LOST JEEPS
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well I'm vexed
http://www.lostjeeps.com/forum/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=5&t=80998		 Page 1 of 2
Author:  highironcrd [ Thu Jan 01, 2015 11:37 am ]
Post subject:  well I'm vexed
anybody want to buy this libby?pampered got all service receipts,misfire problem ,.....cant figure it out,will trade for old rusty wrenches and used motor oil :(
Author:  ArmyChief [ Thu Jan 01, 2015 11:52 am ]
Post subject:  Re: well I'm vexed
Well that was quick and gave up.

Post pics, pricing, mileage..etc
Author:  jws84_02 [ Thu Jan 01, 2015 12:04 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: well I'm vexed
Lucky you. I have 5 gallon buckets of used oil. How much you want?
Author:  highironcrd [ Thu Jan 01, 2015 12:07 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: well I'm vexed
ArmyChief wrote:
Well that was quick and gave up.

Post pics, pricing, mileage..etc

yes i know,:/ I'm venting,....im still mad because i missed my weekend with my son, got underneath and checked tank connections and they are bone dry
Author:  ArmyChief [ Thu Jan 01, 2015 12:11 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: well I'm vexed
highironcrd wrote:
ArmyChief wrote:
Well that was quick and gave up.

Post pics, pricing, mileage..etc

yes i know,:/ I'm venting,....im still mad because i missed my weekend with my son, got underneath and checked tank connections and they are bone dry


Your fuel system works on a SLIGHT vacuum from tank to HPFP. You will NOT typically see a fuel leak for a leak.
Author:  highironcrd [ Thu Jan 01, 2015 12:18 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: well I'm vexed
ArmyChief wrote:
highironcrd wrote:
ArmyChief wrote:
Well that was quick and gave up.

Post pics, pricing, mileage..etc

yes i know,:/ I'm venting,....im still mad because i missed my weekend with my son, got underneath and checked tank connections and they are bone dry


Your fuel system works on a SLIGHT vacuum from tank to HPFP. You will NOT typically see a fuel leak for a leak.

I'm almost wondering if i wrap it in duct tape would that at least provide a diagnostic
Author:  jws84_02 [ Thu Jan 01, 2015 12:30 pm ]
Post subject:  well I'm vexed
There typically won't be any signs of a "fuel leak". Vacuum pressure causes air to be sucked in through the worn out fittings above the tank
Author:  gmctd [ Thu Jan 01, 2015 12:56 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: well I'm vexed
Fuel is way denser than air
- a tremendous air leak will seldom show any wet
- ur lift pump is inside the CP3 injection pump
- the entire fuel delivery system from tank to lift pump is therefore under a slight vacuum = no wet spots with engine bucking and hesitating
- be glad - be very glad - the plastic fuel lines show no wet
Author:  highironcrd [ Thu Jan 01, 2015 1:02 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: well I'm vexed
gmctd wrote:
Fuel is way denser than air - a tremendous air leak will seldom show any wet - ur lift pump is in the CP3 injection pump - the entire fuel delivery system from tank to lift pump is therefore under a slight vacuum = no wet spots with engine bucking and hesitating - be glad - be very glad - the plastic fuel lines show no wet

yupyup! understood i did find the larger connector off the tank has play,.possible culprit as its nyday i just wrapped it in duct tape for now,.till i can order new connectors,wish me luck!
Author:  jws84_02 [ Thu Jan 01, 2015 1:08 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: well I'm vexed
Might as well drop the tank and replace with high grade fuel line and since your in that far put an in tank lift pump in. Don't try to heal a big cut that requires stitches with a band-aid
Author:  gmctd [ Thu Jan 01, 2015 1:14 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: well I'm vexed
Hold on, there, pilgrim - those connectors are o'ringed, so wiggle\play\looseness is not usually a problem
- new connector is likely to show equal looseness
- o'rings work best in pressurized systems (JEEP's bad, eh)
- best vacuum-system fuel line repair is to cut the oem connectors out, replace with rubber fuel hose and ss screw-type hose clamps
- the small 1/4"-wide ones for fuel hose, not the larger 3/8"and 1/2"-wide ones for heater hose
- this to retain the oem factory fuel delivery system, with new and improved (really!) fuel filter\manager head

Best overall repair is to install auxilliary electric lift pump (doesn't usually require fuel connector repair because they would then be under as-designed pressure, rather than vacuum [again, JEEP's bad!]),
- again, with new and improved (really!) fuel filter\manager head
- many respective threads on this forum (with pics for those that cannot read), ur choice
Author:  WWDiesel [ Thu Jan 01, 2015 2:19 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: well I'm vexed
Listen to the good advise being given by members herein! :wink:
Absolutely one of the best mods I ever done to my Jeep CDR. (i.e. installing a Carter in tank fuel lift pump) :pepper:
Author:  flman [ Thu Jan 01, 2015 4:53 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: well I'm vexed
Even an inline under the hood lift pump has worked well on both my Jeeps, the hot tuned one used to always get the large fuel leak error when ever I hammered it, no problem since the lift pump.

