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Buying a CRD... is it worth it?
http://www.lostjeeps.com/forum/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=5&t=80415		 Page 1 of 2
Author:  79wolf [ Wed Oct 15, 2014 11:30 pm ]
Post subject:  Buying a CRD... is it worth it?
I know I'm going to get an even split in answers, but I'm going to ask anyway. I've been reading this forum for a few months now and have a good understanding of the why's and why not's to owning a CRD. I'm more looking for the why's and why not's to purchasing one, at least at this point in time. From what I'm seeing book values of a loaded CRD in good condition would be $9000-$10000, and from what I see on that market that gets you just that, a decent CRD with a lil over 100,000 miles. Granted we would all do things to one with just under that due to age, but I digress. So lets say you find one for a deal at $8000 (because book value says so) how much is it going to take to be daily driver reliable?

TB kit ~$400
Hoses ~$300
Rockers ~$400
Head Gasket ~$200
ARP studs (cause you should) ~$350
Thermostat ~$150
Filter head ~$120
And a tune so it all stays new ~$500

That will cost ~$2500 if you do all your own work, call it $3000 with new car tune up stuff and maybe some machine work. $11,000 for a CRD if you think the tranny will hold, which it won't for long as a daily driver, so add another $1500-$2000 to set that up.

So $13,000 will get you a nicely loaded, good condition CRD... not bad for a very capable, true 4x4, that can get over 30mpg, haul a couple of kids, AND put a smile on your face when you don't care about mpg (think right foot). That's where I sit anyway. Granted that doesn't consider if the turbo goes or an injector fails, or something tries to exit the side of the block, but from what I've read those are more of a minority, and not something that needs fixed before you can even drive your new Jeep for the first time. So here is my question:

Let's say you throw $3000-$4000 at the motor, everything I've listed above (ignore the tranny and turbo stuff), can it drive daily? Can it drive an hour long interstate commute daily? And the big question... how long before it needs more $$$? Can $3000-$4000 get you 100,000 miles?

I'm to the point where I've told myself yes and no too many times while reading this forum that I just need to get someone else's answer. Yes I can do the work myself, but if I buy one I want to own it for a looooooonnnng time. I love everything about these things, they are the perfect fit for me... if they can hold up without costing me out the butt to do so. I have the cash in hand and may have found one that will leave me enough cash to do the motor, with the tranny to come in spring. Should I? Or should I get a different SUV with less fuel economy and better reliability/maintenance costs?

I've seen you're all a good group of guys who won't pull your punches. Thanks for all the education I've received thus far.
Author:  thermorex [ Thu Oct 16, 2014 7:37 am ]
Post subject:  Buying a CRD... is it worth it?
To be honest, I'd go with a very low miles crd, if you can find one, and that's valid for any car you get. You can never be sure how previous owner maintained his vehicle. But, my opinion is that 5000 would definitely take care of the "common" crd problems. I have never been let down by my crd, knock on wood, and I have no fear going in a long trip with it anytime. As with any older vehicle, you may expect problems, but once you do what you plan on doing, I think you eliminate from the beginning a lot of potential issues. Transmission wise, they last a lot, provided enough fluid has been in it and never overheated. Rockers, more than likely they are fine on a low miles crd. You need to add to your list a torque converter, if it doesn't have the updated version, that may shudder with a gde tune (like a full torque Eco or hot tune). That can cost you 300-850-ish if you get suncoast. But first thing, stay under 70k miles if you can, then obviously test the rockers using the map sensor (clean it first), if they are good move on to timing belt job. Do gde tune first, weeks elbow kit, fuel filter assembly, change all fluids (engine, steering, transmission, coolant, diff oil) and see if you need a torque converter after the tune (I advise to get Eco full torque or hot tune). Check the turbo also and keep in mind that good oil and proper cool down (1 min for city drive to 4-5 min when towing on highway, or just install an egt gauge) will make it last forever.

