Prefilling the oil filter

Goglio704 · **Posted:** Sun Apr 16, 2006 10:00 am

I did my first oil change yesterday. I am in the habit of filling the new oil filter - even in horizontal applications like the CRD. The CRD filter refused to accept any oil. A little splash in the top that didn't go anywhere. Anybody know what is up with this? I really didn't like the six seconds at startup with the oil pressure light on.

oldnavy · **Posted:** Sun Apr 16, 2006 10:13 am

Goglio704 wrote:

I did my first oil change yesterday. I am in the habit of filling the new oil filter - even in horizontal applications like the CRD. The CRD filter refused to accept any oil. A little splash in the top that didn't go anywhere. Anybody know what is up with this? I really didn't like the six seconds at startup with the oil pressure light on.

As long as you use synthetic oil it will not cause any abnormal wear, so don't worry about it my friend.

Goglio704 · **Posted:** Sun Apr 16, 2006 10:19 am

Not so much worried. Just have never seen an oil filter refuse to soak up oil. Was wondering if there is some sort of valve down in there that interfered? Maybe the micron rating is really fine?

Reggie · **Posted:** Sun Apr 16, 2006 10:30 am

Goglio704 wrote:

Not so much worried. Just have never seen an oil filter refuse to soak up oil. Was wondering if there is some sort of valve down in there that interfered? Maybe the micron rating is really fine?

Yes, there is a valve in the center of the filter that prevents you from prefilling. I believe - but could be wrong - that the WIX filter does not have this feature. I know that the OEM, STP, and Purolator has it.

oldnavy · **Posted:** Sun Apr 16, 2006 11:24 am

Reggie wrote:

Goglio704 wrote:

Not so much worried. Just have never seen an oil filter refuse to soak up oil. Was wondering if there is some sort of valve down in there that interfered? Maybe the micron rating is really fine?

Yes, there is a valve in the center of the filter that prevents you from prefilling. I believe - but could be wrong - that the WIX filter does not have this feature. I know that the OEM, STP, and Purolator has it.

It's the anti flow back valve, but you may be able to get it through by slightly depressing the valve.

RFCRD · **Posted:** Sun Apr 16, 2006 12:42 pm

I have thinking about the same thing, but with the fuel filter.

Every diesel I've ever serviced needs the fuel filters primed before installing but never had one with the clever little hand pump on the filter head. Never worked on one that ran at this high pressure. I assume that prefilling the filter is also needed on the CRD. What is the chance that the small amount unfiltered fuel getting to the Common Rail pump or injectors will cause damage?

gsbrockman · **Posted:** Sun Apr 16, 2006 1:23 pm

I always prime the oil filter on my 2003 Dodge RAM 2500 w/CTD and my 2001 Dodge Neon.......it's next to impossible with the CRD engine though, due to the fact it screws on nearly horizontally. Never even gave it a thought to even try it due to that reason.......if the filter won't prime, it's probably due to a built-in anti-drain back valve or some kind of pressure relief/bypass valve internally.
Greg

gsbrockman · **Posted:** Sun Apr 16, 2006 1:25 pm

RFCRD wrote:

What is the chance that the small amount unfiltered fuel getting to the Common Rail pump or injectors will cause damage?

Prime it with some Power Service or other diesel fuel additive.
Greg

Goglio704 · **Posted:** Sun Apr 16, 2006 9:32 pm

The horizontal mounting of the oil filter does produce some mess and waste if you prefill, but it will usually get the oil pressure light out in half the time versus a dry filter. Or at least it has on every other engine I've tried it on. With synthetic oil and long oil change intervals it is probably not a big deal either way. Somebody mentioned a Wix filter for the CRD? I didn't think they had one out. Last time I looked at their website it didn't list one.

Later:

Never mind, they list one now.

onthehunt · **Posted:** Sun Apr 16, 2006 9:54 pm

I would think you would be surprised at how long it takes to use that "little" bit of fuel in the fuel filter. When you change the fuel filter, plug the big center hole and fill the filter slowly. This allows no unfiltered fuel to reach your injectors and eliminates priming with the pump. Or you could just put it on empty and start pumping.

deadrx7conv · **Joined:** Sun Apr 23, 2006 7:43 pm **Posts:** 6

Some oil filter info:

The CRD uses the same filter as the Focus (Zetec DOHC).

Purolator L25230/Fram PH8316/Wix 51315/Motorcraft FL2005. These filters have the 2nd no-spill valve to make removal less messy for better filter recycling.