And the clear filter will show any air bubble, which of have yet to see on either jeep.

Image
Author:  highironcrd [ Sun Jan 04, 2015 11:21 am ]
Post subject:  Re: well I'm vexed
gmctd wrote:
Hold on, there, pilgrim - those connectors are o'ringed, so wiggle\play\looseness is not usually a problem - new one is likely to show equal looseness - o'rings work best in pressurized systems (JEEP's bad, eh) - best vacuum-system fuel line repair is to cut the connectors out, replace with rubber fuel hose and ss screw-type hose clamps - the small 1/4"-wide ones for fuel hose, not the larger 3/8"and 1/2"-wide ones for heater hose - this to retain the oem factory fuel delivery system, with new and improved (really!) fuel filter\manager head

Best overall repair is to install auxilliary electric lift pump (doesn't usually require fuel connector repair because they would then be under as-designed pressure, rather than vacuum [again, JEEP's bad!]), again with new and improved (really!) fuel filter\manager head
- many respective threads on this forum (with pics for those that cannot read), ur choice

yea guys the duct tape worked great but it failed as i was coming home,took it to my mechanic and he handles those fitting for gas cars,not too many deasls,he swears they are good to go, he thinks i threw an injector, but man I've been purging air out like crazy, till the problem is fixed i just can't drive it, i did have a weasel mechanic turns out he's screwed up, actually changed my timing belt with replacing water pump,and didn't change the oil after timing belt change, 1100 dollar mistake, .......im a lil bummed right now ,feel like I'm tail chasing , might as well start from the beginning :/
Author:  ArmyChief [ Sun Jan 04, 2015 11:33 am ]
Post subject:  Re: well I'm vexed
highironcrd wrote:
yea guys the duct tape worked great but it failed as I was coming home. Took it to my mechanic and he handles those fitting for gas cars, not too many diesels, he swears they are good to go, he thinks I threw an injector, but man I've been purging air out like crazy


Whoa, wait a minute. The duct tape worked fine for a while (Which would TYPICALLY indicate the air leak was at the spot of repair). However YOUR ace mechanic says the fittings are GTG AND you NEED an injector? Hope you were wearing your sneakers!...RUN


highironcrd wrote:
I did have a weasel mechanic, turns out he's screwed up, actually changed my timing belt with replacing water pump,and didn't change the oil after timing belt change, 1100 dollar mistake


Um, how does not changing the oil after a Timing Belt job affect the engine?
Author:  jrsavoie [ Sun Jan 04, 2015 11:45 am ]
Post subject:  Re: well I'm vexed
flman wrote:
Even an inline under the hood lift pump has worked well on both my Jeeps, the hot tuned one used to always get the large fuel leak error when ever I hammered it, no problem since the lift pump.

And the clear filter will show any air bubble, which of have yet to see on either jeep.

Image


Make sure it is a flow through on fail lift pump. otherwise if the lift pump dies you will be dead in the water for sure.

I've never looked, is there a good place to mount an inline lift pump by the tank? I like the Ac Delco's for a 1993 GM 6.5 diesel. I know that pump is a flow through. Dorman has fittings to screw into that pump.

It would also be fairly easy to access the wiring from under the seat back there, If there is a good place to mount an inline.
Author:  papaindigo [ Sun Jan 04, 2015 11:50 am ]
Post subject:  Re: well I'm vexed
One near tank option at http://liberty.eurekaboy.com/kennedy.htm
Author:  gmctd [ Sun Jan 04, 2015 11:54 am ]
Post subject:  Re: well I'm vexed
highironcrd wrote:
gmctd wrote:
Hold on, there, pilgrim - those connectors are o'ringed, so wiggle\play\looseness is not usually a problem - new one is likely to show equal looseness - o'rings work best in pressurized systems (JEEP's bad, eh) - best vacuum-system fuel line repair is to cut the connectors out, replace with rubber fuel hose and ss screw-type hose clamps - the small 1/4"-wide ones for fuel hose, not the larger 3/8"and 1/2"-wide ones for heater hose - this to retain the oem factory fuel delivery system, with new and improved (really!) fuel filter\manager head