I wouldn't worry about the head gasket if your coolant bottle has no pressure on cold engine. You can test that when you buy the crd, and I one wouldn't buy one with a cyl head gasket issue, lots of ppl say "it's just the head gasket", it's never just the head gasket, lol, don't risk your money.

Regarding arp and rockers, it's not bad to replace them, but I wouldn't go that far unless I have to. Test rockers first and if they seem bad, then replace them, once you neuter the egr and use good oil, it's unlikely to go bad.
Author:  dirtmover [ Thu Oct 16, 2014 8:33 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Buying a CRD... is it worth it?
You're clearly going into this with your eyes open and understand both sides of the argument.

If you're able and willing to work on the vehicle yourself, have plenty of time and money, don't mind risk taking and have a backup plan for when the CRD lets you down and you're waiting for parts then you can get a great vehicle for a great price.
Author:  jqc99 [ Thu Oct 16, 2014 9:23 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Buying a CRD... is it worth it?
79wolf, I hate that I'm having to, but I'm getting ready to list my CRD. We need a bigger vehicle for the family. I just can't go any longer without something bigger. :( Anyway, if you are willing to travel, I'm sure we can work something out. I can give you the specifics later, but it's an 06 sport with ~64,000 miles. It's had the EHM and ORM then eco tune since I got it (~19,000 miles). Updated fuel filter head. Oil changes per the manual with rotella t6, just replaced the thermostat and coolant. I maintained this vehicle well. I'd throw in any extra parts/fluids/filters I have including the original ECU as I had a spare sent in for the eco tune. Makes me sad to have to type this because I haven't had any major issues with it. Replaced a motor mount and rear wheel sensor, but that's about it. Oh yeah and I fixed those stupid window regulators in the back doors. I have replacements for the front if/when they are ever needed...
Author:  79wolf [ Thu Oct 16, 2014 10:59 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Buying a CRD... is it worth it?
Thanks for the input. I wish I could find a low mileage one, but anything under 70,000 miles prices out $12,000-$14,000. I figure I'd hit 100,000 miles within a year and then have to put more money into, might as well just do it now while I have the money. Which is why I said rockers and head gasket, if I have the cover off for the water pump, a little bit more and you have rockers, and then a little bit more you have head gasket, and then hopefully you can get an idea of how the bottom end might be. Just the way I do things, especially if I have the money now, but maybe not a year from now. And as for the torque converter... I was throwing that into the $2,000 for tranny stuff, unless I'm estimating that to be low for tc, shift kit, pump, and labor?

Anyway thanks again, I'm still on the fence. Just looking for some reassurance I guess that dumping $13,000 into one of these will last me a few years with a long commute without any major reoccurrences of problems.

Thanks jqc99, if these two I'm in talks with fall through I'll contact you.
Author:  vtdog2 [ Thu Oct 16, 2014 11:57 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Buying a CRD... is it worth it?
Don't do it! Take all that money you were going to spend on planned repairs and instead spend some quality time with great looking hookers in Vegas. At least you know will have a good time and be able to fix any issues with a large one time dose of Penicillin.
Author:  truckbouy2 [ Fri Oct 17, 2014 8:21 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Buying a CRD... is it worth it?
It's as dependable or undependable as any other Chrysler product. If you want dealer support and or low cost dependability, Chrysler is not even close to that nor have they even heard the two affore mentioned catagories.
Author:  mikey1273 [ Fri Oct 17, 2014 9:12 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Buying a CRD... is it worth it?
I have had mine for 5+ years. outside of breaks and normal car stuff mine has not been too much trouble until this year. I had to have a thermostat replaced at 55,000 and the serpentine belt tension-er needed replaced at 85,000. I had an enormous issue with an Advance auto part battery last winter. I have done all my oil changes on time per the manual with Rotella T6, changed filters, dif and trans fluid once. The Big Problem was in September the Transmission went out on the the way home from Vacation. No real warning signs at all, it just dropped out of gear on the turnpike towing my pop up. The shop it was towed to said that it was low in fluid, fluid was burnt, and I had no engagement in any gear. I was kind of forced to get a Jasper re-manufactured 545RFE trans. there was way they could tell why mine failed like that and no evidence of a leak. I still love my Jeep and I wouldn't trade it unless it was totaled in a crash or broke beyond my financial means to economically repair it.

