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 Post subject: Trans help
PostPosted: Sun Nov 24, 2013 1:35 am 
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05 liberty CRD.

Few weeks ago the converter died. Lost all gears forward and reverse. I replaced it with a euro converter. At the same time I did the transgo HD2 kit. Jeep has been running perfect, tell tonight. Out of now where I lost all gears again. When I had it apart I checked the front pump. Every thing was good. I'm at a lost other then a issue with the valve body. My only issue with that is I don't thing it would come and go.

When I was doing the transgo kit I checked all the clutch packs and they were in really good shape.

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 Post subject: Re: Trans help
PostPosted: Sun Nov 24, 2013 7:58 am 
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My suggestion is to unplug the ECM and TCM for a few minutes and allow them to reset.

Then reattach them and see if the tranny relearns the shift points.

If that doesn't work, then I wouldn't know where to begin.

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 Post subject: Re: Trans help
PostPosted: Mon Nov 25, 2013 6:45 pm 
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Well got it figured out. The front pump died. So any one else having a issue where you lose all gears its most likely your front pump died.

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 Post subject: Re: Trans help
PostPosted: Mon Nov 25, 2013 8:01 pm 
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Well how did you manage to find that out?

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 Post subject: Re: Trans help
PostPosted: Mon Nov 25, 2013 8:44 pm 
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racertracer wrote:
Well how did you manage to find that out?


I checked the valve body and all the sensors. They all checked. So I dropped the trans. As soon as the trans was out I new it was a issue with the front pump. The converter was stuck on the pump. Had to pry it off. Then pulled the front pump. It was seized.

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 Post subject: Re: Trans help
PostPosted: Tue Nov 26, 2013 12:34 am 
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Bummer, which is why I suggest replacing the front pump with a new one whenever a torque converter is replaced....dropping that tranny sucks. Its not hard just a lot of busy work and time under the vehicle I'd rather not have to do twice!

Good luck and let us know it all works out. Hopefully the front pump didn't sent wear particles into the rest of your tranny.


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 Post subject: Re: Trans help
PostPosted: Tue Nov 26, 2013 1:43 am 
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Drewd wrote:
Bummer, which is why I suggest replacing the front pump with a new one whenever a torque converter is replaced....dropping that tranny sucks. Its not hard just a lot of busy work and time under the vehicle I'd rather not have to do twice!

Good luck and let us know it all works out. Hopefully the front pump didn't sent wear particles into the rest of your tranny.


Dropping the trans was no big deal. Only took me 1.5hrs. As for the front pump. I'm kicking my self for not replacing it the first time the trans was out. It was in the back of my mind but I check the clearance on the pump gears and they were in speck both gear mesh and side clearance. Oh well live and learn.

I think I got lucky as there was no metal in the pan and the clutch packs were all free of metal. When the pump went I was just pulling away from a stop light. So I coasted into a parking lot and turned it off. Don't think it was running for more then 30secs

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 Post subject: Re: Trans help
PostPosted: Tue Nov 26, 2013 2:30 am 
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1.5hrs to pull the tranny ......Do you own a lift or did you do this in your driveway?

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 Post subject: Re: Trans help
PostPosted: Tue Nov 26, 2013 10:07 am 
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racertracer wrote:
1.5hrs to pull the tranny ......Do you own a lift or did you do this in your driveway?


Did it in my garage. I'm a diesel tech so I just used my snap-on 3/8 electric impact and ratchet. Speeds things up a lot. First time I pulled it, took me a little over 2.5 hrs. This time around I new exactly what to pull and in what order.

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 Post subject: Re: Trans help
PostPosted: Tue Nov 26, 2013 11:12 am 
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Brianawd wrote:
racertracer wrote:
1.5hrs to pull the tranny ......Do you own a lift or did you do this in your driveway?


Did it in my garage. I'm a diesel tech so I just used my snap-on 3/8 electric impact and ratchet. Speeds things up a lot. First time I pulled it, took me a little over 2.5 hrs. This time around I new exactly what to pull and in what order.


In my best Darth Vader voice- "Impressive.....most impressive". :-)r Sorry...couldn't resist. Man.....that's awesome...dropping the transmission that quick in the garage at home.

Jim

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 Post subject: Re: Trans help
PostPosted: Wed Dec 04, 2013 10:13 am 
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Ok new pump in and now I don't have reverse and the trans seem like its slipping in drive. Takes a good bit of throttle to ever get the rear wheels to move. I am getting a P0700 code. Does any one know if a scan tool other then the DBRII that will pull tcu codes. Not taking it to the dealer.

So to recap torque converted died. Replaced with a euro. Every thing was working for a day then lost all gears. Pulled trans back out and found front pump had died. Replaced front pump with new one. No don't have reverse and seems to be in limp mode.

