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| SOLVED. Thanks. EVIC install led to major Fuse 34 issues http://www.lostjeeps.com/forum/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=5&t=77370 |
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| Author: | SFHLibertyCRD [ Fri Nov 15, 2013 3:01 am ] |
| Post subject: | SOLVED. Thanks. EVIC install led to major Fuse 34 issues |
I'm no electrician, so bear with me as I bumble through these details. I was able to purchase both a premium EVIC and auto-dimming mirror. I decided to install them both at the same time, but I must have bungled something in the process because now my fuse 34 is blowing constantly (after the first fuse replacement, it worked properly for a little while, but now the fuse blows immediately, as soon as I reconnect the battery or plug it in). Fuse 34 controls all BCM and interior functions, door remote lock/unlock, interior lights, radio and much more. The fuse still blows now even after I have unplugged some of the extra powered wiring involved in the install (described below) to try to isolate the issue. Here are the details that may be relevant. Please help me troubleshoot: 1) I used butt connectors for most of my splicing as this is what I have used on my VWs in the past with no issues (I do not know how to solder, nor do I own a solder). I have a proper crimp tool. (I have installed foglights and heated seats in my VW in the past successfully.) All wiring was 18 gauge stranded. 2) I opted to ONLY splice into the PCI on my OBD connector and get my Ground, B+ and Ignition elsewhere as I didn't want to mess with the wiring at the connector too much. 3) IMPORTANT: I did take a shortcut and combined the ground connections for the mirror and EVIC (is this a big no no?). The two grounds went to a single 18 gauge wire and to the ground point behind fuse box using a ring connector. 4) ALSO IMPORTANT: Similarly for the ignition output for both mirror and EVIC, I did the same and used a single 18 gauge wire for both going to an "add a fuse" at Fuse 13. The ignition output to works fine and both the EVIC and the mirror function when the ignition is on (even when fuse 34 is blown). The EVIC passed its self test as well. 5) For B+ power, I used an add a fuse at a number of B+ locations according to the service manual. If anything is supposed to function on the EVIC with the ignition power off, I didn't ever see it, so I suspect I was not successful at connecting this either to a correct fuse, or my wiring is bad, or it could be that the ground method I used (see #3) is an issue? I did some "continuity tests" and confirmed that I have all of the connections going to the right places according to the pinouts and wiring diagrams in the SM. I have a multimeter, but my use of it is really limited. I also tried a resistance test between the two points on my wires (but I do not understand what the numbers meant). I have not tried to measure voltage. I am open to learning as I suspect this might be involved in troubleshooting further. What stumps me is that even after unhooking all my new fuse connections (but not the ground), my fuse 34 is still blowing. Could something have created an intermittent connection or short while I was doing the install? I didn't mess with fuse 34 (except pulling it out and plugging it back in a few times when I was trying to figure out how to unplug that plastic retainer bracket). Someone help me figure out where to begin troubleshooting! I suspect the dealer will not take kindly to my EVIC install attempt . . . and I really don't want to have to take it in. |
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| Author: | Mike92104 [ Fri Nov 15, 2013 3:18 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: HELP! EVIC install led to major Fuse 34 issues |
Check your wiring again and make sure you didn't connect a power lead to a ground lead. It sounds like a dead short somewhere. |
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| Author: | Billwill [ Fri Nov 15, 2013 8:27 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: HELP! EVIC install led to major Fuse 34 issues |
You will have to disconnect all your additions and start from scratch!  If it still blows the fuse you will have to isolate the leads as they branch off from fuse 34 to see which path is causing the problem....make sure when you read the circuit diagrams that you are taking into account all the splices involved when trying to isolate a short. You may have disturbed something during your installation so some wire that was almost fraying through to chassis somewhere is now doing just that. 