I wonder if Wix made a catalog mistake by recommending the 51516, which is the more common Ford filter size(PH3600/FL400s/PL20195). These can be prefilled prior to use.

RFCRD · **Posted:** Sun Apr 23, 2006 11:47 pm

deadrx7conv wrote:

Some oil filter info:

The CRD uses the same filter as the Focus (Zetec DOHC).

Purolator L25230/Fram PH8316/Wix 51315/Motorcraft FL2005. These filters have the 2nd no-spill valve to make removal less messy for better filter recycling.

I wonder if Wix made a catalog mistake by recommending the 51516, which is the more common Ford filter size(PH3600/FL400s/PL20195). These can be prefilled prior to use.

One thing my Service Manager cautioned me about with buying an oil filter for this motor is make sure it has a backflow valve. Many of the cheaper brands available at discount stores will fit and work, but don't have the valve.

RFCRD · **Posted:** Sun Apr 23, 2006 11:56 pm

onthehunt wrote:

I would think you would be surprised at how long it takes to use that "little" bit of fuel in the fuel filter. When you change the fuel filter, plug the big center hole and fill the filter slowly. This allows no unfiltered fuel to reach your injectors and eliminates priming with the pump. Or you could just put it on empty and start pumping.

With filling the fuel filter, I wonder if the transfer pump in the tank will prime the filter if you open the bleeder nipple and turn the key to on.

oldnavy · **Posted:** Mon Apr 24, 2006 7:36 am

RFCRD wrote:

With filling the fuel filter, I wonder if the transfer pump in the tank will prime the filter if you open the bleeder nipple and turn the key to on.

You would think so, but I didn't think we had the lift pump in the tank. Thought I read somewhere we didn't, I could be wrong though.

retmil46 · **Posted:** Tue Apr 25, 2006 12:48 am

oldnavy wrote:

RFCRD wrote:

With filling the fuel filter, I wonder if the transfer pump in the tank will prime the filter if you open the bleeder nipple and turn the key to on.

You would think so, but I didn't think we had the lift pump in the tank. Thought I read somewhere we didn't, I could be wrong though.

Nope, you're right, no pump in the tank. Low pressure lift pump and high pressure injection pump are built inside a common housing, mounted on drivers side at front of engine, driven off timing belt if I remember correctly.

Lift pump has to suck fuel all the way from the tank, up thru the fuel filter, and then another couple feet up to itself at the engine. Get an air leak anywhere between the fuel tank and the pump, and you're not going anywhere. IMHO, a sucky (pun intended) design, only benefit is it saved them the cost of a separate pump.

RFCRD · **Posted:** Tue Apr 25, 2006 6:39 am

retmil46 wrote:

oldnavy wrote:

RFCRD wrote:

With filling the fuel filter, I wonder if the transfer pump in the tank will prime the filter if you open the bleeder nipple and turn the key to on.

You would think so, but I didn't think we had the lift pump in the tank. Thought I read somewhere we didn't, I could be wrong though.

Nope, you're right, no pump in the tank. Low pressure lift pump and high pressure injection pump are built inside a common housing, mounted on drivers side at front of engine, driven off timing belt if I remember correctly.

Lift pump has to suck fuel all the way from the tank, up thru the fuel filter, and then another couple feet up to itself at the engine. Get an air leak anywhere between the fuel tank and the pump, and you're not going anywhere. IMHO, a sucky (pun intended) design, only benefit is it saved them the cost of a separate pump.

Oh, this is going to be entertaining. This is the same way a bus is plumbed. They pull fuel from 30 ft. away but have stainless steel lines, a check valve near the filter and use steel braid reinforced flex hoses to keep them from imploding. That cheap fuel line won't hold it's shape under vaccume. I see another mod sometime in the future.

oldnavy · **Posted:** Tue Apr 25, 2006 7:23 am

RFCRD wrote:

retmil46 wrote:

oldnavy wrote:

RFCRD wrote:

With filling the fuel filter, I wonder if the transfer pump in the tank will prime the filter if you open the bleeder nipple and turn the key to on.

You would think so, but I didn't think we had the lift pump in the tank. Thought I read somewhere we didn't, I could be wrong though.

Nope, you're right, no pump in the tank. Low pressure lift pump and high pressure injection pump are built inside a common housing, mounted on drivers side at front of engine, driven off timing belt if I remember correctly.