that being said I want to stick with a small diesel truck/SUV for witch there is not any on sale in the US market currently
top of my wish list would be
Wrangler CRD two door
Toyota HiLux diesel quad cab

Both sold most places worldwide but here.
Author:  mass-hole [ Fri Oct 17, 2014 9:34 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Buying a CRD... is it worth it?
I got mine with 42000 miles last august and have been very happy with it. I have dropped in the ballpark of $1000 on it, mostly in preventative maintenance including a tune, Mishimoto CAC hoses, Weeks Elbow kit, AFE Filter, a yet to be installed lift pump, a yet to be installed Amsoil By-Pass Filter kit, and trailer wiring harness. I also am doing a Bi-Xenon retrofit which is taking forever, but I consider that extraneous since its not really a necessity the same way the other things are. So far I have not had a single problem other than a slow drain on my battery which I believe is due to the trailer wiring being incorrectly designed for later model year Liberty's. Oh and I believe my Thermostat has stopped functioning correctly. It currently has 63000 miles on it.

Also if you get lucky Mishimoto might have a fire sale on their hoses again. I dont know if it was an accident but a few months back the blue hoses were like $110 shipped on their website which is when I grabbed them.
Author:  DOC4444 [ Fri Oct 17, 2014 9:55 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Buying a CRD... is it worth it?
If you can get low enough mileage so there are no HG issues YET, you can just do ARPS and hopefully avoid that whole mess.

DOC
Author:  flash7210 [ Fri Oct 17, 2014 12:40 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Buying a CRD... is it worth it?
I've got almost 150K miles on mine.
No major issues, just normal maintenance.

This forum does make me paranoid sometimes...

I put off replacing my glow plugs for over six months out of fear that they would break and get stuck in the head. But once I finally took a deep breath and jumped in, all four came out clean without no evidence of damage.

Now, its like I'm waiting for the head gasket to start leaking, but no evidence YET!
Author:  geordi [ Fri Oct 17, 2014 1:53 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Buying a CRD... is it worth it?
Forget about the head gasket if it isn't leaking already - Just replace the crap bolts with ARP studs and you won't ever need to worry about the head gasket.

Rockers might be worth doing at that time, but I haven't seen where they are a huge wear issue, just a pain to get to.

Thermostat - The in-hose thermostat has been solid from everyone I've read about using it, and it is a $8 part and one extra hose clamp. Can't beat that with a stick!

Transmission - If it ain't broke, don't fix it. You might need to do that, but you just as likely might not. Dropping the money on a Suncoast is silly, the Euro converter is a fine option. I got a don't-think-it-had-a-name brand from my local transmission shop for $100, did that twice on my CRD when I had the thing being worked on and it was easy to do.

TIMING BELT!
TIMING BELT TIMING BELT TIMING BELT.

I don't care WHAT the mileage is! If that belt hasn't been replaced, GET IT OUT NOW! That rubber belt is AT LEAST EIGHT YEARS OLD NOW! You are running on borrowed time with ANY jeep CRD that has ANY amount of miles. For the new belts, I have been putting 5 years or 100k miles on the stickers under the hood. If you happen to come on any that I have worked on, the sticker is on the radiator crossmember right by the airbox. I put them in the same spot on each CRD.

If they don't have that yellow sticker, then THEY DON'T HAVE PROOF for you. Factor that in to any price negotiations, and don't forget to price your time in too. Never show your hand in purchasing a car, they don't know you are a mechanic, and you shouldn't tell them.