Best overall repair is to install auxilliary electric lift pump (doesn't usually require fuel connector repair because they would then be under as-designed pressure, rather than vacuum [again, JEEP's bad!]), again with new and improved (really!) fuel filter\manager head
- many respective threads on this forum (with pics for those that cannot read), ur choice

yea guys the duct tape worked great but it failed as i was coming home,took it to my mechanic and he handles those fitting for gas cars,not too many deasls,he swears they are good to go, he thinks i threw an injector, but man I've been purging air out like crazy, till the problem is fixed i just can't drive it, i did have a weasel mechanic turns out he's screwed up, actually changed my timing belt with replacing water pump,and didn't change the oil after timing belt change, 1100 dollar mistake, .......im a lil bummed right now ,feel like I'm tail chasing , might as well start from the beginning :/

Don't see any indication that you've replaced the oem leaky fuel filter\manager head
- that is the usual first source for air leaks, some visible some not
- f'rinstnce, the primer plunger-shaft can leak lots of air and you may or may not see wet
- the fuel heater can leak air and you will see wet, dripping fuel : "Danger, Will Robinson! Danger!"
- fuel in the filter cannister drains back to the tank because the head is higher than the tank
- drain-back can and does happen when vehicle is being driven
= bucking - priming - missing - priming - hesitation - priming - frustration - contribute to weasel's welfare fund - frustration - trade KJ for bucket of used oil
Author:  highironcrd [ Sun Jan 04, 2015 2:07 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: well I'm vexed
gmctd wrote:
highironcrd wrote:
gmctd wrote:
Hold on, there, pilgrim - those connectors are o'ringed, so wiggle\play\looseness is not usually a problem - new one is likely to show equal looseness - o'rings work best in pressurized systems (JEEP's bad, eh) - best vacuum-system fuel line repair is to cut the connectors out, replace with rubber fuel hose and ss screw-type hose clamps - the small 1/4"-wide ones for fuel hose, not the larger 3/8"and 1/2"-wide ones for heater hose - this to retain the oem factory fuel delivery system, with new and improved (really!) fuel filter\manager head

Best overall repair is to install auxilliary electric lift pump (doesn't usually require fuel connector repair because they would then be under as-designed pressure, rather than vacuum [again, JEEP's bad!]), again with new and improved (really!) fuel filter\manager head
- many respective threads on this forum (with pics for those that cannot read), ur choice

yea guys the duct tape worked great but it failed as i was coming home,took it to my mechanic and he handles those fitting for gas cars,not too many deasls,he swears they are good to go, he thinks i threw an injector, but man I've been purging air out like crazy, till the problem is fixed i just can't drive it, i did have a weasel mechanic turns out he's screwed up, actually changed my timing belt with replacing water pump,and didn't change the oil after timing belt change, 1100 dollar mistake, .......im a lil bummed right now ,feel like I'm tail chasing , might as well start from the beginning :/

Don't see any indication that you've replaced the oem leaky fuel filter\manager head
- that is the usual first source for air leaks, some visible some not
- f'rinstnce, the primer plunger-shaft can leak lots of air and you may or may not see wet
- the fuel heater can leak air and you will see wet, dripping fuel
- fuel in the filter cannister drains back to the tank because the head is higher than the tank
- drain-back can and does happen when vehicle is being driven
= bucking - priming - missing - priming - hesitation - priming - frustration - contribute to weasel's welfare fund - frustration - trade KJ for bucket of used oil

lol man you made me smile,yes the weasel i meant to say he did timing belt,but did not replace water pump,:(,i really do want to keep my libby i do love it just gotta put the work in it, i does have a new oem filter just over a year old,.its got the bright blue heater snap in,.i just picked it up from mechanic ,not 1 hiccup on the way home but now i question reliability till i can in stall a new recommended filter,.as well as replace the fittings at the tank
Author:  gmctd [ Sun Jan 04, 2015 2:42 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: well I'm vexed
Ok
- FYI, majority of gasoline-fueled vehicles have in-tank lift pump, so the fuel lines are pressurized between tank and filter and injection system - pressure compresses and expands o'rings for excellent seal
- again, KJ is vacuum, or 'draw-from-tank' system, so o'rings are not as functional because vacuum causes them to contract and shrink and leak air -

Just to be sure we're on same page, I am referring to the new improved upgraded fuel filter head, the cast-aluminum part bolted to the firewall
- the original as-equipped oem version is the leaker
- new fuel filter element\cannister won't help

Fuel manager head should be replaced first due to potential fire hazard - then address tank-connections if leaks continue
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