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| Author: | thermorex [ Fri Nov 15, 2013 12:26 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: HELP! EVIC install led to major Fuse 34 issues |
You said you took your batt + from odb2 wire, correct? I wonder if that's not somehow connected with fuse 34... You should check the diagrams and make sure. For start, I'd try getting the batt + for your EVIC straight from battery, see if your fuse 34 still blows. It's worth a shot... But make sure you remove the +wire you added for EVIC from the odb2. If it doesn't blow fuse 34 this way, then I'd say to get your ignition plus from the radio (it's a little safer bc worse case your radio won't work if radio fuse goes bad), go with it in a relay, fuse the batt + that comes straight from battery in the relay. This way you won't put any strain on the radio fuse and if anything bad happens, your new relay fuse would blow. |
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| Author: | SFHLibertyCRD [ Fri Nov 15, 2013 12:29 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: HELP! EVIC install led to major Fuse 34 issues |
I will disconnect the new ground connection and try one more 15a fuse. Otherwise all power leads are already disconnected (only pci is still spliced in but that is only data, right?). Would a ground connected to unpowered components cause a blown fuse? Or is it possible messing with the ground point created an issue? Just to be clear, I didn't touch fuse 34 as a part of the install and pulled power to the battery + while running all the wiring. However, it is entirely possible a frayed wire went south somehow. Also, I did pull fuse 34 with battery connected a few times. Would that potentially harm anything? |
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| Author: | SFHLibertyCRD [ Fri Nov 15, 2013 12:53 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: HELP! EVIC install led to major Fuse 34 issues |
thermorex wrote: You said you took your batt + from odb2 wire, correct? I wonder if that's not somehow connected with fuse 34... You should check the diagrams and make sure. For start, I'd try getting the batt + for your EVIC straight from battery, see if your fuse 34 still blows. It's worth a shot... But make sure you remove the +wire you added for EVIC from the odb2. If it doesn't blow fuse 34 this way, then I'd say to get your ignition plus from the radio (it's a little safer bc worse case your radio won't work if radio fuse goes bad), go with it in a relay, fuse the batt + that comes straight from battery in the relay. This way you won't put any strain on the radio fuse and if anything bad happens, your new relay fuse would blow. Thermorex, no. I did not pull b+ from obd port. I only made one splice there which was the pci data connection. I tried to pull b+ directly from a fuse location using an add-a-fuse which provides fused protection for the new circuit as well as the existing one (2 separate fuses). That lead never seemed to work though as the evic never had power with the car off. All power leads are disconnected but the fuse still blows. |
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| Author: | SFHLibertyCRD [ Fri Nov 15, 2013 9:32 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: HELP! EVIC install led to major Fuse 34 issues |
Billwill wrote: If it still blows the fuse you will have to isolate the leads as they branch off from fuse 34 to see which path is causing the problem....make sure when you read the circuit diagrams that you are taking into account all the splices involved when trying to isolate a short. You may have disturbed something during your installation so some wire that was almost fraying through to chassis somewhere is now doing just that. Billwill, can you clarify what exactly might be involved in "isolating" the leads from the fuse and how I go about testing them? Do you mean getting behind the fuse box, pulling wires and following the circuit diagrams to figure out where they go? Then what kind of test do I do with the multimeter on these leads? Sorry to be so dense, but I'm generally in over my head when electrical goes wrong. I am good at following directions though. I'm just trying to figure out if I'm in over my head and need to take this to someone, or if I can take care of it myself. |
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| Author: | 94 LSC [ Fri Nov 15, 2013 10:59 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: HELP! EVIC install led to major Fuse 34 issues |
The EVIC has the dome lights in it. Do they work properly? If you unplug the EVIC unit from the harness, does the fuse still blow? When you cut the headliner, did you cut into a wire? Retrace your steps and you'll find the problem. |