Very best of luck in finding your CRD, it certainly sounds like you have done your research and haven't been scared off... This might be a good ride for you. Just keep a spare car around for the times it isn't. :)
Author:  MFRYTX [ Fri Oct 24, 2014 8:59 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Buying a CRD... is it worth it?
Speaking of timing belts...we now have a 2005 CRD lawn ornament. Not sure why it went @ 85k but as you point out the rubber is 9 years old. Low engine oil might have contributed to it. So now comes the hard part. Do we stay or do we go?? Sell it or repair it? I'm a decent shade tree mechanic so my question, is this a job for someone with a full time job? Haven't opened It up so not sure how bad. A new engine installed is $10k, used $7.5k. Would drive it another 10 years but based on what I've read it sounds like just the beginning. Would we be better off to cut and run?
Author:  Greenwing7 [ Sat Oct 25, 2014 1:08 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Buying a CRD... is it worth it?
I love my crd to death but if I had to do it all over again I would get the 2008 Grand Cherokee CRD with quadradrive 2 and a hot tune from GDE. It's slightly more serviceable by a mechanic than the VM 2.8. But I sure do love 30+mpg cruising long range with REAL 4x4.
Author:  79wolf [ Wed Nov 12, 2014 1:20 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Buying a CRD... is it worth it?
Thanks to all for the help, except vtdog (wife didn't go for it). A decision was made, mostly because of all the help available on this site, and I have a 2 hour drive home with blue 05 crd limited with all options except nav, but did come with 2 sets of wheels and a predator module (soon to be replaced). Best news is that at 126,xxx miles it has documented dealership timing belt replacement at 109,xxx and mishimoto hoses. A funny note is that I pointed out that the maf was unplugged and the owner never noticed it before, so at least it has been unplugged through the two previous owners :BANANA: Much more to come once I start digging into her and decide where to spend more money. Thanks again. I'm now in your care.
Author:  geordi [ Thu Nov 13, 2014 4:19 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Buying a CRD... is it worth it?
Welcome to the group. The coffee sucks, but the meetings smell of diesel fumes. :P


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk HD
Author:  papaindigo [ Thu Nov 13, 2014 5:02 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Buying a CRD... is it worth it?
If the MAF was unplugged IIRC that should pop a MIL/CEL on the dash. If not check to make sure that light is working; it should light up briefly at startup. If not report back.
Author:  79wolf [ Wed Nov 19, 2014 1:59 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Buying a CRD... is it worth it?
papaindigo wrote:
If the MAF was unplugged IIRC that should pop a MIL/CEL on the dash. If not check to make sure that light is working; it should light up briefly at startup. If not report back.


the light has been on the whole time ive had it, but GDE scan tool should arrive tomorrow. Only put a couple hundred miles on it so far, no issues thankfully, other than the wife wanting a muffler put back on (bought it with straight pipe). Today though it seemed to start slamming hard into third gear. Hopefully going to finally get a day tomorrow to really dig into it. I'm hoping this will be a steady project I can keep up on and share with everyone as they have shared with me. Thanks again! :JEEPIN:
Author:  dirtmover [ Wed Nov 19, 2014 9:05 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Buying a CRD... is it worth it?
79wolf wrote:
the light has been on the whole time ive had it, but GDE scan tool should arrive tomorrow. Only put a couple hundred miles on it so far, no issues thankfully, other than the wife wanting a muffler put back on (bought it with straight pipe). Today though it seemed to start slamming hard into third gear. Hopefully going to finally get a day tomorrow to really dig into it. I'm hoping this will be a steady project I can keep up on and share with everyone as they have shared with me. Thanks again! :JEEPIN:


Wow, you bought it with the CEL on without knowing what codes were present? You must either be barking mad or got a really good deal.

Good luck!
Author:  flash7210 [ Wed Nov 19, 2014 9:57 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Buying a CRD... is it worth it?
The hard 2-3 shift is a known problem with this transmission. Usually only happens at light throttle below 20 mph. As far as I know no one has found a fix for it.
Check the fluid level. It's ok to overfill it as much as half a quart.
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