 2.8 diesel CRD
PostPosted: Tue Apr 10, 2012 2:12 am 
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The CP3 itself, in the Cummins, produces its own first step of about 75 psi internally - while I think ours uses a reduced pressure of mid-50's. While those pressures are pretty extreme from what's required, they may not be fatal.

Get the pressure down to 15 psi or less and you may be just fine.

The codes point to FCV/EGR...

Mark

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 Post subject: Re: DTC P0401 & P0299 2005 liberty 2.8 diesel CRD
PostPosted: Tue Apr 10, 2012 12:54 pm 
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That particular pump was only installed for a few minutes as a test, and only after confirming that the internal gear pump applies pressure of 75 psi. The problem existed for weeks prior to that test and there has been no change since. The pump which was used for this test was rated at 65 psi.


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 Post subject: Re: DTC P0401 & P0299 2005 liberty 2.8 diesel CRD
PostPosted: Fri Apr 13, 2012 4:56 pm 
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Well Since I have checked everything else I could think of first, so I went ahead and removed the EGR valve, and what a job. The guy who said it is such a big job so one should go ahead and replace it regardless was right. I ordered a new one today. The old one, did appear to be sticking but if it was it was sticking closed. I still need to check the cylenoid. However since it is out, if I replace it then I will know for sure it is not the cause, if the problem is not cured. Can anyone tell me what the vacuum diaphragm is that is at the top rear of the turbo? I think it is the wastegate actuator, but someone said this model crd does not have a wastgate (which I think is wrong, but don't know for sure)? Thanks


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 Post subject: Re: DTC P0401 & P0299 2005 liberty 2.8 diesel CRD
PostPosted: Fri Apr 13, 2012 7:07 pm 
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Similar in function to a waste-gate, in that it controls boost. It's a variable vane turbo, so the valve controls the 'bite' (angle) of the vanes to control boost rather than dumping the excess to atmosphere...

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 Post subject: Re: DTC P0401 & P0299 2005 liberty 2.8 diesel CRD
PostPosted: Sat Apr 14, 2012 12:14 am 
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Can you get a refund on the EGR valve? A tune will solve your problems and prevent future failures. Give us a call if you want to discuss further.

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