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| Author: | SFHLibertyCRD [ Sat Nov 16, 2013 12:10 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: HELP! EVIC install led to major Fuse 34 issues |
94 LSC wrote: The EVIC has the dome lights in it. Do they work properly? If you unplug the EVIC unit from the harness, does the fuse still blow? When you cut the headliner, did you cut into a wire? Retrace your steps and you'll find the problem. EVIC has dome lights that connect to my original wiring harness. They are out with all the rest of my dome lights, radio, locks, etc. EVIC power leads are both unplugged (that was my first step) and the fuse still blows (only ground is still connected as I haven't had a chance to remove that yet (ground shares the same ground point as BCM, so could be it messed up the ground connection?). No wires were cut as I was especially concerned about cutting a wire when chopping my headliner. |
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| Author: | Billwill [ Sun Nov 17, 2013 6:18 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: HELP! EVIC install led to major Fuse 34 issues |
SFHLibertyCRD wrote: 94 LSC wrote: The EVIC has the dome lights in it. Do they work properly? If you unplug the EVIC unit from the harness, does the fuse still blow? When you cut the headliner, did you cut into a wire? Retrace your steps and you'll find the problem. EVIC has dome lights that connect to my original wiring harness. They are out with all the rest of my dome lights, radio, locks, etc. EVIC power leads are both unplugged (that was my first step) and the fuse still blows (only ground is still connected as I haven't had a chance to remove that yet (ground shares the same ground point as BCM, so could be it messed up the ground connection?). No wires were cut as I was especially concerned about cutting a wire when chopping my headliner. I cannot attach a circuit diagram at the moment as photobucket is mis-behaving for me. I only have the 2006 circuit diagram...hopefully it is close enough to your 2005 CRD. If you look at page 8W-12-27 you will see that the +12 volts from fuse 34 leaves the Juncyion Block at connector C1 for the cluster and courtesy lamp and connector C2 pin 18 for the Radio, "Module Electronic Overhead', lamp cargo, vanity lamps and hands free module. you need to first pull off plug C2 on the junction block and see if the fuse still blows, then try connector C1. Assuming the fault is down the C2 pin 18 plug route, Red wire, you need to disconnect C308 to isolate everything except the radio which goes off at Splice S311 somewhere. Assuming that with C308 disconnected there is no longer any blowing fuse...you now will now need to pull off the connectors on the EVIC and then the cargo lamps, vanity lamps etc. If you are still blowing the fuse with all components disconnected...including the radio....you need to leave the components disconnected and with power OFF ie. disconnect battery, use the OHMs setting on your Multimeter to see if you get a reading on this Red wire to chassis ground somewhere. If so, you now have to start cutting wires one at a time until you see the short dissapear.....for example cut the Red wire coming out of connector C308 pin 3....see if the one end of the wire goes to ground while the other end does not. You can always connect the wires back together...use shrink-tubing insulation and solder the wires back together again. Once you find a section of wire that appears to be the short, for example the wire coming from C308 pin 3 going up to Splice S311 and to connector C2 on the Junction Block and to the radio....unless you can physically trace the wire to look for a short to ground you will need to isolate the faulty section of wire completely and replace it with a new-laid section of wire. I had major shorts of various wires going to ground...or going to some other random wire.....in the harness of my 2002 Export CRD. The SO had driven the front-right into a tree and the main harness runs under the radiator in that area. I had to isolate about 5 wires completely at both ends and re-lay new ones.....hope your problem is much easier to find! 
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| Author: | WWDiesel [ Sun Nov 17, 2013 8:43 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: HELP! EVIC install led to major Fuse 34 issues |
Before you start cutting wires, get yourself a Short Circuit Detector. Tool warehouse and Sears both list them along with many others available on line. KD 2524  Cost is about 29 bucks and will save you a lot of time and fuses and will find the short!  I have a older Snap-on one and have used it with great success in finding shorts.  PM me if you need help on how to use it. 
