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Life after an oil drain... sigh..crd counseling anyone><?
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Author:  pianotips [ Sat Aug 18, 2012 10:31 am ]
Post subject:  Life after an oil drain... sigh..crd counseling anyone><?
I bought our crd from Georgia And drove it down to florida last year. It was love at first sight. The curves, the diesel roar, the mpg, the towing capacity, everything one could want in a diesel. I was getting 32 mpg on the way home. Changed the oil, etc.. But I didn't do the premarital counseling course...(the noob guide was awesome..sigh.). Took it a local dealership to look it over. They said everything was fine. The jeep would shudder we took it back. They said it was the fuel system that needed to be cleaned (290). Didn't fix it. The engine light came on. The dealership said it was the map sensor and charged us 480- for it.. We noticed oil leaking from the bottom after the last visit. On the trip home, we heard a loud hiss and pop and oil flooded out the back.... >< My baby was leaking oil cause the oil pin shot out.. Pulled over right away, shut the engine off. Towed her home and there she is sitting the last couple of weeks.

Here is what we've done since.

Re tapped the oil pin (put a 18 mm in there)
Refilled the oil.
Turned it on. Sounded fine. Drove it up a hill. and heard a weird noise.
Put a wrench up to the turbo.. and doesn't sound good, sounds very shot.
There she sits. We are in the local ministry (working with people to get off welfare, streets, etc... )..its our workhorse. We need her back, shes a blessing from God.

Alright now that im in the game to save my jeep.....
What first? What now? which turbo? GDE or stock? tc, mopar sc? wich mod first? ugh.......Help? I plan to move on this on Monday and get some things done. Anyone know a good crd mechanic in the north Tampa area ( i don't trust our dealerships in the area...)? If not. Can you give me advice so i can look over a mechanics shoulder and keep them honest? And finally what can i do myself as a noob (always wanted to try my hand at mechanical stuff).
Thank you a ton in advance.
Ray :)
Author:  Dennis MacGyver [ Sat Aug 18, 2012 11:21 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Life after an oil drain... sigh..crd counseling anyone><
How about some basics on the CRD....year.....miles.....F37 update ??

The shudder you felt MAY be the trany shudder everyone speaks of. Could be air in the fuel system from a leaky fuel filter heater wire port.

A MAP sensor from an auto parts store will cost you $60 - $110, got your butt spanked there !!

Also you need to join FaceBook and get hooked up to the Jeep Liberty CRD group, some good info & chat there too.

There's also CRD sections in these groups too;
http://www.jeepforum.com/forum/f28/

http://www.jeepkj.com/forum/f228/

This engine is a weird duck.....best to get educated-up, cowboy !

PS IF you do need a new turbo, look here; http://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_sacat=0 ... =200&rt=nc
Author:  WolverineFW [ Sat Aug 18, 2012 2:08 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Life after an oil drain... sigh..crd counseling anyone><
I think Camo was selling a used turbo on here for somewhere around $500-600 dollars..
Author:  pianotips [ Sat Aug 18, 2012 2:23 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Life after an oil drain... sigh..crd counseling anyone><
2005 crd 120000. Dont know bout the update. Has anyone tried an ebY aftermarket turbo with success? It shrudders and stalls out. had a mechanic friend look at it and he said its The turbo.won't touch the Jeep.,sigh.
Author:  racertracer [ Sat Aug 18, 2012 2:28 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Life after an oil drain... sigh..crd counseling anyone><
Pianotips, where is your ministry located?

Sirsam may be able to help with parts and labor.
Author:  pianotips [ Sat Aug 18, 2012 2:54 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Life after an oil drain... sigh..crd counseling anyone><
racertracer wrote:
Pianotips, where is your ministry located?

Sirsam may be able to help with parts and labor.
racertracer wrote:
Pianotips, where is your ministry located?

Sirsam may be able to help with parts and labor.


We are in dade city Florida. Where is sirsam loacated?
Author:  audiboy86 [ Sat Aug 18, 2012 3:38 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Life after an oil drain... sigh..crd counseling anyone><
Was there acttually oil spilling out of the exhaust? Also when did the shuddering happen were you going up hill or even on it hard. Also what oil wieght got used when the oil change happened? And first mods I would do as soon as I got this issue fix would be the EHM and either the ORM or GED tune.
Author:  geordi [ Sat Aug 18, 2012 4:17 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Life after an oil drain... sigh..crd counseling anyone><
Your turbo is most likely shot, however there is some good news: I have replaced my turbo (I'm the builder of the Frankenturbo) and I know where Dade City is. If you can source the turbo from Camo, it can be replaced reasonably easily. This will be your cheapest option, even if you pay me to come down there and do the repair for you.

HOWEVER - When you saw the oil slick behind you, how quickly did you shut the motor off and the cylinders ACTUALLY stopped rotating? If the answer is longer than 30 seconds from the original noise that you heard OR you merely shut the key off and did NOT first shift the transmission to neutral... You can EASILY have much more serious damage.

The instant you started losing oil, you started starving your engine. This is obvious. What is not, is that the SAME GALLERY that feeds the turbo, also directly feeds the crankshaft rod bearings. The #1 cylinder is the farthest from the oil supply, and will have starved first. Whether there is any damage is the question. I can describe in INTIMATE detail how the failure will have progressed through the engine if you did not catch it quick enough. The turbo may have died simply because it was spinning in excess of 30,000 RPM at the time, and when the engine was shut off, so was the oil flow (if it hadn't already depleted from the leak). The fact that your turbo is already making bad noises doesn't make me happy about the prospects for your engine - 30 seconds might even be too much time.