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 Post subject: Re: Trans help
PostPosted: Tue Dec 10, 2013 6:18 pm 
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Ok from my understanding the 45rfe and the 545rfe are the same trans. Other then the 545rfe has a 2nd over drive. This is accomplished by engaging the OD clutch and the 2c clutch. My trans is dead in the water due to the front pump dying. I found a 45rfe that was just rebuilt with less then 1k on it. It was pulled do to the jeep rolling. So if my understanding is right, I should just be able to swap this in as my tcu has the 545rfe program. Is this correct

45rfe
Gear Ratios:
1st 3.00:1
2nd 1.67:1
2nd Prime 1.50:1
3rd 1.00:1
4th 0.75:1
Reverse 3.00:1

545rfe
Gear Ratios:
1st 3.00:1
2nd 1.67:1
2nd Prime 1.50:1
3rd 1.00:1
4th 0.75:1
Reverse 3.00:1
545RFE only:
5th 0.67:1

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 Post subject: Re: Trans help
PostPosted: Tue Dec 10, 2013 7:55 pm 
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I do not think it will work, because what happens when your TCU goes to shift into 5th? Is it going to cause a CEL because THERE IS NO 5th? Probably.

I'm not 100% sure on that though, but I wouldn't think you could do it without a TCU reprogram.

545RFE is pretty common, I believe they were in the Durangos and aren't too terribly expensive.

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Last edited by Hexus on Tue Dec 10, 2013 9:57 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: Trans help
PostPosted: Tue Dec 10, 2013 9:20 pm 
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Hexus wrote:
I do not thing it will work, because what happens when your TCU goes to shift into 5th? Is it going to cause a CEL because THERE IS NO 5th? Probably.

I'm not 100% sure on that though, but I wouldn't think you could do it without a TCU reprogram.

545RFE is pretty common, I believe they were in the Durangos and aren't too terribly expensive.

From my understanding the 45rfe and the 545rfe are the same trans. 5gear is already in the 45rfe. It was just never programmed in. The difference is the tcu programming. By using the OD clutch and the 2c clutch you get 5th gear.

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 Post subject: Re: Trans help
PostPosted: Tue Dec 10, 2013 10:00 pm 
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In June 1998, Chrysler introduced the innovative 45RFE in its 1999 WJ Jeep Grand Cherokee. Produced at Chrysler's Indiana Transmission plant in Kokomo, it was paired with the 4.7 L PowerTech V8 engine. The 45 number refers to the torque rating (5) and number of forward gears (4); RFE refers to rear wheel drive application and full electronic controls.

545RFE

The 45RFE automatic transmission in the WJ featured three planetary gear sets instead of the two usually used in a 4-speed automatic; and it included three multiple disc input clutches, three multiple disc holding clutches, and a dual internal filter system (one which was a primary filter for transmission sump, the other for the fluid cooler return system). Four forward gears were used in normal acceleration, with a different second gear used to increase versatility in “kickdown” acceleration. Despite using five forward ratios, Chrysler played it safe and decided to call it a "4-speed automatic."

545RFE automatic

At the time, Chrysler boasted its tall 3.00:1 first gear for better initial acceleration; and noted that while the standard second gear was 1.67:1, the kickdown second was 1.50:1, for smoother downshifts. Reverse gear was equal to the first gear to accommodate heavy loads. At the time it was launched, it had the widest range of gear ratios in its class; its factory was brand new at launch.

Five speeds: the 545RFE transmission
In 2001, with programming changes and an extra, taller overdrive ratio, the 545RFE was born. With the change to overdrive, cruising at 70 miles per hour (110 km/h) with a standard axle ratio would yield 2000 rpm at the engine, about 200 rpm less than the 45RFE, cutting fuel consumption and noise.

The 545RFE’s engineering reached back to the rock-solid Torqueflites, but it incorporated many contemporary innovations and practices. The six-speed transmission was programmed to act as a five-speed with an alternate second gear for downshifts.

During a recent live Q & A chat session with Washington Post automotive columnist Warren Brown, who has covered the car industry since 1982, we asked him about the importance of having the extra gear and whether it's a big selling point for buyers.

As to the question of why the 545RFE has two overdrive gears that are so close to each other, engineer Bob Sheaves noted that size is an issue with planetary gears; most likely, the top 0.67:1 ratio gear was chosen because that was the largest one that could fit into the available space, without requiring changes to the design of the Jeeps and trucks using the transmission.

When towing (in some vehicles), a “Tow/Haul” mode provided crisper shifts to cut wear on the transmission, and reduced gear searching by holding lower gears longer. The system also selected lower gears when going downhill, to use the engine’s braking capability. In 2006, Chrysler claimed that the transmission had been “refined for higher-quality shifts;” it was strong enough to give the Jeep Commander and Grand Cherokee class-leading towing capacity of 7,200 lbs. The changes included a redesigned solenoid to provide quieter operation when shifting (ending “solenoid clatter”), and a turbine damper to cut noise and vibration from the torque converter.