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| Author: | SFHLibertyCRD [ Mon Nov 18, 2013 1:53 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: HELP! EVIC install led to major Fuse 34 issues |
Bill Will and WWDiesel, thank you for the very helpful replies. I'm debating whether to take the car in and have someone do this. We have a newborn and I go back to work after 3 weeks of leave starting tomorrow  What I hoped would be an uneventful EVIC install for the wife got more complicated than I had hoped or have time to handle with everything else going on. I'm pretty frustrated about it and wish I had another day or two to troubleshoot. Those short detectors look interesting though. I'll either try to tackle this again myself on Friday, or take it to someone (probably not the dealer who might try to install a new BCM or something). |
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| Author: | Billwill [ Mon Nov 18, 2013 5:41 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: HELP! EVIC install led to major Fuse 34 issues |
WWDiesel wrote: Before you start cutting wires, get yourself a Short Circuit Detector. Tool warehouse and Sears both list them along with many others available on line. KD 2524 Cost is about 29 bucks and will save you a lot of time and fuses and will find the short! I have a older Snap-on one and have used it with great success in finding shorts. PM me if you need help on how to use it. I have nothing against a Short Circuit Detector....for the less knowledgable owners trying to trace a fault.  But when it comes to "partial" shorts ie. not "dead" shorts then nothing beats a good quality Multi-meter such as a Fluke to find the problem.....provided this Multi-meter is in good hands though. I personally was born with a Fluke meter in one hand and a Techtronix oscilloscope in the other hand...rather painful for my mother at the time  and qualified in Electrical Engineering Light Current and have 34 years experience behind me in fixing Mainframe computers and industrial Robotics. I am retired now and enjoy helping fellow KJ owners (and BMW E30 owners) with electrical problems, sometimes wish I could fly across to the USA to lend a hand in return for a roof over my head, a good meal and some nice cold beers
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| Author: | WWDiesel [ Mon Nov 18, 2013 1:54 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: HELP! EVIC install led to major Fuse 34 issues |
Billwill wrote: I have nothing against a Short Circuit Detector....for the less knowledgable owners trying to trace a fault. But when it comes to "partial" shorts ie. not "dead" shorts then nothing beats a good quality Multi-meter such as a Fluke to find the problem.....provided this Multi-meter is in good hands though. I personally was born with a Fluke meter in one hand and a Techtronix oscilloscope in the other hand...rather painful for my mother at the time and qualified in Electrical Engineering Light Current and have 34 years experience behind me in fixing Mainframe computers and industrial Robotics. I am retired now and enjoy helping fellow KJ owners (and BMW E30 owners) with electrical problems, sometimes wish I could fly across to the USA to lend a hand in return for a roof over my head, a good meal and some nice cold beers I agree about the Multi-meter if you know how to properly use one. Not everyone knows how to use them. A Short finder can be used by most anyone.  There are many uses for a multi-meter and I have a Fluke that I have used for many years on both foreign and domestic cars and trucks. Made my living as a mechanic for many years before working for a large power company. |
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| Author: | SFHLibertyCRD [ Mon Nov 18, 2013 2:07 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: HELP! EVIC install led to major Fuse 34 issues |
Well, both of you have far more technical experience than I do, which I envy at the moment. BillWill, make the flight over from South Africa and I'd be happy to put you up with meals and beers and a spare bed in Santa Monica, CA in exchange for help with my rig. But I suspect flights are pretty pricey. |
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| Author: | SFHLibertyCRD [ Sun Nov 24, 2013 2:47 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: HELP! EVIC install led to major Fuse 34 issues |
I had a mobile mechanic who does electrical come out and check it out. Turned out I had pinched the visor wires in the headliner visor mounting bracket, causing a short!  While he was in there, I had him wire up the auto day/light mirror reverse lamp feed which I had installed at the same time but did not know where to make that connection, and install my skidplates (the front one ended up having a rusted on bolt that broke the welded nut in the subframe, so we had to cut the bolt and put a rivet in to instill the tranny skid). Strangely though, I had the homelink programmed and working before, and now it doesn't seem to want to work (even though everything lights up as it should and indicates that it trains and transmits, etc.).  Garage door is an older one that doesn't have any special programming issues, revolving code, etc.
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