LOST JEEPS
http://www.lostjeeps.com/forum/phpBB3/

CRD WK2 grand Cherokee now available!
http://www.lostjeeps.com/forum/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=5&t=76274		 Page 1 of 1
Author:  Silverdiesel [ Fri Aug 09, 2013 6:17 pm ]
Post subject:  CRD WK2 grand Cherokee now available!
Posted in general diesel but I am posting here.
CRD related as Jeep dives into it again.
Just about everyone knows these things were coming but the order gates finally opened today with delivery Oct 13.
And just about everyone knows this will be a V6 VM Motori Clean Diesel with urea injection.
Interesting findings as I dug deeper as I am considering buying one of these SUVs.
Noted:
--It uses solenoid style injectors not piezos (cheaper way to go?)

--It does have a fuel talk lift pump! Tanks are a sattlebag style on both sides of driveshaft and has 2 pumps as one feeds to other side of sattlebag then that pump gets fuel to a Bosh CP4 HPIP (high pressure tinjection pump) getting to 1800 Bar ( 29000 psi! )

--Has a two filter water separator filter system ( like those FASS performance units) that sits behind transfer case. Service calls for transfer case skid plate be removed to access filters .

--It has ceramic glow plugs(!!).

--Best I can tell axle diffs are Dana and front is aluminum BUT so is the rear! Highest axle ratio is 3.54 (application for trail rated Overland with electronic controlled LSD on rear). Axles are fixed like KJ front but this is fully independent suspension.

--Diesel only and like VW CR just a little RUG and injector pump is shot with no warranty .

--It uses a water cooled (not oil cooled ) turbo charger.

It's another VM Motori So best to get the extended warranty for drive train(regular warranty stops at 36 K miles).

Will the ceramic glow plugs be a problem again? Will the EGR SCR DPF systems totally goof up the intake and foul the Map too? Will it have a less than perfect thermostat / viscous heater system? Did they use stronger head studs like ARP ensure minimum head failures? This motor is based on high quality D2 used in Europe and US Diesel is junk and has Chrysler seen this going thru this time and give the US spec engine more robust engineering in the areas
needed? We shall see!

Roland

PS At least with Clean Diesel the dust created by the wearing tires of this vehicle is more than the soot level coming out of the tailpipe!
Author:  Hexus [ Fri Aug 09, 2013 7:29 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: CRD WK2 grand Cherokee now available!
It's $46,000 to start with no option to get it on the cheaper models, even at the engine markup cost.

Chrysler screwed the pooch yet again.

You might as well buy a Cayenne.
Author:  Drewd [ Fri Aug 09, 2013 11:28 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: CRD WK2 grand Cherokee now available!
Solenoid injectors in a cp4 pump system? Everything I've read about CP4 systems indicate Piezo injectors. Solenoid injectors aren't fast enough for the rapid/successive injections required for each individual "ignition" cyle. Can you share your reference on the injectors? Thanks!

Speak of CP4, everything I've read about them is that they are not as durable and the slightest hint of water in fuel and you are out 8-10k dollars for repairs. Having the fuel water filters in a hard to get area sounds like a PITA considering CP4 systems in other vehicles require very frequent checking and draining.

A water cooled turbo is a nice new option beneficial mainly for those folks who never do a proper turbo cooldown.

As for ceramic glow plugs, I love them. I have 125,000 miles of ceramic use in my KJ CRD and 66k miles of ceramic use in my WK CRD (I'm not 100% sure that the 07-08 WK CRDs use ceramic so please correct me if I'm wrong).

07-08 Grand Cherokee CRDs all had lift pumps in fuel tank so having them in the 14 GC CRD is no biggie except now you have two pumps that can fail instead of one!

07-08 GC CRDs had DPF filters that had a spotless exhaust (exhaust tip is cleaner than 2 of my gassers).N02 emission on the 07-08 GC CRDs were higher, though.

While I rag on VM Motori's 2.8L design, the engine, itself, has been very good to me. Premature rocker wear in it, I feel, is result of CAFE standards and Jeep spec'ing 0w-40 to meet them. Not sure about 2.8L head gasket issue but I wonder if ECO and hot tunes increased cylinder pressure are causing those probems.

If I had the money, I would probably buy an '15 GC CRD
Author:  truckbouy2 [ Sat Aug 10, 2013 11:54 am ]
Post subject:  Re: CRD WK2 grand Cherokee now available!
I'll stick my neck out here and estimate a 2 or 3yr life of this Chrysler high price experiment. Speculation 1, low demand due too high cost, speculation 2, technicalogically too far advanced for the dealer repair shops, therfore a whole lot of parts being replaced under warranty that don't need to be because no one will have the ability or enough traning to know what's REALLY wrong = frustrated customers.
Author:  Silverdiesel [ Sat Aug 10, 2013 11:17 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: CRD WK2 grand Cherokee now available!
I understand there is an Ecodiesel Dodge Ram 1/2 ton available for 2014 so CF is getting serious about this diesel invasion.

Yeah there is BMW, Volkswagen, Mercedes, Audi and Porche SUV available in diesel here in the US. But we are talking Jeep Diesel - closest thing to an American SUV unlike the others. Sure the motor is Italian and transmission German and parts from all over the world but that Japanese Honda you are driving was most likely made in USA with the motor imported from Japan....

