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looking buy a trailer do I need the Torque Converter
http://www.lostjeeps.com/forum/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=5&t=69742		 Page 1 of 1
Author:  jlgail4309 [ Sat Jul 28, 2012 12:27 pm ]
Post subject:  looking buy a trailer do I need the Torque Converter
2012 SKYLINE Weekender Retro 186, This very small travel weighs only 2800 lbs. I'm thinking about the full Torque GDE and a Torque Converter. So I can power up big hills and Mountains .
With the weight being some what low. Will the stock Torque Converter hold up. Will the little truck have a hard time with out the tune. How much weight is to much for the stock jeep to pull well. Thanks for your help!
Author:  papaindigo [ Sat Jul 28, 2012 1:24 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: looking buy a trailer do I need the Torque Converter
See viewtopic.php?f=5&t=69117&p=739437#p739437 for our experience towing with the EcoTune and the stock OEM torque convertor.

Thoughts:
1. I think you need to give a little more thought to actual trailer weight. While this looks like a nice light rig the 2,725 dry weight is going to go up pretty quickly. For example a full 27 gallon load of water adds 216lbs then there is gray water, propane, clothes, food, cooking gear. I'm sure others that actually trailer this kind of rig can estimate better than I but I'd bet your actual tow weight is going to be on the order of 3,500 lbs.
2. 3,500lbs is well within the vehicle's capacity and others have towed a lot more long distance so I wouldn't worry about it.
3. you might want to check with Keith about which tune to get although I think you would be ok with either the EcoTune or the Full Torque EcoTune.
4. best I can say on your torque convertor is it will hold up until it doesn't. By that I mean if you back off when you experience shudder, trust me you will know when you do, and don't flog the power while towing too hard the TC should do just fine. But if you start having shudder problems a lot of the time then best upgrade to a Euro or SunCoast TC. That said unless you have the $s just laying around I would not proactively replace the TC as it may last for years but I would keep in mind that a replacement may have to be done.
5. if you tow a lot I'd shorten the transmission fluid change interval and if it's in high temp areas I'd consider a tranny cooler a worth while addition. If fact the latter is probably a better initial use of just a few $s than worry about the TC.

FYI if running in cruise we found that adding a bit of throttle before starting a grade made a significant difference in whether or not the CRD would have to down shift on the grade. No surprise there as cruise is "reactive" not proactive (e.g. it cannot look down the road ahead and anticipate the need for extra throttle)
Author:  jlgail4309 [ Sat Jul 28, 2012 10:48 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: looking buy a trailer do I need the Torque Converter
papaindigo thanks for taking so much time to respond to my post. thanks for info I really want the Jeep to preform well in the hills and Mountains of Colorado. With out having to Dog the thing all the time.
Author:  Rich [ Mon Jul 30, 2012 9:35 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: looking buy a trailer do I need the Torque Converter
TKB4 wrote:
The crd is rated to tow 5000 lbs in us and 7000 or so in europe but europe has different requirements on the trailers.
Yep, most countries require special testing to drag a trailer, and the trailer must be inspected with the tow vehicle..... they don't just let any yayhoo with a passenger license to drag 5k behind a 3k vehicle ;)

I have been towing various things behind my '05 with the factory TC, no F37 flash, and GDE full TQ Eco. This has been everything from my M416'esque expo trailer, to a u-haul car carrier hauling a Disco I (just south of 7k, never got over 45mph for the 10mi tow.. needed to be done). I do get shudder with ~1200lbs climbing 6% grades on the freeway. It only requires a: letting out of the throttle, or b: pinning the throttle to kick back into 4th. I can some times get shudder without a trailer, but the moons must be aligned properly for it to happen. I was hoping for the GDE to kill that TC while I was under my 1yr bumper to bumper when I bought my Jeep, but it hasn't happened two years later. When it does go, I will be dumping in the Euro.

Don't be shy about getting the tune, if you start to get shudder then stock up on the required bits for the repair and wait.
Author:  Rabert [ Wed Aug 01, 2012 12:53 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: looking buy a trailer do I need the Torque Converter
I don't meant to hijack this thread but I have a question related to towing, so.....I noticed that the RPMS with the OD OFF and doing bout 60MPH is around 2800ish on my CRD. Is this about what everyone else's CRD runs? Is that "harmful" to run that high for prolonged period of time, i.e. pulling a trailer? Thanks
Author:  GreenDieselEngineering [ Wed Aug 01, 2012 1:52 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: looking buy a trailer do I need the Torque Converter
Rabert wrote:
I don't meant to hijack this thread but I have a question related to towing, so.....I noticed that the RPMS with the OD OFF and doing bout 60MPH is around 2800ish on my CRD. Is this about what everyone else's CRD runs? Is that "harmful" to run that high for prolonged period of time, i.e. pulling a trailer? Thanks



No it is not going to hurt the engine or trans to pull with OD off (3rd gear lockup) at 60 mph with engine rpm at 2800. It is not the most fuel efficient zone for the engine, but with lockup engaged at least the tranny fluid will stay at a reasonable temp.
Author:  OldSkull [ Wed Aug 01, 2012 7:24 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: looking buy a trailer do I need the Torque Converter
You need to mention over heat problem if you do this on high hill, I tow my 3500 lbs. full loaded camping trailer in the Appalaches every year with F37 and ECO torque tune. The best way for me to do it is simply that:

You speed up to 60Mph in 4th gear and keep it there! Never let it go on 5th except on flat road. On some stepper hill you got no choice to downshift in 3th so in this specific case you remove the OD and keep the speed lower (45-55mph) you’re not racing your towing..

The goal is trying to keep the rpm around 2000 most of the time if possible because this is where the engine peak torque is, the more you rev up the engine the more hot he get, it's less a problem on an engine with cast iron head like you find on industrial diesel but it's another story on a VM motori. Just make some research about VM motori engine in Europe; they use them for many years so they know how to keep them alive.

Some London taxi got 500,000 on the counter and still counting... I will follow their advised...

To the OP : Your Jeep can tow this trailer without any mod but sooner or later you will need a new torque converter, the ECO torque tune give you more power, more torque, better economy and most important in "my" book he keep the EGR valve close most of the time! Go for it if you can, I never read any complaint from a member who bought it!
Author:  Rabert [ Wed Aug 01, 2012 7:39 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: looking buy a trailer do I need the Torque Converter
Thanks for the replies. I guess I will have to get used to the higher RPMs. Oldskull, we think alike the limited time I have pulled my camper I do the same motion of trying to keep it in the sweet spot. I have the F37 , from PO. Thinking on the EcoTune and glad to know someone else has the same combo and doin OK.
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