Lift pump has to suck fuel all the way from the tank, up thru the fuel filter, and then another couple feet up to itself at the engine. Get an air leak anywhere between the fuel tank and the pump, and you're not going anywhere. IMHO, a sucky (pun intended) design, only benefit is it saved them the cost of a separate pump.

Oh, this is going to be entertaining. This is the same way a bus is plumbed. They pull fuel from 30 ft. away but have stainless steel lines, a check valve near the filter and use steel braid reinforced flex hoses to keep them from imploding. That cheap fuel line won't hold it's shape under vaccume. I see another mod sometime in the future.

I was thinking the same thing and wondering how much non solid fuel line is being used. Older VW's had IP pulling vacuum from their tanks through plastic lines with rubber hose connectors without problems.

RFCRD · **Posted:** Tue Apr 25, 2006 7:43 am

oldnavy wrote:

RFCRD wrote:

retmil46 wrote:

oldnavy wrote:

RFCRD wrote:

With filling the fuel filter, I wonder if the transfer pump in the tank will prime the filter if you open the bleeder nipple and turn the key to on.

You would think so, but I didn't think we had the lift pump in the tank. Thought I read somewhere we didn't, I could be wrong though.

Nope, you're right, no pump in the tank. Low pressure lift pump and high pressure injection pump are built inside a common housing, mounted on drivers side at front of engine, driven off timing belt if I remember correctly.

Lift pump has to suck fuel all the way from the tank, up thru the fuel filter, and then another couple feet up to itself at the engine. Get an air leak anywhere between the fuel tank and the pump, and you're not going anywhere. IMHO, a sucky (pun intended) design, only benefit is it saved them the cost of a separate pump.

Oh, this is going to be entertaining. This is the same way a bus is plumbed. They pull fuel from 30 ft. away but have stainless steel lines, a check valve near the filter and use steel braid reinforced flex hoses to keep them from imploding. That cheap fuel line won't hold it's shape under vaccume. I see another mod sometime in the future.

I was thinking the same thing and wondering how much non solid fuel line is being used. Older VW's had IP pulling vacuum from their tanks through plastic lines with rubber hose connectors without problems.

I imagine if the boots are short enough it shouldn't be an issue for most. The line that concerns me the most goes from the filter to the pump. That is relatively long on snakes around a bit. I could see this being an easy impolde if the filter starts to plug. It's also the one that implodes on a Detroit in buses. Starve that pump, it will get expensive. There aren't enough pages in this forum to go into the priming issues I've seen with systems of this type over the years. Just have to take them as they come.

Well the driver from the Jeep dealer is just arrived, got to go & get mine back.

oldnavy · **Posted:** Tue Apr 25, 2006 9:40 am

RFCRD wrote:

I imagine if the boots are short enough it shouldn't be an issue for most. The line that concerns me the most goes from the filter to the pump. That is relatively long on snakes around a bit. I could see this being an easy impolde if the filter starts to plug. It's also the one that implodes on a Detroit in buses. Starve that pump, it will get expensive. There aren't enough pages in this forum to go into the priming issues I've seen with systems of this type over the years. Just have to take them as they come.

Well the driver from the Jeep dealer is just arrived, got to go & get mine back.

Hey here is an idea see about getting a replacement line that would be better, you have the skill and/or contacts to get it done correct?

RFCRD · **Posted:** Tue Apr 25, 2006 10:13 am

oldnavy wrote:

RFCRD wrote:

I imagine if the boots are short enough it shouldn't be an issue for most. The line that concerns me the most goes from the filter to the pump. That is relatively long on snakes around a bit. I could see this being an easy impolde if the filter starts to plug. It's also the one that implodes on a Detroit in buses. Starve that pump, it will get expensive. There aren't enough pages in this forum to go into the priming issues I've seen with systems of this type over the years. Just have to take them as they come.

Well the driver from the Jeep dealer is just arrived, got to go & get mine back.

Hey here is an idea see about getting a replacement line that would be better, you have the skill and/or contacts to get it done correct?

Should add that I have been looking at that whole filter plumbing arrangement since I test drove this beast. Don't like the way the lines are routed in front of the filter, blocking easy access. If you ever get in a pinch and have to drop this filter in the side of the road (trail for you real Jeepers), you will be SOL. Want to relocate the line to the pump (swing it around to the other side of the filter) the first time I change the filter. That way all you need to do is pull the wire connectors and you have clear access. The last thing you want to be doing on a diesel is disconnecting fuel hoses to change a filter, just asking for priming problems.

Prefilling the oil filter

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