Used in Chrysler's fleet of rear-wheel drive trucks, including the Jeep Liberty, Dodge Ram, Dodge Dakota, Dodge Durango and Jeep Commander over the past decade, the 545RFE is sophisticated, multi-ranged, and electronically controlled by a Transmission Control Module (TCM). Its shiny bellhousing -- a one-piece die-cast aluminum casing -- resembles a rocket ship designed by NASA engineers.

The 545RFE combines optimized gear ratios for responsive performance, including maintaining speed on long or high grades, without sacrificing efficiency at highway speeds; efficiency features including variable line pressure; and it has a low NVH (noise, vibration and harshness) thanks to ribs integrated into the case that increases multi-angular torsional rigidity.

The 545RFE is equipped with dual lubricant filters, including an internal main sump pan filter and an external canister-type pump return filter. The fluid capacity for service refill is 6.55 quarts (6.2 liters) and its fluid type is Mopar ATF +4. (Earlier units were specified as taking ATF+3 but ATF+4 is a superior fluid which can substitute for ATF+3).

Despite its steady improvement over the years, the 545RFE isn't without fault, and critics sometimes complain about its choice of gear ratios. While the 545RFE, as used in Ram trucks, may not perform as well as its Ford counterparts for unloaded acceleration, the 545RFE keeps running when the Ford runs out of reserve torque rise; it’s better suited for high loads and steep grades. The transmission is well suited for the large torque band of the Hemi V8, as well as previous engines it and its predecessors were used with. (The 545RFE has been used with numerous engines, including the 3.7 V6, 4.7 V8, 5.7 V8, and VM 2.8 diesel).

In 2009, modifications were made to the 545RFE that enabled drivers to select the highest gear the transmission would shift to, which has proved a helpful feature for towing, hill climbing, and hill descent.

With the 545RFE, Chrysler has equipped its trucks with a smooth and responsive rear-wheel transmission, one that requires few repairs. A six speed version joined the lineup in 2012; in addition to using all gears in normal acceleration rather than reserving one for kickdown.



Original is at The 45RFE, 545RFE, and 65RFE automatic transmission for Jeeps and Rams http://www.allpar.com/mopar/transmissions/545RFE.html#ixzz2n7yDynX1

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 Post subject: Re: Trans help
PostPosted: Tue Dec 10, 2013 11:44 pm 
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http://www.dodgetalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=208132

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 Post subject: Re: Trans help
PostPosted: Wed Dec 11, 2013 8:23 am 
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Well, it appears he pulled it off although it is a somewhat different application.

I personally would love to see a writeup and would like to know what TCM flash you decided upon.

You have piqued my interest sir, very much so.

Best of luck to you!

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 Post subject: Re: Trans help
PostPosted: Wed Dec 11, 2013 10:07 am 
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Hexus wrote:
Well, it appears he pulled it off although it is a somewhat different application.

I personally would love to see a writeup and would like to know what TCM flash you decided upon.

You have piqued my interest sir, very much so.

Best of luck to you!


From my understanding both the internals of the trans are the same. I have read a few reports that state DC was having issue with 5th gear when they released the 45rfe back in 99. So they just left it a 4speed and then in 2001 they got the programming figured out. as for a tcm flash. Because I already have a 545rfe in my liberty its already set up for the 5th gear program the just locks the OD clutch and the 2c clutch. If I where to pull a ecu out of a jeep that was using a 45rfe it would only be a 4speed as that is what that tcu was programmed for.

There is a guy on one of the dodge forms that is a tech and will reprogram a tcu with exchange for $40

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 Post subject: Re: Trans help
PostPosted: Sat Dec 14, 2013 10:24 pm 
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Ok jeep is back up and running today. I picked up a rebuilt 45rfe with a little over 1k on the
rebuild for $400. I swapped my valve body,sensors and the rest of the transgo kit. Been driver the jeep now for a few hrs testing it out. Shifts are perfect and I have all 5 gears. So all the info on the net saying the 45rfe and 545rfe are the same is true. It just the programing in the tcu that gets you 5th gear. :pepper: Feels good to have the jeep back up and running. Been getting sick of drive my Evo in rush hr traffic.

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 Post subject: Re: Trans help
PostPosted: Sat Dec 14, 2013 11:04 pm 
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Apologies this has moved quickly and I haven't been by in a few days.
AE reads all modules (Chrysler enhanced version) as far as I am aware.
Going out to shed to shed with computer to check something for another forum member will check for you and advise if this is incorrect.


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