Let me know more and I can advise you what to look at next.
Author:  pianotips [ Sat Aug 18, 2012 6:44 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Life after an oil drain... sigh..crd counseling anyone><
Well, i heard the knoise. The light came on and i pulled over straight away. We are talking seconds. Aftet i shut it off i ran and opened the hood to see whats wrong . i then checked the oil pan pin. Oil was still leaking although dripping. I dont think it came out my pipe just all over the underside from the drain pan. The shrudder came when we would start to accelerate from a stop.
Author:  pianotips [ Sat Aug 18, 2012 6:48 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Life after an oil drain... sigh..crd counseling anyone><
Thanks for your help. Hope the last post helps. Is there more information i can add that,may help? Thsnks again.
Author:  geordi [ Sat Aug 18, 2012 7:16 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Life after an oil drain... sigh..crd counseling anyone><
Was the engine still running while you were pulling over?
When did you actually turn the key off, in relation to when the oil idiot light came on? This is important, because that idiot light WILL NOT come on until you are COMPLETELY out of oil, and at that point, you have less than seconds.

You said you turned the engine back on and heard things - Describe the noises as best you can, and where you suspect they are coming from. How much oil did you put back in?
Author:  pianotips [ Sat Aug 18, 2012 7:58 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Life after an oil drain... sigh..crd counseling anyone><
Engine was still running whEn i shut it off. Prob 5-10 sec. Its fine until its under load. Then it makes a not pretty noise. Like a grinding . I hope its not the engine. after we tapped it we re filled it to max.
Author:  geordi [ Sat Aug 18, 2012 8:00 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Life after an oil drain... sigh..crd counseling anyone><
pianotips wrote:
Engine was still running whEn i shut it off. Prob 5-10 sec. Its fine until its under load. Then it makes a not pretty noise. Like a grinding . I hope its not the engine. after we tapped it we re filled it to max.


Sorry, that wasn't entirely helpful - Did you shut the engine off on the side of the road or while you were still moving, allowing it to coast to the side?
If you shut it off while still moving, did you shift to neutral first? This is important, because otherwise the engine will remain locked to the transmission, and continue to spin even when not injecting fuel. The oil pump is mechanical, but it does not sound good so far.

Where is the grinding noise coming from? (Don't start it to find out!) Please use as many words to describe this as possible, the sequence of events is important - it can be the difference between just replacing the turbo, or removing the entire engine from the vehicle to replace all the crankshaft bearings. Right now, it sounds like the crankshaft bearings will need to be replaced.

The result if you try to run it again or drive it anywhere will be what happened to my CRD when I lost the turbo and let it continue running for just 30 seconds or so with the oil being pumped into the exhaust instead of to the cylinder bearings: You WILL LOSE THE ENGINE. In my case, the #1 cylinder piston broke apart, the rod somehow inverted, and it punched a hole in the oil pan. Very bad noises. At this point, I suspect you are in the first stages of this same failure - your #1 cylinder rod bearings have probably been partly melted by the lack of oil, and the sounds you heard were the rod journals hitting the crankshaft itself.
Author:  pianotips [ Sat Aug 18, 2012 8:16 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Life after an oil drain... sigh..crd counseling anyone><
Right around the turbo area. Its like in front of the passenger but lower. So lower right side of the engine bay.
Author:  pianotips [ Sat Aug 18, 2012 8:19 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Life after an oil drain... sigh..crd counseling anyone><
Almost like it under the engine.
Author:  geordi [ Sat Aug 18, 2012 8:32 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Life after an oil drain... sigh..crd counseling anyone><
That will be the crankshaft bearings then. Congratulations, you are the proud owner of the second CRD that I am aware of to completely run itself out of oil and eat itself in less time than it took to read this sentence.

Your engine needs to be pulled. I hope you know a good shop, because unfortunately, the dealers are completely useless on this vehicle. In this instance, they will suggest that the entire engine be replaced, and perhaps your insurance company will agree to pay for it... Because you are looking at the start of a MINIMUM $3500 repair job, closer to $8000 if the entire block is replaced.

As it is still capable of running, the engine does not need to be outright replaced - that is only what the clueless dealer will suggest to pad their own bottom line - but the repair will require someone skilled in deep engine rebuilding. I'm not that person, you truly need a professional now.
Author:  jinstall [ Sat Aug 18, 2012 9:00 pm ]
Post subject:  Life after an oil drain... sigh..crd counseling anyone>
Not sure if I was the last to have the dealer replace my engine but I can send you a copy of the invoice for $8300.
Author:  racertracer [ Sat Aug 18, 2012 9:32 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Life after an oil drain... sigh..crd counseling anyone><
First and foremost you will need a qualified mechanic capable of diagnosing the problem. You need confirmation and a proposal of repair costs.
Author:  racertracer [ Sat Aug 18, 2012 9:35 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Life after an oil drain... sigh..crd counseling anyone><
BTW what is an OIL PIN?
Author:  TJ2 [ Sat Aug 18, 2012 9:48 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Life after an oil drain... sigh..crd counseling anyone><
racertracer wrote:
BTW what is an OIL PIN?


It's right down there next to the drain plug.
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