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Dead CRD
http://www.lostjeeps.com/forum/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=5&t=79723		 Page 1 of 1
Author:  blockphi [ Tue Oct 01, 2013 11:37 am ]
Post subject:  Dead CRD
Okay, so I was driving on saturday and my 05 CRD started shuttering and then died and would not turn back over at all - electrical system is fine and charging up. I can hear the starter engage, but ...nothing. So, long story short, get a wrecker and have it towed to a mechanic. Yesterday he calls and let's me know that it appears that the engine is hyrdolocked, but he has never seen this engine before and doesn't want to "crack it open." He said he called the dealer and they quoted him 6500 for an engine and a 3500 core charge and told him that if it's locked, that's the best/only way to go - to not even bother trying to rebuild it.

I'm in Alaska, so there is an even smaller population of these vehicles around here than what I image there are elsewhere. So, I am in a bit of a quandary -

1) If I were to sell it outright as a mechanic's special, what would be a fair asking price? It's an 05, 156000 miles on it. The body is in good shape with no rust. The front bumper cover is broken and there are two minor dents - but given the age and such, in good shape.

2) Given my location, do you think it would even make sense to try parting it out? I'm afraid shipping would eat up any cash I could make

3) Do I rebuild or put in a new engine myself as cash allows? I figure that realistically to do this would be a matter of a couple of years before I would have cash on hand to be able to afford the parts, and another couple of years for the tools - I just bough a house that we are restoring while living in, so that takes precedent.

I think trying to sell it outright makes the most sense - provided I can get enough to cover the remainder of the loan, but I don't know about the market and whether or not I can find a buyer up here.

Heck, to be honest, I don't even really know what's wrong with it. The mechanic couldn't/wouldn't tell me how he arrived at the hyrdolock diag other than that he pulled the starter and tried to turn the engine over with the shop starter and it wouldn't turn. If it is a hydrolock, I'd have to think that it was some type of catestrophic failure, because we had no symptoms that one would see with a leaking head gasket.

Just trying to get ides of what I should do.

Thanks!
Author:  j888dth [ Wed Oct 02, 2013 4:35 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Dead CRD
is it Cherokee crd, or Grand Cherokee crd as they have different engines. I would get second opinion before going for new engine. Is there still coolant in expansion bottle? Is it not possible to get second hand engine?
Author:  blockphi [ Wed Oct 02, 2013 4:39 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Dead CRD
Sorry, it's a Liberty CRD. As I'm in Alaska, finding a used engine would be difficult without the added expense of shipping.
Author:  j888dth [ Wed Oct 02, 2013 6:10 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Dead CRD
The engine in your car is made by Vm Motori. This is link to there website it might be worth seeing if they have agent near you as they might be able to assist in possible causes and whether its worth repairing.

Link:- http://www.vmmotori.it/

I would try turning it by large wrench on main pully (But make sure it is in neutral first). If it will turn this way but not by starter motor i would check starter motor out. Have you tried removing some of the glow plugs then see if engine will turn over if it is Hydrolocked then water should get blown out of glow plug holes.
Check also level of oil to much could stop it turning over.
Author:  blockphi [ Wed Oct 02, 2013 6:43 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Dead CRD
The starter motor is not out - bench tested that already. There is coolant in the oil. I will contact VM and see what insights they might have.
Author:  user113 [ Wed Oct 02, 2013 9:11 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Dead CRD
These engines have been known to drop valves and glow plug tips which could get jammed and simulate hydrolock, however water in the oil is never promising...
Author:  WWDiesel [ Wed Oct 02, 2013 10:31 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Dead CRD
Still learning about these little diesels. Could it be a blown EGR cooler or blown head gasket? A leaking EGR cooler could put coolant into the combustion chambers and possibly hydro a piston and in turn blow a head gasket or crack a head putting water into the oil. :?: :?:
A friend who owns a Ford diesel blew an EGR cooler and it put him on the side of the road with coolant puking out the tail pipe and coolant all in the oil which looked like dirty milk. I had to go rescue him off the side of the interstate with my Dodge and car trailer. All he had to do was have the EGR cooler replaced and change the oil and filter. Truck is running fine now... :-)r
Author:  dgeist [ Thu Oct 03, 2013 3:58 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Dead CRD
The EGR cooler is actually a bolt-on assembly that attaches to the block on the driver's side just below and behind the intake "throttle" (actually just a flow control valve). It's coolant is fed by a hard line and hose from the block and return is into a tee off the cabin heater core. That entire coolant path can actually be bypassed by blocking the supply and return points if you're running a tune that "de-prioritizes" the EGR. The coolant of the EGR itself is around the solenoid. It's separated from the actual opening/closing valve. It COULD be leaking coolant into the EGR and consequently into the intake, but that's a long shot. You could find out by disconnecting the output line from the cooler that goes into the bottom of the intake elbow to see if it has fluid in it. Unless you have some REALLY dry conditions, fluid in there would likely stay in there a while.

As for other likely sources: if you have a blown head gasket, you would have at least SOME fluid loss in your coolant expansion tank. Have you been getting the "low coolant" light at all?

If it's a glow plug (which you probably use a bit since you're in AK), you could simply do the work to take them out (couple hours work, perhaps), and see if any are damaged. That's not a bad idea anyway since stainless replacement parts are available from IDParts at $25 bucks a pop that won't shatter in the cylinder bore like ceramic can.

Beyond that... hmm, you could take out the injectors on the top of the head and see if there's a pressure buildup that's preventing the crank from turning.

Regardless, I wouldn't try the starter anymore. Manual turning of the crankshaft with a long breaker will tell you if it's seized without potentially doing more damage if it is.

Dan
Author:  blockphi [ Thu Oct 03, 2013 4:46 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Dead CRD
I never had a low coolant warning light come on at all. Here's a detail that may help - after it stalled and I checked the fluids, I noticed the coolant resesoir was empty so I put 4 liters of coolant in. As I was pouring it in, it appeared to be filling, but within minutes, it was back to empty and there was no evidence of it leaking onto the ground.

I've got some time this weekend so I'll give a few of these ideas a try and see if I can get a better idea of what's going on with it. I'd love to fix it without putting in a new engine, if at all possible.
Author:  dgeist [ Wed Oct 09, 2013 3:07 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Dead CRD
blockphi wrote:
I never had a low coolant warning light come on at all. Here's a detail that may help - after it stalled and I checked the fluids, I noticed the coolant resesoir was empty so I put 4 liters of coolant in. As I was pouring it in, it appeared to be filling, but within minutes, it was back to empty and there was no evidence of it leaking onto the ground.

I've got some time this weekend so I'll give a few of these ideas a try and see if I can get a better idea of what's going on with it. I'd love to fix it without putting in a new engine, if at all possible.


Err... it's going somewhere...

Did you check the fluid levels in transmission and oil dipsticks? Those would be the obvious other "not the ground" places you might find it, especially that volume. wow.

Dan
Author:  blockphi [ Wed Oct 09, 2013 5:05 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Dead CRD
It's definitely in the oil - both the volume of the oil went up and there was clearly water in the oil. Not good.
Author:  GreenDieselEngineering [ Thu Oct 10, 2013 4:46 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Dead CRD
Most likely a dropped valve that cracked the head. Doing a teardown of the engine will not hurt at this point, but I doubt the vehicle is worth enough to replace the engine. We bought a CRD with 80,000miles for $2500 with a blown engine, so you have a better idea what it is worth as it sits.

Used engines are about 3500-5000 and may be an option. Assume 300-500 to have it shipped to Alaska.

Sorry about your situation and hope it works out.
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