JeepGarage.com is a wonderful forum with lots of tech references pertanant to 2014 WK2. I am able to look at links with SM pages pasted containing lots of info. These forum members are finding all the facts about the VM Motori 630 motor used in CF applications and I am learning lots of info. These guys will have a 2014 SM and parts fiche available just like Sir Sam and this will be great.

Oh and go to your Dealer and grab a 2014 WK2 sales booklet and inside there is a Buyers Guide with a white cover. Open this to the engines available and here is one spot where Jeep mentions solenoid injectors used on the diesel.

Roland
Author:  Silverdiesel [ Sat Aug 10, 2013 11:40 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: CRD WK2 grand Cherokee now available!
Oops it's jeepgarage.org. Not .com.
Author:  MrMopar64 [ Sun Aug 11, 2013 1:36 am ]
Post subject:  Re: CRD WK2 grand Cherokee now available!
The CP4 pump can be used regardless of the injectors type. The CRS2.20 injectors on the new WK2 (and the DS) run at 2000bar and are capable to run up to >7 injectors per cycle if so desired.
Fuel-water separator isn't necessarily like the FASS setup - it's two filters in parallel, i.e. 2 smaller ones = one larger one.

The in-tank lift pump is in place because there is no suction pump on the CP4. The built-in suction pump is only effective up to certain delivery rates, beyond that in-tank is the way to go.

Ceramic glow plugs are the new generation from Bosch, much more durable than the old used previously. You can drop them on the floor and they won't break/shatter/crack/etc, unlike the old ones.

Front/rear axles are from ZF, replacing the previous units made by MB. Axle ratio is 3.45.

Turbo is water- and oil-cooled.

Best wishes when you order one!
Author:  EAB [ Sun Aug 11, 2013 1:35 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: CRD WK2 grand Cherokee now available!
A little clarification, the 2 fuel pumps in the fuel tank are one electric pump and one siphon pump. As the electric pump runs, it creates a siphon in a tube to the secondary side of the tank. The primary side fills up and spills back over to the secondary side. There are 2 sending units so the level data is averaged out to give you your fuel level. This system has been used for at least 10 years by Chrysler so they should have it worked out.
Author:  MRausch82 [ Sun Aug 11, 2013 4:25 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: CRD WK2 grand Cherokee now available!
Hexus wrote:
It's $46,000 to start with no option to get it on the cheaper models, even at the engine markup cost.

Chrysler screwed the pooch yet again.

You might as well buy a Cayenne.

I agree with Hexus. My wife wants a Cayenne diesel for her next car...
Author:  kjjet [ Sun Aug 11, 2013 7:34 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: CRD WK2 grand Cherokee now available!
$46,000 for a Jeep with a VM engine? Sorry... no way. I like to take mine off road at times. To much $$ to chance scratching it.
Author:  geordi [ Sun Aug 11, 2013 8:09 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: CRD WK2 grand Cherokee now available!
I'm debating what to do with the 97 Grand Cherokee because of that very reason - I wouldn't want to take anything new and that expensive off-road as a toy.

The other side of it is that it is still a VM engine. Taking that off road where tow trucks can't find you... Brave or foolish?

Off road toys, give me a quad or a classic Wrangler - you can't kill those things.
Author:  cevans [ Tue Aug 13, 2013 4:34 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: CRD WK2 grand Cherokee now available!
Agreed with others - its too expensive. $46 base, quickly pushing $60k with options. For that money you could have a Porsche/Mercedes/BMW diesel in the driveway instead, get better service (free scheduled maintenance with the BMW) and better resale too.
Author:  GreenDieselEngineering [ Tue Aug 13, 2013 5:22 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: CRD WK2 grand Cherokee now available!
Drove a Summit over the weekend for fun. That model is very upscale and most likely the best vehicle Chrysler ever made. Every creature comfort imaginable...even cooled seats. Felt like I should take my shoes off before getting in. Did not care for the electronic shifter that always stays in the same place. This Jeep had the 3.6l gas motor unfortunately. The air suspension is very cool and useful at same time. However, after shutting off the vehicle and exiting, the air ride lowers jeep and makes a loud racket when bleeding off pressure. Hopefully that was a bad unit or jeep will have some customer complaints. They spent thousands making the vehicle super quiet and isolated, a little muffler on the air suspension is not asking too much.

The diesel version does put the price point very high. I think they will have many first time diesel owners buying these if the dealer can sell the towing and fuel economy benefits. If you have $55 sitting around to buy a summit, what is an extra $5 for the diesel?? This new Jeep is on par or better than its competitors in the high end segment. Longevity unproven of course.

Hopefully the truck will be at a better price point and have the usefulness to pay for itself over time. The Wrangler will be just around the corner if Jeep does it right.
Author:  EAB [ Tue Aug 13, 2013 8:04 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: CRD WK2 grand Cherokee now available!
There has been a muffler/filter on the compressor in the past and they have been quiet. There was one where the vent hose was kinked and it sounded like a duck.
Page 1 of 1 All times are UTC - 5 hours [ DST ]
Powered by phpBB © 2000, 2002, 2005, 2007 phpBB Group
http://www.phpbb.com/